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Old 02-22-2008, 06:09 PM   #71
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...and all this is why I stay GM and never go to the dark side.

Maybe F...F..., well, you know, they may too be different than Dodge.

See, in my world, the 1/2 ton and 3/4 are not all that complicated.

1/2 ton- 5.3L, 4L60e, coil springs, etc.

3/4 ton- 6.0L (at one time also 8.1L), diesel (if you wanna pay for it), 4L80e, upgraded differential, upgraded frame, upgraded axle hubs, upgraded suspension, etc.

Price for the upgrade from GMs 1/2 to 3/4, from little to no cost difference to around $3k (unless of course, you opt for the Duramax/Allison combo).

Maybe half the issue here is that we're talking Dodge. Get a GM and you can have your cake and eat it too and spend that $5k you would have spent on the Dodge (depending on what GM route you take) instead on feeding the beast! $3+ /gallon can add up!
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Old 02-22-2008, 07:07 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck
I think they are exactly alike, except for the features that enable one to carry WAY more than the other. and thats the argument: the price of that capacity.
The two hemi trucks that I compared are also exactly alike except for the features that make one a 1/2 ton and one a 3/4 ton. The price difference isn't that much and I think that is the argument. If there is an argument here.

I didn't intend to hurl myself into the middle of a squabble. I don't disagree that there is a significant price difference between base 1/2's and 3/4's, nor do I deny that there are a lot of variables and overlap possibilities when pricing a truck.

It is just as incorrect to say that there is a $5,000 difference between 1/2 tons and 3/4 tons as it is incorrect to say there is no difference. Phrased that way an argument may ensue. So, I will state it a different way. It is just as correct to say that there is a $5,000 difference between 1/2 tons and 3/4 tons as it is correct to say there is no difference.

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Old 02-22-2008, 07:39 PM   #73
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I recently switched from a 1991 1/2 ton to a 1997 3/4 ton. The difference in towing is considerable. I wasn't white knuckle towing with the 1/2 ton for the most part, but I have to say with the 3/4 I am much more at ease. I attribute this to the suspension and brakes and so forth. As to the power issue, the two trucks can't even be compared. The 1/2 was under powered in the west, where as the 3/4 ton has a 7.3 PSD. Towing mileage with the 1/2 was at best around 11 mpg towing 55-60, with the PSD it has run a bit above 15 at 65 mph. Further, daily driving mileage is about 4 mpg better with the 3/4. I bought the truck right ($6K) with 180k miles. It is a very plain truck, no frills. I expect to drive it at least another 5 years. Between what I paid and the mileage gap, I suspect I will come out pretty good on the deal.

My observation, having towed with both, is this. A 3/4 ton is definitely nice for towing, but not strictly speaking a necessity. The more miles you tow, and the more mountainous the towing, the more you will benefit from the 3/4 and for that matter from a diesel. Just my opinion, but there it is.
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Old 02-23-2008, 08:55 AM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RBolton
The two hemi trucks that I compared are also exactly alike except for the features that make one a 1/2 ton and one a 3/4 ton.
no, you've taken a 1/2 ton, and ADDED a bunch of 3/4 ton features...for which you must pay, and compared that to a base 3/4 ton. Of course, the more 3/4 ton features you add to the 1/2 ton, the closer they will be in price. you pay for the features either way. "3/4 ton" means "all of them". 1/2 ton means "none of them"...or "some of them"...or "most of them".... which one? the difference between "all" and "none" is 5 grand. The difference between "all" and "most" will be...not that much...In which case, I question how much different it will perform, if you've got all (or most of) the same stuff...but thats another discussion.
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Old 02-23-2008, 09:31 AM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck
no, you've taken a 1/2 ton, and ADDED a bunch of 3/4 ton features...for which you must pay, and compared that to a base 3/4 ton.
Nowhere have I compared a loaded up 1/2 to a base 3/4. I don't think anyone in this thread has, but you seem to be stuck on that.

Chuck, to be fair to Bill, this will be my last post in this thread. My mother always told me there should never be any arguments. If a person is right they have no need to argue and if they are wrong they have no business arguing. I have no need to argue here.

Roger
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Old 02-23-2008, 10:08 AM   #76
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you've added far more in upgrades to the 1/2 than you have to the 3/4 in order to get a smaller difference in price. You might just as well compare the most expensive 1/2 ton to the least expensive 3/4 and argue that 3/4 is cheaper.
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Old 02-23-2008, 10:53 AM   #77
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Point/Counterpoint

Chuck,

Remind me to pick you for my team when we have our next sand lot football game....you are one determined soul. Although I tend to be somewhere in the middle (kinda), I admire your loyalty to your perspective. You all have been fairly civil in your bantering....I certainly believe all of the positions have been clearly stated, good thing each one of us gets to choose our path.
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Old 02-26-2008, 10:41 PM   #78
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(shakes head, mutters to self, not quite believing this thread is still going on).

