|
|
01-27-2020, 01:39 PM
|
#1
|
Moderator
2015 25' FB Flying Cloud
2012 23' FB Flying Cloud
2005 25' Safari
Santa Rosa Beach
, Florida
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 13,159
|
The Great Tow Vehicle Dilemma
I well know that these are fighting words, but I will bring forth this question anyway. I would ask that the responses be civil and contain actual real information, likes and dislikes not with standing.
Lucy's current towing partner (Lillian) is a 2018 Chevrolet Silverado LTZ Duramax, Crew Cab, Standard Bed, Single Rear Wheel.
I have decided to consider replacing Lillian with a similar new vehicle. I am interested in upgrading to a 2020 because of the availability of the new electronic gizmos and multiple cameras. I will freely admit that this is a want thing more than a need thing.
My new tow vehicle must be at least q 3/4 ton, powered by a diesel engine. I have not shopped Toyota or Nissan because they have no offerings in this category.
I have done quite a bit of research and pricing on the Ford, Chevrolet, and Ram offerings. I priced each one at a higher trim level and all of the options that I wanted. These trucks cost a lot of money, and I did realize that going in.
Here are the price results of my research. I will use round figures for the MSRP of each one. I tried as much as possible to make the trim levels comparable.
Ford Lariat King Ranch: $77,000
Chevrolet Silverado LZT: $74,000
Ram Laramie Longhorn: $78,000
I am assuming that I can get a similar deal on each of these. The prices are similar enough that I would consider all of them for the right reason or feature.
I would like to get some input from the group on the reasons that I should consider one over the others.
Brian
__________________
SuEllyn & Brian McCabe
WBCCI #3628 -- AIR #14872 -- TAC #FL-7
2015 FC 25' FB (Lucy) with ProPride
2020 Silverado 2500 (Vivian)
2023 Rivian R1T (Opal)
|
|
|
01-27-2020, 01:56 PM
|
#2
|
Rivet Master
2019 28' Flying Cloud
2014 22' FB Sport
Davie
, FL
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 904
|
The RAM Cummins straight 6 engine has an excellent reputation. Its a small truck/industrial engine while the V-8's in the other two are large car engine.
My wife loved the RAM interior.
|
|
|
01-27-2020, 01:57 PM
|
#3
|
Rivet Master
2018 27' International
Southeastern MI
, Michigan
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 2,344
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by moosetags
I well know that these are fighting words, but I will bring forth this question anyway. I would ask that the responses be civil and contain actual real information, likes and dislikes not with standing.
Lucy's current towing partner (Lillian) is a 2018 Chevrolet Silverado LTZ Duramax, Crew Cab, Standard Bed, Single Rear Wheel.
I have decided to consider replacing Lillian with a similar new vehicle. I am interested in upgrading to a 2020 because of the availability of the new electronic gizmos and multiple cameras. I will freely admit that this is a want thing more than a need thing.
My new tow vehicle must be at least q 3/4 ton, powered by a diesel engine. I have not shopped Toyota or Nissan because they have no offerings in this category.
I have done quite a bit of research and pricing on the Ford, Chevrolet, and Ram offerings. I priced each one at a higher trim level and all of the options that I wanted. These trucks cost a lot of money, and I did realize that going in.
Here are the price results of my research. I will use round figures for the MSRP of each one. I tried as much as possible to make the trim levels comparable.
Ford Lariat King Ranch: $77,000
Chevrolet Silverado LZT: $74,000
Ram Laramie Longhorn: $78,000
I am assuming that I can get a similar deal on each of these. The prices are similar enough that I would consider all of them for the right reason or feature.
I would like to get some input from the group on the reasons that I should consider one over the others.
Brian
|
I have a Ram CTD. I assume you want a diesel.
Go with the Ford. Most horsepower and torque. All 3 are really nice trucks.
|
|
|
01-27-2020, 02:13 PM
|
#4
|
Rivet Master
2018 27' Globetrotter
Apollo Beach
, Florida
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,401
|
I own a Ford F250 and would probably buy another. But I think you may miss your ride quality from the GM's independent front suspension. When I test drove all three options, I liked the ride of the GMC Denali the best, but my wife liked the seats in the Ford Platinum the best. Guess which one we bought?
Another thing about the Ford. There are only rear audible sensors (beepers). I expected all-around audible sensors on an $80,000 truck with the all-around cameras. I didn't realize it didn't have them until after buying. Make sure you check for that option on all of them if that is of interest. My Titan XD Diesel had both all-around cameras with all-around beepers. The beepers saved me from bumping into things as much as the cameras. I miss my beepers.
