Sagging Truck?

[m.hony]

So the force applied by weight distribution caused this ( or turning too tight:

If it is bent, it is bent upward. I thought that might be caused by bottoming out in a dip. Could force applied by weight distribution bend it upward bouncing up and down the highway? I have only had effective weight distribution for a couple of weeks. The previous 2 years it was set up wrong with zero weight distribution/sway control. That's what listening to Equal-i-zer and following the instructions got me. 4 washers and weight bars parallel does nothing. If the hitch is bent upward, it could have been bent upward by my previous sob and EazLift?

[m.hony]

I live in Mississippi. Surely I don't have to travel to Canada to get my hitch reinforced.

[SteveH]

Originally Posted by m.hony

So the force applied by weight distribution caused this ( or turning too tight:
Attachment 223354
If it is bent, it is bent upward. I thought that might be caused by bottoming out in a dip. Could force applied by weight distribution bend it upward bouncing up and down the highway? I have only had effective weight distribution for a couple of weeks. The previous 2 years it was set up wrong with zero weight distribution/sway control. That's what listening to Equal-i-zer and following the instructions got me. 4 washers and weight bars parallel does nothing. If the hitch is bent upward, it could have been bent upward by my previous sob and EazLift?

That bend looks like a jack-knife, or too sharp of a turn to the Right event to me. WD would not have done that, IMHO.

Don't believe you are understanding yet, we're not saying your hitch receiver is bent, we are saying your receiver cross tube may be flexing under WD load, and therefore negating the additional pressure you are putting on the bars by adding washers.

The fact is, you are towing a large trailer with a 1/2 ton truck, and probably right at max weight capacity and towing capacity.

[m.hony]

I have weight distribution and sway control now, but the trailer is nose down. If I move the head up one notch, the trailer is nose up and I no longer have weight distribution or sway control.
My goal is to have weight distribution and sway control and have the trailer level. If it ain't possible, I'll live with having weight distribution and sway control and the trailer nose down.
I think by putting another washer in the hitch head or using washers to shim up the ball I may achieve what I am after.. If not, the trailer will be nose down and I will leave it alone.
You say may cross tube may be flexing under load. Flexing under load when? As I'm traveling down the road hitting bumps? I can't tell anything twisting or flexing when hitching up. I see no evidence of twisting or flexing when crawling around under the truck- no broken welds, nothing out of the ordinary- would the twisting and flexing flex the entire truck frame? I will have it looked at by Toyota and some shade tree welders. I won't drive to Canada to get it reinforced. I will get a local shade tree welder to do it. Then I will be exceeding my half ton payload in steel bracing...
Funny how I can turn tight enough to bend the hitch head but the trailer never gets into the tailgate and bumper. I guess that's why the Equal-i-zer shank is as long as it is.

[SteveH]

Do you understand how a torsion bar spring works? Well, to a degree that's exactly what the hitch cross tube will do under enough load. Cross tube meaning the round tubular steel piece that goes from one side of the truck frame to the other.

In the beginning all weight distribution receiver hitches were built with TWO cross members, one in the back, and one about 2 to 3 feet to the front of that with the square receiver tube welded to both of them. It strengthened everything including the attachment to the vehicle's frame. This is what CanAM RV does to reinforce hitches so they distribute more weight.

It's normally not a problem when the tow vehicle and it's hitch is adequately rated.

[dznf0g]

Are you sure the head wasn't born that way? They aren't exactly precise stampings! I can't see you jack knifing enough to do that without other damage, as you state. WD didn't cause that, IMO.

[m.hony]

I don't remember ever jack knifing, but with my rig I can turn the steering wheel all the way and turn in a circle as tight as it will go and the trailer will never get into the bumper or tailgate.
I have had to panic stop before- someone pulled out in front of me and I had to lock it down to keep from damaging my vehicle (or killing them- secondary in my opinion, lol).
Could sudden braking cause that? There is still the possibility that it was born that way. I just never noticed or never looked until someone suggested my hitch may be bent. I still don't really believe my hitch is bent or twisting under load, but I do plan to have it looked at by Toyota and a local shade tree welder (but he's a good welder).
The end result might be an aftermarket Class IV hitch and some other weight distribution hitch (even if I go back to an EazLift). The ultimate would be if I had $2,300 and could get a ProPride.

