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Old 02-01-2010, 02:11 PM   #29
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You can pay now or pay later. Safety for yourself and others on the road is priceless. Consider a proper TV to do the job safely.
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Old 02-01-2010, 03:25 PM   #30
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I have been a Toyota truck owner for many, many years. I had an '85 Toyota longbed standard cab with a 22R that I pulled my 1961 Bambi 16' with in Iowa on the flats. It was almost adequate. I had a '94 extended cab Compact Truck with the 3.0L V6 that barely did ok towing a Burro 17' fiberglass trailer at 2500 lbs. The 3.4L V6 in my '97 T100 did much better than the 3.0L with the Burro. I towed a Bigfoot 17' at 3300 lbs with my '02 Tundra 4WD auto extended cab with the 3.4L V6. It was almost adequate.

I now have an '07 Titan with the 5.6L V8 that I tow my Bigfoot 25 with at 5300 lbs dry. It is adequate.

The moral to this is that if you have a '61-'63 Bambi, you can get by with the 4cyl. Anything larger, don't do it. Find a Scamp 16' or Burro 17' or something similar. The truck won't be happy about them, but it'll do OK. A new 16' Airstream is a thousand pounds more than your truck will want to do, and a thousand pounds more than you can drive/maneuver/stop safely. Remember that moving the load forward is only part of towing. Maneuvering and stopping the rig is even more important than getting it rolling; especially so under emergency circumstances.

Roger

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Originally Posted by boutdoors View Post
Thanks again to everyone for the advise.

To answer a few questions. . .

My truck has a manual transmission.

Here is the math I am coming up with.
Truck curb = 3500
Trailer curb = 2897
Passengers = 350
Cargo = 350 (40lb lp, 10gallons H20@8.35lb = 83.5lb, clothes/food/gear @ 226.5lb)
Total GCW = 7097
Total Trailer Weight = 3247 (92%)

Tacoma Max Trailer Weight = 3500
Tacoma GCWR = 7400

I know 92% is a bit above the 80-85% rule. I don't know maybe I am just an stubborn optimist.
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Old 02-02-2010, 11:43 AM   #31
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Don't the trailer brakes, sway control and load distribution hitches all help with the maneuvering of the trailer? Isn't the main concern having a enough power to get out of a situation?
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Old 02-02-2010, 12:48 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boutdoors View Post
...Isn't the main concern having a enough power to get out of a situation?
no

Quote:
Originally Posted by boutdoors View Post
...Isn't the main concern having a enough power to get out of a situation?
again no.

folks often go 2 the hp/torque figures first (u appeared to NOT fall into this trap in the early posts)

power figures are easy to find and people in-vision going 10 mph up hill with steam rising from the hood...

which isn't likely to happen in your part of the world.

the MAIN concerns (imo) is how will the TV control the trailer...

in wind, traffic, rain, curves, poorly banked roads, panic stops, when a tire blows and so on...

then people focus on the towing RATINGs which are often very misleading, best case, different by country and widely open to interpretation...

when really it's all the little things and limits and gotchas and design issues that matter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by boutdoors View Post
Don't the trailer brakes, sway control and load distribution hitches all help with the maneuvering of the trailer?...
yes

1-clearly the trailer brakes matter, especially IF the tv brakes are small...

but braking can also INDUCE the rig (combo tv/trailer) into UNsettling movement.

2-unless one is considering the pp/haha rigging it's best to think of the other hitches as "sway delaying" contraptions...

they don't truly CONTROL sway, they dampen/delay it,

probably (primarily) helping the driver to NOT over react with steering input that makes things worse.

but HITCHES don't change the basic CAPACITY of the tow vehicle components...

and this combo will be at or OVER those published capacities, once loaded.

3-w/d gear can be used to RESTORE the tv front/steering axle to the UNhitched value...

think of it this way what ever the handling characteristics are for the vehicle in question...

adding HITCH mass to the back of a TV, generally has a NEGATIVE effect on the handling...

using w/d gets the tv back to BASELINE handling, but w/d doesn't improve the inherent TV handling OR capacity

((perhaps on some of the larger trucks that are UNDER loaded, towing does improve the ride/handling but big trucks are not the topic here))

however IF the tires/axles/springs/shocks/bushings/A arms and so on are at or OVER their ratings...

handling will SUFFER even with w/d gear in use and control may still be an issue.

which is why there was an early recommendation about basic things like TIRES on the tv...

tires adequate to the task and INFLATION of those tires matters a lot.

so does properly loading the trailer and keeping the trailer tires inflated...
__________

there isn't any background info but it would appear this will be your first rv/towing experience?

almost all of the advice and towing stories offered to this point have been sensible and NOT overly dramatic...

but IF you'd like the links to accidents/crashes/OHsh!ts/and parked/unused trailers, we can provide that too...

every driver/vehicle/trailer/camping/usage/money combination is somewhat unique...

and being a "stubborn optimist" adds another dimension to the mix...
___________

the suggestions to....

buy used, buy older/lighter/smaller, buy a popUP, small bubble, or tab sized trailer...

or get a tv BETTER suited for the task AFTER selecting the trayla...

are all sensible/wise/rational and SEASONED suggestions from folks who have BEEN THERE.

otoh, "just go for it, you'll be fine" is a lot easier to offer and swallow perhaps.

so stay within 30 miles of home, drive 40 mph and take almost nothing along and the combo will be adequate, barely...

but spending upwards of 30k $ for a trailer that can only be used in a limited way is such a waste.
__________

can the truck be IMPROVED, yes IF you understand what NEEDS to be tweaked,

but not without spending $$ that will not be recouped and it will still ultimately be...

a 4 banger, 4x4 truck, at the published capacities and perhaps over the limits WHEN the crap hits the fan...

that same UPgrade cash could be directed toward a tv with BETTER inherent abilities...
__________

most of us have NO vested financial or personal interests in discouraging your entry into rving, streaming and so on...

but we've also read/seen or experienced enough examples of overly stressed rigging to NOT wanna encourage that direction.

best of luck and happy camping!
2air'
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Old 02-03-2010, 06:45 AM   #33
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FYI Talked to one of the largest AS dealer in U.S. last night and said the Tacoma 4 Cyl. would be fine for the 16' sport.