Its probably more civil to critique your own truck than to critique the ones you don't own. Just saying . . .
__________________
2021 Northern-Lite 10-2 & F350 DRW PSD, 600W Solar/Victron/600A BattleBorn
146 nights 31,000 miles (first 10 months!)
Sold: 2018 GT27Q, 74 nights 12,777 miles
Sold: 2017 FC25FB, 316 nights 40,150 miles
Sold: 2013 Casita SD17 89 nights 16,200 miles
|
|
|
01-27-2020, 02:24 PM
|
#5
|
Rivet Master
2021 25' Globetrotter
Jamestown
, Rhode Island
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 1,720
|
Having spent my working life in the business of maintaining and repairing European autos, I always look at just how difficult repairs are to perform. I am sure that you can get a good or bad version of any of these trucks but... watch a couple of videos of the V8 diesels getting say a fuel pump replaced...
All I can say is WOW!
I owned a 2016 Ram 2500 for about 3 1/2 years and just 60,000 miles and it was almost perfect. The only warranty repair was to a drivers door handle that was funny when delivered.
That truck, the previous generation, had the smallest turning radius of the three brands you mentioned and mine had the Ram Box option that I loved but some would pass over preferring a truck cap.
The Ram diesel is a Cummins engine that is used in military boating applications, it is that good.
The V8 engines used in the others are very smooth and sound great.
That is all I have...
__________________
Loving our 2021 Globetrotter 25 and our 2022 Ford F-150 King Ranch 5.0!!! Plenty of payload, not even close to axel limits and it drives and rows beautifully…
|
|
|
01-27-2020, 04:00 PM
|
#6
|
3 Rivet Member
2019 25' Flying Cloud
Bullard,Lake Palestine
, Texas
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 220
|
tv
__________________
I always keep a supply of stimulant handy in case I see a snake ......which I also keep handy
|
|
|
01-27-2020, 04:32 PM
|
#7
|
3 Rivet Member
2019 27' Flying Cloud
Box Elder
, South Dakota
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 178
|
We owned a 2004 Dodge Ram diesel 4x4 until last year. We loved it. We assumed we would buy another Ram, because in 2004, it won me over completely and never let us down. It felt good, looked good, sounded good, and had an amazing turning radius. But last year we drove both a Ram 3500 and a Ford f350, and it was as if the tables had completely turned - except for the turning radius, where the Ram still won. The Ford feels better to drive. The interior seems nicer. It's quiet, both inside and out. I knew within 5 minutes and 5 miles of driving the Ram that everything I loved about our 2004 was gone. We went with the Ford F350 Lariet supercab long bed diesel 4x4.
(His name is Fezzik, because he IS the Brute Squad.)
__________________
2019 Flying Cloud 27fb twin
Full-timing with one husband, one cat.
|
|
|
01-27-2020, 05:26 PM
|
#8
|
Rivet Master
2020 28' Flying Cloud
2017 23' Flying Cloud
Hiawassee
, Georgia
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 1,415
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce B
Having spent my working life in the business of maintaining and repairing European autos, I always look at just how difficult repairs are to perform. I am sure that you can get a good or bad version of any of these trucks but... watch a couple of videos of the V8 diesels getting say a fuel pump replaced...
All I can say is WOW!
I owned a 2016 Ram 2500 for about 3 1/2 years and just 60,000 miles and it was almost perfect. The only warranty repair was to a drivers door handle that was funny when delivered.
That truck, the previous generation, had the smallest turning radius of the three brands you mentioned and mine had the Ram Box option that I loved but some would pass over preferring a truck cap.
The Ram diesel is a Cummins engine that is used in military boating applications, it is that good.
The V8 engines used in the others are very smooth and sound great.
That is all I have...
|
I believe the Cummins engine in the new Ram is using the same Bosch CP4.2 fuel pump as the Ford Powerstroke. GM just changed to a new Denso fuel system. Jury is out on that system. May turn out to be very good.
|
|
|
01-27-2020, 05:43 PM
|
#9
|
Rivet Master
2020 28' Flying Cloud
2017 23' Flying Cloud
Hiawassee
, Georgia
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 1,415
|
I have a 2019 F350 diesel.4x4.. CrewCab, regular bed. Lariat Ultimate package.
Only had it for a few months & 6000 miles but we love it so far.
Tows great and has 3400 lb payload.
Has cameras all around and will show you an image as if from a viewpoint 10 feet above the truck. Shows all obstacles and Helps you in tight spots. It’ll also show you a rear view along both sides of the trailer when backing up.
