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Old 09-29-2010, 06:20 PM   #29
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That fuel tank is a solution, but costs $1,184 and adds about 125 lbs. in gas and something more in extra tank weight. I might have considered that when I bought the truck 3 years ago if I had known about it, and Carl has a new truck, but his issue is payload, not gas capacity. It doesn't make sense for me now.

Unsui, you certainly did overload the Tundra, maybe by 500 or more lbs. I hope you didn't substantially wear the drive train or suspension.

Gene
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Old 09-29-2010, 07:52 PM   #30
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"No one ever complains they have too much truck."

I don't want to wade in too deep here, but;
there was an Airstream on Ebay this summer (2X's or more) that was being sold by a traveling preacher. His desc. said he towed it with a heavy duty truck and pics showed the damage it caused (which he pointed out).
Pulled rivets in the front windows and buckled panels with resulting structural and water damage.

Andy has preached about a heavy-duty TV. I tried to post the pics, but couldn't figure out how to do it.
Don't know if the AS sold, but until I saw those pics, I figured Andy was anal about these things. I'm thinking he's right.

Maybe a little more truck would be OK!

Bob

PS:
I'd love your Tundra!!
Bob
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Old 09-29-2010, 08:00 PM   #31
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"No one ever complains they have too much truck."
Not sure I'd want a 1 ton dually to pull a Bambi with out some kind of shock absorber but generally speaking I couldn't agree with you more.
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Old 09-29-2010, 09:30 PM   #32
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ALL - thanks for all your comments.....

I have attached some pdfs of my spreadsheets. My actual weighed numbers at the scales are: total gross with fuel but without me was 6180 lbs, front axle 3320, rear axle 2820. As you can see from my charts I am already over my guesses

GENE - your comments mirror where I am headed, its not that it wont go down the road, its whether I can feel some comfort in being a little under rather than over the specified numbers, and whether my personal loaded weight is anywhere near what I think it will be. The mystery remains if these toyota or airstream manf numbers have some kink in them related to unknown variable such as the stock tires.

UNSUI - If you ever weigh your vehicle, I would like to know what it is. If you have heavy propride hitch, full 46 gallon upgraded fuel tank, 30 gallons of additional fuel, generators, and the hitch load of a 30 ft trailer, - that number would be something to see, and a photo of your leaf springs...

I am thinking an airsafe to take up some of the suspension, a bigger truck, and more engine, and a bigger gas tank is starting to sound not so bad. The newer trucks maybe have a little better suspension than the older 3/4 tons of a few years ago - does anyone have a comment about airsafe and the newer 3/4 ton suspensions???
Attached Files
File Type: pdf chart post.pdf (63.5 KB, 41 views)
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Old 09-30-2010, 09:46 AM   #33
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Carl, in your first post on this thread you indicated one person with a lighter payload and the plan to travel to remote places.

Are you sure you're heading in the right direction? Would scaling things down, rather than up, meet your goals better?

Doug K
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Old 09-30-2010, 10:05 AM   #34
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Carl, I looked through your spreadsheet quickly and not thoroughly, but I am impressed with your thoroughness. We bring dumbbells too (and ankle weights), but not as heavy—the problem is actually using them. 200 lbs. of books seems like a lot—we are readers and bring a lot of travel books and other reading, but 200 lbs. seems like 3 to 5 boxes of books—that's more like a starter library. Maybe you are overestimating to make sure you catch it all.

My sloppy weight calculations aren't so different. The numbers from manufacturers differ making it more difficult. I think no matter how careful you are, another 100 lbs. will creep into the truck and maybe more into the trailer.

When you are close to the limit, the numbers from the manufacturers matter a lot and when you find they disagree, frustration starts to set in. Some post on the Forum that manufacturers lie and maximum weights aren't true. I think such a blanket statement is incorrect. Does Toyota lie? When I and others look at the way the Tundra is built, it appears to be overbuilt and perhaps they have a large margin of error. In the absence of our own multimillion dollar testing facility and qualified engineers, we are ultimately left to guessing.

