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porterut · 09-12-2007, 07:52 PM

My wife and I are buying a 25' Safari - our first TT. For a tow vehicle, we're considering:
1. a diesel truck, such as the Chevy Silverado 2500
or 2. a gas SUV, such as the Suburban

We have a budget of $25K-30K. We would use the vehicle only for towing the Safari - not as a "second car". We're planning trips of 500-2000 miles, about 6 times per year. A typical road would be the Blue Ridge Parkway - hilly, but not mountainous.

We prefer the comfort of an SUV. But, we've heard that a diesel engine is really the way to go (for safety and longevity). There seems to be only one diesel SUV - the Ford Expedition - and they're rare. We would appreciate hearing your advice. Thanks!

-Bruce

CanoeStream · 09-12-2007, 07:55 PM

Hi Bruce - Welcome to the Forums! I seem to recall the last year for diesels in Suburbans was 2006. Expys or 'Burbs -- you're on the used market which can be quite alright.

Trailer weights have increased significantly over the years. What year were you looking at for a 25'?

uwe · 09-12-2007, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by porterut

My wife and I are buying a 25' Safari - our first TT. For a tow vehicle, we're considering:
1. a diesel truck, such as the Chevy Silverado 2500
or 2. a gas SUV, such as the Suburban

We have a budget of $25K-30K. We would use the vehicle only for towing the Safari - not as a "second car". We're planning trips of 500-2000 miles, about 6 times per year. A typical road would be the Blue Ridge Parkway - hilly, but not mountainous.

We prefer the comfort of an SUV. But, we've heard that a diesel engine is really the way to go (for safety and longevity). There seems to be only one diesel SUV - the Ford Expedition - and they're rare. We would appreciate hearing your advice. Thanks!

-Bruce

Bruce, you can very comfortably tow your trailer with a Suburban half or 3/4 ton rated that has the 6.0l engine and at least a 3:73 rear end ratio.
If you want to have absolute power, but deal with a brutal pickup, or a very heavy Excursion, then the Diesel is the way to go.
A search on Diesel, or tow vehicles will reveal countless threads on this very subject.

porterut · 09-12-2007, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CanoeStream

Hi Bruce - Welcome to the Forums! I seem to recall the last year for diesels in Suburbans was 2006. Expys or 'Burbs -- you're on the used market which can be quite alright.

Trailer weights have increased significantly over the years. What year were you looking at for a 25'?

Hi Bob,
The 25' Safari that we're buying is an '06.

-Bruce

davidz71 · 09-12-2007, 08:10 PM

If you have the budget for that much, buy the diesel and you will not regret it as a tow vehicle. The Duramax has shown that it is a good puller and reliable. Late model 7.3 litre Ford Powerstrokes are reliable but watch out for early Ford 6 litre diesels which had a number of problems. The new 6.4 dual turbo Powerstroke may be the best yet.

The Suburban with 6 litre engine in the 2500 version and in 4.10 rear end ratio would pull the trailer without problems but I think you would be more comfortable with the pulling power in hilly terrain with the Chevy 2500hd diesel or the Ford F250 diesel. I love my '01 2500hd with 8.1 litre gas engine/Allison transmission but if I were in constant hilly terrain or occasional mountainous terrain then I would buy the same truck/transmission/rearend with the Duramax diesel.

jump · 09-12-2007, 08:12 PM

and its as easier on the fuel consumption than the Jeep Cherokee I had before. It will pull anything I will ever need to pull.

we currently have a 1982 Excella 31' that weighs in at a little over 8k, I believe, and it follows us very nicely with the Dodge diesel. Plus it is a mega cab and has a bunch o room in the back seat.

2006 model and it was very close to your budget...2 wheel drive ( not desirable to others but fewer moving parts to break and/or maintain vs 4wd) end of model year. Right now they are offering lifetime warranty on drivetrain, and if you keep it a while, that might come in handy, too.

good luck with your decision.

Goin camping · 09-12-2007, 10:31 PM

Both will do the job IMHO. I'd opt for the diesel because of the hills. Diesels really pull fantasticly. You want to go gas for the lower price and availibility of fuel. I don't think you can go wrong either way.

Wasn't that helpfull?

DFord79 · 09-12-2007, 10:41 PM

Don't forget to look at the Ford 250 with the V-10 if you don't have enough budget for the diesel. The V-10 starting with the 3 valvue in 05 will pull nearly as well as the diesels. They have the HP to pull a 25 footed with ease in any condition. Diesels are the ultamate....but if you talk to the folks with the newer Ford V-10 you will be pleasantly surprised....and the fuel economy of the V-10 is really not all that bad if you don't push it real hard.