The pricing stuff is not an accident. If it was easy to compare A vs B, people might buy the one with less markup.

Not quite sure what anybody intends to tow with a 6 cyl 1/2 ton, because he could probably fit the canoe it's rated for in the bed.
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Old 02-27-2008, 01:09 PM   #79
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The ideal tow vehicle takes some time to find. You have to match it up to what you tow. Many don't reasearch enough or pay too much attention to what the salesman says.

So here goes...IN MY WORLD>>>>> THE PERFECT TOW VEHICLE FOR A SAFARI 25' WITH A 7,300# LOADED CAPACITY.

Ford F-150 XL regular cab 145" wheel base 2wd. 4.1 LS rear with heavy duty trailer tow package and if you wait a few months it will have the FACTORY TRAILER BRAKE CONTROLLER like the SUPER DUTIES HAVE. With a factory class IV hitch.

It has an 11,000# trailer tow capacity with "E" rated 245/75X17 tires (Same tires that are on the one ton dually except there are 4 of them instead of 6 on the dually) with 7 lug heavy duty wheels. SAME BRAKE ROTORS AS 3/4 TON ON THIS ONE TOO.

It has a GCVW of 16,400#.

It has a Cargo Carrying Capacity of 3050# (more than most 3/4 tons w/4X4)

It ONLY comes in XL trim level but on a half ton that also means you can get carpet and upgraded sterio. A/C. etc.

IT has an upgraded heavy duty frame too. Fords specs on the frame are right with the 3/4 ton.

It has the 5.4, Auto trans. (6sp auto if you wait a few months for the 09). Then you can also get the 310 hp 5.4.

Rated at 17 mpg Hwy mileage. Maybe a bit less than an unloaded 3/4 ton diesel...but then the price of diesel where I live TODAY is 3.69 a gallon and 3.13 gor unleaded. Diesel usually costs about 50 cents more a gallon here year around.

NOW....heres the final kicker in this deal. IF you are like us and don't need a crew cab. Don't care to impress you'r neighbors with a chomed up High dollar leather seat truck. You can get this well equipled with carpeted floors, upgreaded sterio/CD player. Cruise controll etc. for $25,165 on the Ford Web site. And if you buy in the next 6 weeks....$22,665 with 2,500 rebate.

A truck that will truly tow you 25 foot AS for OVER 20,000 Grand less than a diesel....and fuel mileage real close to a diesel when unloaded.

Just my 2 Cents.....these are out there you just have to ignore the salesman and know what you want. NOT a truck for all..just a truck for us.
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Old 03-05-2008, 06:54 AM   #80
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Braking Stats

I received the Annual Auto Issue from Consumers Report yesterday and stumbled over an interesting stat regarding 60mph to 0 stopping distances.

Dodge Ram 1500 153'
Dodge Ram 2500 176'

Ford F-150 153'
Ford F-250 159'

Chev Silverado 1500 153'
Chev Silverado 2500HD 171'
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Old 03-05-2008, 07:15 AM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Road Ruler
I received the Annual Auto Issue from Consumers Report yesterday and stumbled over an interesting stat regarding 60mph to 0 stopping distances.

Dodge Ram 1500 153'
Dodge Ram 2500 176'

Ford F-150 153'
Ford F-250 159'

Chev Silverado 1500 153'
Chev Silverado 2500HD 171'
Interesting. I wonder why that is.....
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Old 03-05-2008, 08:17 AM   #82
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Curb weight, 1500 series
estimated (lbs.)
- 2WD
4,453
4,594
4,994
5,105
5,164
5,135
- 4x4
4,678
4,946
5,226
5,345
5,362
5,379

Curb weight, 2500 Series
estimated (lbs.)
- 2WD
5,308
5,596
5,735
5,742
5,899
- 4x4
5,554
5,847
6,006
5,983
6,169

Could have something with a little known physical property called “mass”.

Bill
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Old 03-05-2008, 08:38 AM   #83
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It looks like vehicle weight is an influence on stopping distances.

For example 60MPH - O for the
Toyota Tundra is 153' and the lighter
Toyota Tacoma is 131'

HD trucks usually have heavier brake rotors, wheels and tires which also can contribute to more rotational weight to bring to a stop.
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Old 03-05-2008, 09:04 AM   #84
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Good post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Road Ruler
I received the Annual Auto Issue from Consumers Report yesterday and stumbled over an interesting stat regarding 60mph to 0 stopping distances.

Dodge Ram 1500 153'
Dodge Ram 2500 176'

Ford F-150 153'
Ford F-250 159'

Chev Silverado 1500 153'
Chev Silverado 2500HD 171'
Road Ruler,

Any idea if the 250/2500 models were gas or diesel? Th weight of a diesel would add to the additional weight of the HD models and such could increase the stopping distance. It would be interesting to see the difference between gas and diesel. The 15/1500 numbers are equal, but the 250/2500 numbers make me wonder if the test was apples to apples?
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