Now, with that said, I am aware that they want to sell trailers, but would they jeopardize safety for sales?? Who knows.
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Old 02-03-2010, 06:59 AM   #34
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boutdoors-

Add another opinion against the 4cyl.

I towed a 3000# Airstream with a 2007 6cyl Tacoma and it was just adequate. I briefly towed a 5000# boat and, despite the 6500# fantasy tow rating, it was inadequate.

I can't imagine towing 3000# with a 4 cylinder.

The new Taco can handle it, but the gas mileage stinks.

I opted for a diesel.

John
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Old 02-03-2010, 07:57 AM   #35
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Then why do they rate the things at 3500#? Seems like a useless number and they should be rating them much lower.
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Old 02-03-2010, 08:18 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boutdoors View Post
FYI Talked to one of the largest AS dealer in U.S. last night and said the Tacoma 4 Cyl. would be fine for the 16' sport.

Now, with that said, I am aware that they want to sell trailers, but would they jeopardize safety for sales?? Who knows.
I don't know about the AS dealer you talked to, but I think that some of the RV salesmen here in Arizona graduated from the school of selling swampland in Florida.

p.s. At least you can be sure that the folks offering advice to you on this forum do not have a profit motive.
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Old 02-03-2010, 08:37 AM   #37
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Then why do they rate the things at 3500#? Seems like a useless number and they should be rating them much lower.
Yes...... Re tow rating lies:

Here was an article that explains... Towing claims may soon meet reality | Business | Chron.com - Houston Chronicle

After years of work SAE has now come up with reasonable standards for the bases of the "tow rating".
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Old 02-03-2010, 08:47 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boutdoors View Post
FYI Talked to one of the largest AS dealer in U.S. last night and said the Tacoma 4 Cyl. would be fine for the 16' sport.

Now, with that said, I am aware that they want to sell trailers, but would they jeopardize safety for sales?? Who knows.

Very often, when you talk to someone at an Airstream dealership, you are getting towing advice from someone who has never towed any kind of trailer in their life.

Brian
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Old 02-03-2010, 09:03 AM   #39
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Please keep in mind that All ratings whether they be weight related or capacities are MAX, under the best of circumstances.

A tank holds 20 gallons and not a drop more.

A TV tows 3500 lbs if you don't exceed the base TV capacities for weight and it's 75 degrees and 50% humidty and on level ground. Downhill they will move 20,000 lbs.

I think you can add a super charger from Toyota though for around $4 grand.
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Old 02-03-2010, 09:27 AM   #40
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Understanding where the rubber meets the road.

Tire width is a good thing when wider, more to help stabilize a side force but not good on water if less than adaquate tread is there, as in hydroplane woo hooo.

Many people get confused by all the sheet metal a truck or van has, it's just air encapsulated by metal. The real performance resides in the weight, torque and wheel track footprint. (I do like the looks of the new trucks though.)

I had a 40" deisel MH 07 model and crossed the Blue Ridge hills at 45 mph in the winter. I did pass tractor trailers with the same engines but they were towing 50 to 80,000 lbs over the hills.

Your Tacoma would be at maybe 25 huffin and puffin and below the minimum speed limit big time. Concider needing to pass someone in a timely manner for whatever reason on flat land and it'll do the same, NOT make it.

I did tow a trailer before deciding whether I could safely tow one. That one had a 4300 empty weight and I quickly decided 4,000 was MAX for my FJ Cruiser 4.0 V6 with 271 torque.

Add a hitch then go to a dealer and tow a heavier trailer near where you think you'll be (plus 300 lbs) and you'll get the idea.
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Old 02-03-2010, 10:11 AM   #41
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Isn't the main concern having a enough power to get out of a situation?
Power is a one of the aspects that needs to be considered. This comparison chart gives you a bit of an idea how various vehicles and engine sizes perform.

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Old 02-03-2010, 10:51 PM   #42
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Being that I have the 2006 Tacoma V-6 and 2003 Ford F250 both in my driveway now (and big insurance bill to match ;-) I must defend the Tacoma's towing capacity in some situations. This fall (pre-F250 days) I took the Tacoma and a 24' tandem axle car hauler with a steel bed, unloaded weight ~3500-4000#, out to a farm auction east of ABQ. We had to drive through the mts E of ABQ on I40, then out and north. We loaded a windmill tower, two large windmill heads/fans/etc, plus alot of tractor parts on the trailer. I'm guessing we were at around 5000# trailer+load. The Tacoma pulled it with no problem. Freeway merging and maintaining speed and braking wasn't an issue. (Have a Prodigy brake controller.) The trailer load was "low", and had no wind resistance.

The Airstreams are all around 10' tall, and 8' wide, and have a larger profile. Although my Sovereign is less weight than the windmill load, it feels quite abit different towing. The Tacoma has to work harder pulling the higher profile AS than the car trailer with a low-load. So I don't think the towing weight is the only thing to consider when looking at the overall setup.
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