I read an article in a truck magazine that compared the 2007 gas and diesel motors from Ford, GM, And Dodge. As far as the gas motors are concerened the V10 outpulled the rest. And believe it or not was real close behind the diesels in accelleration with a load. My son has a new F-550 with the V-10 and he pulls and 24 foot work trailer behind it the weighs almost 15,000#. I was surprised how much power the V-10 has when pulling almost 25,000# gross.

volvophile · 09-13-2007, 02:13 AM

I like the diesels for fuel economy and longevity.
But Diesel fuel has a tendancy to rot and grow algea if it sits for to long, which might be a consideration if your only driving it 5 or 6 times a year.

One advantage Ive found with the pickups with a topper over the SUV, is you have a big toybox in the back for bicycles, blue tanks and ice chests, and anything else you dont want to dirty up the trailer with.

On the other hand, if someone where to give me a diesel Excursion, I probably wouldnt give it back

rickandsandi · 09-13-2007, 04:57 AM

Good morning Bruce-

We are on our third Tahoe and we love it! It pulls our Safari and the Tradewind with no problems and we have towed over 15K in just the past year! However, the next purchase will be a diesel pick up with a fullk cap. Several reasons; consistant power and gas mileage, a place to store the gen and extra gas without it being in the cockpit, let clutter and better organization and a place to put firewood when needed, plus it will last a loing time which is something I will have to get used to since I like getting a new truck every two years. So next truck will be a deisel full sized bed with crewcab.

overlander63 · 09-13-2007, 05:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DFord79

Don't forget to look at the Ford 250 with the V-10 if you don't have enough budget for the diesel. The V-10 starting with the 3 valvue in 05 will pull nearly as well as the diesels.

The Excursion was also available with a V10. There is one listed in the forums classifieds as of the tiume I write this.

**moosetags** · 09-13-2007, 07:03 AM

We have a 2005 25' Safari that we have pulled about 20,000 miles in all conditions and terrain with a 2005 Suburban 2500 4x4x4 with the 6.0 liter gas engine. We have found this to be a very good TT/TV combination. That being said, we with probably replace the Sub with a Duramax puck-up unless GM sees fit to put the Duramax in the Suburban. It is rumored that this will happen. GM has not put a diesel in a Sub since around 1999.

Overall, you would probably be happier with a Duramax Pick-up. They are relatively easy to find on the late model used market, so there will be a good selection. 2500 Suburbans are like Hen's teeth, there aren't very many out there. Don't let anyone talk you into a 1500 Suburban. It will not do an adequate job, and you will be an unhappy camper.

CanoeStream · 09-13-2007, 07:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by porterut

The 25' Safari that we're buying is an '06.

I asked because 25 footers are much heavier now than 20 years ago. My '06 has nearly 1000 pounds tongue weight loaded for the road -- that really cuts into the payload capacity of a half ton. I'd recommend 3/4.

Quote:

Originally Posted by volvophile

I like the diesels for fuel economy and longevity.
But Diesel fuel has a tendancy to rot and grow algea if it sits for to long, which might be a consideration if your only driving it 5 or 6 times a year.

One advantage Ive found with the pickups with a topper over the SUV, is you have a big toybox in the back for bicycles, blue tanks and ice chests, and anything else you dont want to dirty up the trailer with.

On the other hand, if someone were to give me a diesel Excursion, I probably wouldnt give it back

Diesel doesn't do well just sitting in the tank. I know there are additives to prevent algae but a diesel works best if regularly used. Excellent post Cheech ... I mean Dave!

There are good replies in this thread about gas engined TVs and they would do the job well -- to the tune of 10mpg or so. I've got an '06 GMC diesel. Mileage suffered starting a couple years back as engines were modified to produce fewer emissions and take on the low sulfur fuels. I get about 14mpg -- not much advantage to get you past the premium price of diesel vehicles and the futziness over fuel that volvofile brought up.

Melody Ranch · 09-13-2007, 07:55 AM

You should get a diesel powered supercab. Your in the heart of Texas where they are plentiful and not bad condition used. If your new to that type vehicle I am sure that you will be pleasantly suprised at the luxury and comfort in the high end types. Like most Texans, you may make it your daily ride too. Get a 3/4 (2500) ton. The bed gives you capabilities a SUV can't. You can always get a bed cap to close it in. I have had 'em all in the past 20 years. The Ford is more "truck" like and I liked it alot. My current Duramax is more 'Civilized" in its ride and feel. I like the motor (LBZ) and Allison combo better than the Ford. I just found a great Dodge 2500 HD crew cab, Diesel, which I really like too, for my brother. He came from Calif. to get it at a great price here in Texas. (He tows a Caravel.)