I saw a GM commercial that incorporates the trailer rear view camera and shows you an image as if you’re looking through an invisible trailer when backing up.
My wife insisted on Air Conditioned seats. I laughed, but this summer I’ll probably be addicted to that feature.
There seems to be no end to the cool features you can get, it just depends what you want most.
The only knock on our 2019 F350 is the height. Not an issue for me but wife really has to climb up. I like the height cause it makes it easier to reach the water separator drain underneath ��. The 2020 Super Duty is supposed to be lower in height, however.
FWIW Consumer Reports gave the Ford Super Duty truck’s higher reliability ratings than Ram or GM at the time. YMMV
|
|
|
01-27-2020, 05:47 PM
|
#10
|
Rivet Master
2012 27' Flying Cloud
W
, New England
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 7,402
|
Hey Brian - I’m not in the market myself (still chugging along with my 2013 Chevy diesel) but a guy I work with bought a 2019 Ram and if I was in the market today - I’d go with a 2020 Ram 2500. Amazing tech, gorgeous interior, plenty of power with all those creature comforts. They also have a 4 door extended cab with tons of space for passengers AND gear. I haven’t heard a 2500 - his is a 1500 gasser so that’s naturally very quiet.
Good luck in your search!
|
|
|
01-27-2020, 05:49 PM
|
#11
|
Site Team
2009 25' FB International
2018 27' Globetrotter
Tavares
, Florida
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 3,723
|
I purchased a 2019 RAM 2500 Limited with a Cummins after taking a look at all of them. Each make has pros and cons. We thought the interior was nicer on the RAM. The GM was inferior in this area. Ford has massaging seats. None of the others have that feature.
I thought the RAM diesel was quieter, especially on the highway, than the Ford. And we absolutely love the RamBoxes available only on the RAM, of course.
And I agree with your comment about the safety features. Adaptive cruise control, cameras all over, crash avoidance technology. Very nice features to have!
You can hardly go wrong with any of them. It may depend on which dealer you happen to like.
Wishing you well in your search and keep us posted on your final choice.
|
|
|
01-27-2020, 05:51 PM
|
#12
|
Half a Rivet Short
2017 30' Classic
2022 Interstate 24X
Carlisle
, Pennsylvania
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 15,738
|
Hi
Have a F250, like it, would get another. The 2020's have a new transmission. That can be good / bad depending on how it works out. They also have several things as standard (lane departure warning) that were optional back in 2017.
The one thing I would think a bit on is the F350. Money wise there isn't much cost. The payload bump might make sense.
Bob
|
|
|
01-27-2020, 06:31 PM
|
#13
|
Lost in America
2015 27' FB International
2006 25' Safari FB SE
2004 19' International CCD
Santa Fe
, New Mexico
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 2,155
|
I think all three make a decent truck. The pros and cons are minor or just personal taste. What I don't like is deleting $70K+ from by savings account. So I prefer to make the best deal I can and then take the 0% financing deal. Ram and Chevy are usually the first ones to make the offer with Ford & GMC waiting till the end of the sales year at end of summer. Your choice...
__________________
This is the strangest life I've ever known - J. Morrison
2015 Airstream International Serenity 27FB
2017 Chevy Silverado 2500HD Duramax Diesel
|
|
|
01-27-2020, 06:46 PM
|
#14
|
Rivet Master
2019 27' Globetrotter
McHenry
, Illinois
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 2,202
|
Consider the RAM
Brian, we also have a 2019 RAM 2500 like Hans627 but with the 6.4 Hemi. Ours is a Laramie, a trim level down but it does have the Level 2 Interior package, Safety Group and Tow Technology package.
We did a 2500 mile trip last August to Rocky Mountain National Park towing our 2019 27’ Globetrotter with no complaints. It had plenty of power (now with the 8 spd trans) and towed like a dream. I don’t think you would be disappointed with the RAM in any flavor!
__________________
2019 27’ Globetrotter FBT Walnut/Dublin Slate
2018 FC23FB
2019 Ram 2500 6.4 Hemi Laramie Blue Ox 1000#
WBCCI# 10258
RETIRED!
|
|
|
01-27-2020, 07:36 PM
|
#15
|
Rivet Master
2019 27' Globetrotter
McHenry
, Illinois
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 2,202
|
One more thing... There’s a thread on the HDRAM Forum about towing with the 6.4 that’s good for reference. This guys pulling a 5th Wheel and very happy. Other bonus is the 6.4 is about $10K less and around 900 lbs. more payload. Our 2500 has 2940 lbs.