Several years ago I took the Tundra to a scale—the only one in the county—and with gas and my wife and I, but no other cargo, the total weight was around the same as yours. It may have been a little less or more, but it's a while ago. We have a tonneau and running board, so those total a bit less than your options. I didn't have each axle weighed. Subsequently this scale closed and there's nowhere to go unless I drive 75 miles.

We also weighed the things we put in the trailer. Clothes aren't all that much, but food is. Because we eat healthy foods and they are not easy to find on the road, we bring a lot. And if there's a Trader Joe's in a town we go through, we stop and load up on even more. Pots, pans, plates—all that stuff also adds up. Tools, cleaning supplies, keep increasing and adding more. Assume a full fresh water tank and water heater (total 45 gal.), anywhere from 5 to 20 gallons in the black tank and some in grey water—that's maybe 600 lbs. It seemed like when we added it up it was tough to max out the trailer, but I haven't weighed it, possibly because when I can, I'm 75 miles from home and what am I going to do about it? We could go to the hospital there and have some amputations to reduce weight, but I don't think an arm and a leg each would be enough.

The increase in stated tongue weights by Airstream is disconcerting. I think in the end you guestimate and hope for the best. Buy the trailer you want and see how the Tundra does. Selling a new truck and getting a 3/4 ton is a mighty expensive trade.

Gene
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Old 09-30-2010, 10:48 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by carl28 View Post
I am thinking an airsafe to take up some of the suspension, a bigger truck, and more engine, and a bigger gas tank is starting to sound not so bad.
I am detecting a subtle message that you might actually want to trade in your Tundra. I am with the others when they suggest that you give your setup a try before doing anything rash. Get the trailer, load it up and load up your truck with what you expect to haul and go to the scales. After driving it around a bit you can make your decision and it will be the right one for you. Regardless of which direction you move make sure you get a GOOD weight distributing/anti sway hitch and set it up properly. It will make a big difference. I am a fan of the Equalizer.

All I know is that I am pulling my 25 FB with my '08 Tundra Double Cab without issue. Just did a 2500 mile trip through Northern California and another loop through Central Washington where we traveled over the two highest mountain passes in the state. The Tundra pulled like a dream, rode nicely and got just at 12mpg. This truck can pull your 28 footer and I would question that you could find a better truck in this regard.

If you are all worked up over the payload then go out and get a 3/4 ton and be done with it. Try your Tundra first. I doubt that you will be disappointed.

Good Luck.
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Old 09-30-2010, 10:53 AM   #36
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Airstream weights

Airstream should take an extra 5 minutes at the end of the assembly line and weigh every unit. That number should be part of that trailers documentation so at least there is an accurate number to start with.
There is no excuse for Airstream to have numbers that are out by 10% or more.
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Old 09-30-2010, 11:02 AM   #37
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add a leaf option

Carl,

An add a leaf is not a bad idea and the brand Old Man Emu makes one that is full length (i.e. rides smoother than short add a leafs), fits in the stock leaf pack, and are only about $50.00 for the pair. They add a good amount of firmness without feeling harsh.

ernie
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Old 09-30-2010, 11:19 AM   #38
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Ok, folks you can overanalyze things way to much and you do. Most people who tow trailers don't do half the things I read here and never ever have a problem. Sure sh*t can happen but not only to the person that is towing more than they should it can happen to the annal guy who follows the silly 20% rule to a "T" Still haven't figure out where that came from. the thread I started on it didn't help much.. Though it is a good rule of thumb.


Bottom line here: that Tundra will work fine. I tow with a Sequoia I even prefer to tow my tractor and trailer with it verses my older 3/4 ton dodge. It does a better job.

I put Air bags in the rear coil springs to help with the rear end sag, This way I don't have to crank the WD so much. You have more power than you will ever need. A great transmission. and brakes that can't be beat. I don't even have to brake that much going down hill here in Colorado because the transmission downshifts and does most of the work.