In any case this is a LOT of expensive capability to just have for six trips a year. Plan more trips.

Safari-Rick · 09-13-2007, 08:04 AM

Quote:

In any case this is a LOT of expensive capability to just have for six trips a year. Plan more trips.

Yea, but it's sure nice to have peace of mind and being able to use your AC while going up hill in most cases

Of course though, it all boils down to $$. Get what you can afford and can safely tow your TT.

flitzwhopper · 09-13-2007, 08:28 AM

No doubt about it... get the 3/4 ton. In the Dodges the rear end is fully floating (the axel is not a bearing surface). With the increased tongue weights having a heavy duty rear end is a good idea. If you aren't using it as a daily driver, although my wife prefers the tv for a daily driver, the ride won't matter. We have a Hemi but if I were going to add 1500lbs to the towing weight, I'd seriously consider a diesel. Anything past 6000lbs needs the torque of a diesel if you want to press the speed limit. We have a rally associate that pulls a 25FB with a Dorango and does fine but I don't think that he cares about being at 35 or 40 on 6% grades.

**jcanavera** · 09-13-2007, 08:38 AM

I guess a lot depends upon how long you are going to keep the vehicle, how often you are going to use it and the terrain. I use my 3/4 ton gas engine van for towing and we only do around 7,000 miles a year with it. I'm no expert on the diesal topic but there seems to be some consensus that lack of use on a diesal vehicle may add some fuel induced risk to the ownership equation.

Other issues I'm curious about is the servicing end. I hear that diesal's may be more expensive to service. Can anyone fill in that side of the equation?

For the type of usage I'm doing, I don't think the premium that a diesal demands in initial cost justifies itself.

Jack

cammur · 09-13-2007, 08:49 AM

I have a diesel towing a 25' Safari, and I agree, you are unlikely to earn back in mileage and engine life the premium you pay for the diesel, diesel fuel, diesel oil changes (a lot of oil there!), diesel service and repairs. But there is a comfort factor to the diesel, a sense of knowing my Dodge can do the job, and with a healthy margin. I don't regret having got the diesel - I only regret not having got 4WD. Another factor: if you are soon tempted to replace your 25' with a longer model, as unlikely as that seems now, you will not have to worry about the adequacy of your truck.

Good luck with your decision!

BillTex · 09-13-2007, 09:02 AM

Not sure diesel is real important. More important that you get the ¾ ton. Gas/diesel is personal preference. Having said that, after 2 seasons with the DA I am now a diesel convert. We use the truck as mainly for tow duty and other adventure trips (skiing, kayaking, etc) but not as a daily commuter. The economy of the diesel has proven itself to me; 15mpg towing with a mess of boats up on the roof, firewood, bikes, etc in the bed (in other words; a lot of stuff). Last winter, with about 10k on the odo we were averaging 21 mpg lightly loaded for ski trips (not towing). I did not get anywhere near this with ½ ton/small block gassers. Of course a big block would be even worse as far as mpg. We had a couple of Suburbans, that are GREAT vehicles, but truth is I find the crew cab truck more useful, Still seats five comfortably, but I can throw all kinds of crap in the back (had to be a little more careful with the SUV). I also use the truck for firewood, landscape duty etc. The SUV was fine when I had my business and always had a truck I could use. We scaled back a couple of years ago, and having to choose between a truck and large SUV, I’ll take a truck. Another thing to consider; the new diesels are much easier to live with than a few years ago, no smell, low maintenance, no smoke, no soot on the AS. Really no different than gas as far as day to day issues. I was a little intimidated about diesel as I had never owned one before, my fears were unfounded.
Good luck with your choice.
Bill

ghatfield · 09-13-2007, 09:03 AM

We have a 25' Classic and pull it with a 2003 Chev Silverado 2500 with a Duramax diesel. I have no experience with other tow vehicles, but this one has served us well. We are about to finish a 12-week tour of the west and we've pulled on some pretty steep hills at high temperatures (e.g., 6% and 113 degrees coming out of Laughlin, NV) and although the speed was down to 35-40mph at times, it has not overheated.

But the biggest advantage of the Duramax combined with the six speed Allison trans (at least in my mind) is going down hills. Even 6% grades require very little braking. It just holds between 55 and 60 on most hills. I don't think you would get this compression breaking with a gas engine.

I've talked to a lot of Duramax owners and all have been very happy with their truck. We have seen a lot of them on our trip. A used truck would be in your price range.

George