[dznf0g]

Originally Posted by m.hony

I don't remember ever jack knifing, but with my rig I can turn the steering wheel all the way and turn in a circle as tight as it will go and the trailer will never get into the bumper or tailgate.
I have had to panic stop before- someone pulled out in front of me and I had to lock it down to keep from damaging my vehicle (or killing them- secondary in my opinion, lol).
Could sudden braking cause that? There is still the possibility that it was born that way. I just never noticed or never looked until someone suggested my hitch may be bent. I still don't really believe my hitch is bent or twisting under load, but I do plan to have it looked at by Toyota and a local shade tree welder (but he's a good welder).
The end result might be an aftermarket Class IV hitch and some other weight distribution hitch (even if I go back to an EazLift). The ultimate would be if I had $2,300 and could get a ProPride.

It would be jack knifing while backing...but again, other damage would've, been present. No, I don't believe hard braking would cause this....even if you had NO effective trailer brakes.

The only scenario I see is: born that way or backed into something with the head in the receiver (sans trailer), or being rear ended on head ( sans trailer). Both of those, you would obviously know about.

When you add a washer inspect the witness mark the big "rivet head" made in the shank. If it is oblonged to the side, something has caused the head "wings" to bend. If it looks round and shows no sideways movement, it was probably born offset. That is most likely, IMO.

[SteveH]

My opinions are you did not bend the hitch head in a quick stop, and it's more likely it's always been that way.

It's also my opinion that another brand of hitch, even a ProPride will not solve the problem you are having with inadequate WD IF the receiver is flexing. Personally, I'd get it checked by your welder friend first.

[Chuck]

right, the propride will just make the receiver flex, too.
IF that is the problem. Which it might not be. Its just something to consider, and investigate.
You don't have to drive to Ontario to have the hitch reinforced, but my understanding is that they are very generous with their advise; you could probably take that advise and have your local welder implement it.

listen to episode 196 of the Vap podcast.
Episode 196: Hitch 'em Up | The Vintage Airstream Podcast

Andy talks about this issue with the hitches flexing, and how things came to be that way (i.e. with the industry creating crappy hitches that often aren't as strong as they should be).

[Msmoto]

My Dodge/Cummins, Crew Cab 4X4 has base weights of approximately 4438 lb front, 2640 lb rear. As set up, loaded and with trailer hitched, my weights are 4400 lb front and 4300 lb rear. What does this mean IMO? I am of the belief that a weight ratio F/R of close to 50/50 is the best, or slightly front biased. So, I am as close as possible and the truck/trailer seems to handle well.

My suggestion might be to move the ball up one bolt hole if possible. Then, lower the weight distribution point on the trailer down. After this, see if the trailer is level, however this must be measured on a level surface, like at a truck weigh station. Also, look at the weights of the truck axles, and trailer.

Just my thinking today...

[m.hony]

Already tried that-
It's funny how we went from sagging truck to droopy trailer-
The truck don't sag no more.
I still think a possible outcome will be the trailer stays nose down.
As long as I have good weight distribution and sway control.
As it is (trailer nose down) if I am going 65 and an 18 wheeler passes at 70 I feel nothing. If he is going 80, though, I feel the bow wave.

[SteveH]

Originally Posted by m.hony

As it is (trailer nose down) if I am going 65 and an 18 wheeler passes at 70 I feel nothing. If he is going 80, though, I feel the bow wave.

With enough wind and/or speed, you always will, even with a ProPride. At least, I did when I had my ProPride and every other hitch I have had. It isn't a problem mind you, but I feel it.

[dznf0g]

You could look for a ball with a 1/2" (or so) taller profile. (distance from bottom of flange to top of ball). But do not sacrifice weight capacity rating.