The only thing a 3/4 ton will do is give you a stiffer and a little beefed up frame, and suspension, and to go over the 10,000 # plus with the Tundra would be a very big load.

I say poo poo on the doom sayers. To many retired engineers with nothing to do but crunch numbers and worry about them.

Plus my air bags made the suv ride better than just the coils in the back. Plus you can put 5-35 psi in them to change the ride unlike an add a leaf.

You will be just fine, a 3/4 ton is overkill. Unless you want a diesel.

And stay away from the scales. It will just make you paranoid of your load.
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Old 09-30-2010, 12:08 PM   #39
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200 lb of books? A Kindle and a bunch of $9.99 e-books from Amazon would be WAY cheaper than taking a kick in the crotch on trading off a perfectly good Tundra... I suspect other weight savings can be had more cheaply than the depreciation hit on a new 3/4-ton TV as well.
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Old 09-30-2010, 12:31 PM   #40
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thanks again everyone -

PURMAN - If we are over-analyzing thats possible - but I’m learning a lot and better able to start defining some comfort zone for myself - that is really the point anyway isnt it? Gather info and make a reasonably informed decision. Where its headed now I am nowhere near 20% under, but will be over on several of the numbers (see next post).

DKOTUM - you are right it doesnt really make sense in a way for a 28 FC for one person. Its sort of separate issue - I want to do some upgrades and not trade the airstream anytime soon.......

GENE - thanks for looking over my charts! I always bring too many books. I am an architect, and I do specs for buildings and have worked with a lot of structural and mechanical engineers, hence the “thoroughness”. Engineers absolutely put in safety factors for things, and sometimes they really overdo it, and sometimes architects really overdo it. It is the way of business sometimes. (But thank God for america and infrastructure and standards, which are sorely lacking in much of the world). But without these manf numbers there is no where to start from, and cars are different from buildings depending on how you look at it, they are very heavily super-optimized.

AFTERMATH - you are a quick one - yes - I started to (suprised myself) like the sound of throwing in whatever toys and tools I want, and having a huge gas tank. I got frustrated as I like "stuff". But I hardly want to give up toyota quality, the ride, the brakes, etc. I am not sure I could actually trade it and drive away - thats a tough one. I have no problem with tundra up to 25s.
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Old 09-30-2010, 12:39 PM   #41
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UPDATE -

Regarding the 28s, based on a post from my companion thread (AS brochures length and weight mysteries), I am now feeling the weight (sorry couldnt help it).........because my charts are probably off even more than I thought.

Steverino says his WD hitch load on his 27 ft is 900 lbs loaded up more or less normally with gas and water and clothes and stuff. That means his real hitch load for a 27 ft is somewhere near 1300 lbs. The 28 ft would likely be even more. I cant verify his loading exactly but its a scaled number.

Assuming this is a realistic number, its maxing it out tight on a crewmax. After my leer cap and a few minor tools, I have a max of about 1300 lbs to work with for me, cargo, hitch load, passengers, step boards, etc. If 900 (or more) is gone from the hitch, then I have only 400 lbs left for me and anything else including passengers.

So it will go down the road on the interstate, but its tight and maybe sagging some, and over the specified "limit"

With just one passenger, I cant load anything in the truck at all and not be over the GVWR. I think the 25s are ok but I guess I am sort waffling now on the 27s and 28s. I will not be in a rush to go loose my lovely and wonderful toyota though
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Old 09-30-2010, 01:41 PM   #42
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As an architect, perhaps you see the plan of the 28' as more efficient use of living space than the front bed models, and better structurally as well with their weight of the door and pano windows held by a compromised rear assembly. The next closest thing going down of this type, is the 23' front sofa or dinette models. I mention this as a response to a wish for travel to remote areas. I do some residential design, and hate to leave those books at home, but I do.
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