Here’s the link: https://hdrams.com/forum/index.php?t....286/post-7860
__________________
2019 27’ Globetrotter FBT Walnut/Dublin Slate
2018 FC23FB
2019 Ram 2500 6.4 Hemi Laramie Blue Ox 1000#
WBCCI# 10258
RETIRED!
|
|
|
01-27-2020, 07:54 PM
|
#16
|
Rivet Master
2021 25' Globetrotter
Jamestown
, Rhode Island
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 1,720
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by KK4YZ
I believe the Cummins engine in the new Ram is using the same Bosch CP4.2 fuel pump as the Ford Powerstroke. GM just changed to a new Denso fuel system. Jury is out on that system. May turn out to be very good.
|
I was not commenting on the pump design itself but rather what it takes to change one! The V8 diesels are so complex and compact that if you are unfortunate enough to need a major repair it is going to really hurt. The flat rate time for replacing the pump on the Ford is something like 18 hours. It is simply easier to get to things on the inline 6 design that the Cummins uses.
__________________
Loving our 2021 Globetrotter 25 and our 2022 Ford F-150 King Ranch 5.0!!! Plenty of payload, not even close to axel limits and it drives and rows beautifully…
|
|
|
01-27-2020, 08:55 PM
|
#17
|
3 Rivet Member
2015 25' Flying Cloud
Gainesville
, Florida
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 117
|
Got to love these TV threads - They are a hoot to read; Lots of great info and of course strong opinions. In another of these threads, someone posited that it was equivalent to arguing, "What is the best beer."
Many ways to slice this. Trading up for tech bells & whistles is a hard sell, but the newest crop really of trucks seems to have them in spades.
I believe diesel offers some really nice to have towing features (torque + exhaust brakes). But they come with a premium price tag. Diesel power makes for a poor daily drive because the back end exhaust treatment systems don't like short hop driving.
If you are going to pay a shop for maintenance, it really doesn't matter which diesel you buy. If you are going to do your own PM's then you have to look more carefully at the options. If you want torque/hp bragging rights you have to go with a 2019 or 2020. The honest question is does anyone really need those power levels to tow anything AS makes?
I have the luxury (sort of) to own a dedicated TV. My choice was a new left over (2018) Ram 3500 6.7 Cummins turbo CRD. Plenty of power, cargo capacity.
All the 19's & 20's except Duramax run CP4.2 HPFP's. I've dismantled and studied the pieces parts in a CP4.1 (ex VW) and would not want to run any vehicle that used a Bosch CP4.x HPFP. I freely admit this is a bias I've developed based on reading about a significant number of VW HPFP failures. It was disappointing to see Cummins jumping on the CP4.x bandwagon just after Duramax said, "Hell no".
Good luck with your choice. Run a lubricity additive and you'll probably do ok.
|
|
|
01-28-2020, 05:23 AM
|
#18
|
Rivet Master
2020 28' Flying Cloud
2017 23' Flying Cloud
Hiawassee
, Georgia
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 1,415
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce B
I was not commenting on the pump design itself but rather what it takes to change one! The V8 diesels are so complex and compact that if you are unfortunate enough to need a major repair it is going to really hurt. The flat rate time for replacing the pump on the Ford is something like 18 hours. It is simply easier to get to things on the inline 6 design that the Cummins uses.
|
I’m sure that’s true...but replacing the pump and down line components on either truck will be pretty expensive. All three of these engines produce a lot of power and torque. To do that the fuel rail pressures are crazy high, like 30K PSI or more. The HPFP relies on the diesel fuel for lubrication and The Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel fuel doesn’t have much lubricity.
The fuel system on all these high performance Diesel engines really has to be Cared for. Use a lubricity additive and drain the water separator once / month and it’s likely a moot point.
I once heard a light hearted comment that the perfect diesel truck would have the Cummins engine (RAM), the Allison transmission (GM), and the Ford body/chassis
|
|
|
01-28-2020, 06:38 AM
|
#19
|
Rivet Master
2018 28' International
Fayetteville
, Georgia
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 829
|
I have a 2018 F250 diesel, so that is my bias. The good news is all are good trucks. No bad decisions.
__________________
brick
2018 International Serenity
Cute wife...
|
|
|
01-28-2020, 06:43 AM
|
#20
|
Rivet Master
2015 30' Classic
Decatur
, Illinois
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 691
|
I would buy the truck that has the best and biggest service department where you live. Ford sells more trucks than anybody
|
|
|
|
|
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
|
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
|
Recent Discussions |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|