[SteveH]

I need a ball that is 1/2" taller also because with the WD right, my trailer is 1/2" low in the front, and if I raise the hitch a notch, it is 3/4" high in the front. I'd rather have it low. Been looking for a drawbar that has the holes in a different placing, but have not been able to find one.

[ROBERTSUNRUS]

Originally Posted by ROBERTSUNRUS

Hi, m.hony: I think that your truck's receiver is bent. This is just by looking at your pictures. It looks like the ball is only slightly tilted in relation to the trailer's coupler and the ground. Most trucks don't sit level. They are a bit high in back, but the shank should be at the same angle as the body and yours looks to be bent upward. If I were you, I would take an angle gauge and put it on top of the side of the bed, read it, and put it on top off the shank. It looks like to me that the shank steeper than your truck. About five degrees could make a huge difference since the head is supposed to be angled back about 10 degrees.

This is my guess since I only have a few pictures to look at.

Originally Posted by m.hony

I don't know why you think that.
I don't know why you think you can see something in photos that I can't see in real life.
I crawled around under the truck and took photos of every weld and mounting point to disprove your theory.
Nothing is bent. Your theory is disproved. Give it a rest. Saying it again won't make it so.

Originally Posted by m.hony

What I can tell by those photos: robots are better welders than humans...

Originally Posted by m.hony;1518938[COLOR=red

]I've said it twice already, but I'll say it a third time.
The hitch appears to be going upward. This is an illusion[/COLOR]. The truck itself it parked going downhill. Where the slant ends (which the entire truck is parked on- the nose of the truck downhill at the street, the rear of the truck uphill toward the house) is about the rear of the truck- the driveway levels off, so the tail of the truck is sticking up into the air at an angle and the pavement goes from slanted/angled up to level flat at that point. Every house in this subdivision has a driveway like that. I would think that is normal in every subdivision everywhere.

Originally Posted by m.hony

Seems to me, and I ain't the smartest man in the world, that pressure and force from a trailer bending a hitch would bend it down, not up.

Hi, if you have read what I said, and what others have said, we can only TRY TO HELP YOU with what pictures you posted and what descriptions you have given. But your responses are somewhat rude to people trying to help you. It's kind of like you need help, but don't want any advise or opinions from anyone!

My Lincoln, My Safari, and my Equal-I-zer work perfectly, and have for nine years now.

GOOD LUCK.

[m.hony]

I looked for a ball with 1/2" rise but could not find one.
Equal-i-zer is sending me some new inside link plates. I am going to try doubling them to keep them from bowing.
Equal-i-zer also thinks the bent head is no big deal and will not affect safety.
The difference with a ProPride or Hensley is when the 18 wheeler goes by and you feel the bow wave, the ProPride or Hensley allows the trailer and truck to move independently/swivel at the hitch, but remain in a straight line, therefore eliminating sway. The trailer moves over ever so slightly, but remains straight in line with the truck.
With any other hitch, the truck and trailer swing/pivot/pendulum in the middle and the sway control brings it back to straight. The tail wags the dog until sway control corrects it. That, in my pea brain, is significant reason to want a ProPride, but I'm broke- maybe next year-

[m.hony]

Originally Posted by SteveH

I need a ball that is 1/2" taller also because with the WD right, my trailer is 1/2" low in the front, and if I raise the hitch a notch, it is 3/4" high in the front. I'd rather have it low. Been looking for a drawbar that has the holes in a different placing, but have not been able to find one.

Exactly my scenario.
I guess we could take a torch to our draw bars, cut them off, and re-weld them 1/2" higher or lower...
I am trying other means- washer under the ball, another washer in the hitch head, an "anti-rattle" device-
In the end, we may drive around with a nose down trailer, but good weight distribution and sway control, thus good drive-ability, handling, and safety, regardless if it looks goofy to me-

[m.hony]

[m.hony]

The hitch does appear to go up in relation to the truck.

The whole truck is slanted/angled- the front is lower than the back. The pin hole is elongated. I think that is due to slop/play in the shank/receiver.