Please help: 2018 Globetrotter => 2018 F-150 Lariat SuperCrew Confirmation

[KWN306]

Originally Posted by majorairhead

I have towed with a '15 F150 XLT 4x4 crew cab 3.5 ecoboost, pulling a '16 flying cloud. I have also towed the same flying cloud with my '17 F250 XLT 4x4 crew cab 6.2.

I'll never go back to an F150.

Did the F150 pull it? Yes

Does the F250 pull it? Yes

However, there is, in my experience, absolutely no comparison between the two in terms of comfort level going down the road....not even close.

F250/F350 for the win

Go BIG or go home.

This man speaks the truth, we pulled a 30' FC with a 2016 F 150 with a 3.5 ECO and 3.55 rear. Did it pull it "yes", I went back to a 3/4 ton and "yes" it pulls it with no issues. I use a Pro Pride with 1400# bars and my rig goes down the road like a Lincoln Town Car on air ride suspension.

[billrector]

Originally Posted by jcl

DOT regulations apply to commercial carriers. Does that include you?

Your door jamb sticker is a FMVSS sticker.

If you are going to follow the commercial regulations, fine, but why stop at GVWR? Carry copies of driving test results and driver training records, keep a detailed driver’s log, maybe get a commercial license, get a DOT number for the side of the truck, get placards for any hazardous materials you are carrying, etc.

If that all sounds like too much for a recreational vehicle and non-commercial driver, then maybe rethink your focus on GVWR as the holy grail, while still respecting axle and tire limits. Those are real. Removing floor mats to bring your TV weight down sounds just a little extreme.

So, a professional driver should stay under the GVWR but we recreational drivers can ignore it? That sounds like faulty logic.

[Rocinante]

Originally Posted by Andrew T

<snip>
On the 150 make sure you get the 20” wheels, unless you get the heavy payload pkg which comes with LT tires.
<snip>

Perhaps that helps explain the good experience we've had with our RAM 1500 - we have 20 inch wheels and a full towing package. Again, overall our towing experience has been great. Our only concern has been that we are right at our truck's load capacity, even with a weight distribution hitch, and we worry about that even though we are nowhere near the truck's max towing capacity. Just sharing our personal experience, that's all. Folks like Andrew who have tested multiple configurations over and over can provide an intriguing alternative to our experience with a single truck.

[jcl]

Originally Posted by billrector

So, a professional driver should stay under the GVWR but we recreational drivers can ignore it? That sounds like faulty logic.

So that means you follow all the common carrier regulations? Or is it a case of just picking some of them?

[Rocinante]

In a thread that goes sideways like this, it is usually a case of someone, at some point pretending to be a lawyer. Can we just focus on answering the OP's question instead of getting into a spitting match about the size of our own tow vehicles? Just this once? Please?

[Countryboy59]

Originally Posted by billrector

So, a professional driver should stay under the GVWR but we recreational drivers can ignore it? That sounds like faulty logic.

A few pounds over might be a big deal if you go through every weigh station, but it's not going to make a pickup truck explode. Some pickups around here are overloaded to the point where the frame is bent, and are still running.

Seriously, if you're at the limit and a passenger gets in, what's going to happen? What percentage of people who tow trailers actually weigh anything? You guys should stop by the proving grounds and see what they tow with these vehicles during testing.

Sheesh, 3990 payload didn't cost me a whole lot more than 1900. Glad I did it. I wouldn't enjoy Camping much if I was taking out floor mats and stuff.

Don't get me wrong, these big pickups come with a rollover risk so if you follow real close, panic or swerve a lot they might not be a good choice for you. I don't, so it works.

[Andrew T]

On an F150 that we want to optimize we will install Bilstein Shocks, this is an expensive change but it does make an amazing difference to the handling. If you plan to keep the truck for a long time it is worth doing. You will have to change the factory shocks sometime so might as well have the benefit today.

The 275/55R x 20" tires are pretty good but they are optimized for a smooth ride and not the most precise handling. We change these to Pirelli Scorpion P255/55R x 20 XL (extra load) tires. This tire has about 1/4 the side wall roll and gives much better steering feel. Load capacity of these tires is 2337 or 4600 pounds per axle so far more than necessary.

If the truck has 18" Passenger tires the handling is quite bad and the change makes a much larger difference to handling, this change we make far more often. The size we change to on these is a P255/60R x18 XL (extra load) The load capacity on these is 2469 Speed rating is 168 MPH.

With tires there is almost always going to be a compromise with any change and the same is true here. Upsides are that handling is much better, fuel economy improves slightly and you have a touch more power so you stay in 5th or 6th gear more of the time. As well these tires though smaller appear to have better traction in most conditions likely due to a stickier tread compound.

The downsides are less tread life and some speedometer error the 20's will read 1.5% fast and the 18's 3% fast. So in the case of the 18's your speedometer will read 61.8 MPH when you are traveling at 60 MPH.

If you have an F150 or any 1/2 ton and are not comfortable with the handling or just want it better the first place to look is the hitch system and set up. Once that is optimized if you want it better again. You can try the tires or shocks or both. As I mentioned earlier most find once the hitch is right they don't bother with the other changes though I would change the tire size when tires need changing if it was mine.

I hope this helps.

Andy

[70CT]

If cost is not of concern buy a 3/4 ton pickup you will be happy you did.

If cost is of concern but having a brand new pickup to match that brand new trailer is not of concern, buy a 3/4 ton pickup, you will be happy you did.

If cost is of concern and having a brand new pickup to match that brand new trailer is of concern, buy a 1/2 ton pickup, you will be happy you did.

[SCOTTinNJ]

Originally Posted by majorairhead

I have towed with a '15 F150 XLT 4x4 crew cab 3.5 ecoboost, pulling a '16 flying cloud. I have also towed the same flying cloud with my '17 F250 XLT 4x4 crew cab 6.2.

I'll never go back to an F150.

Did the F150 pull it? Yes

Does the F250 pull it? Yes

However, there is, in my experience, absolutely no comparison between the two in terms of comfort level going down the road....not even close.

F250/F350 for the win

Go BIG or go home.

Same here. 2012 F150 and moved to a 2017 F250 gas. I'll never go back.

[rodsterinfl]

The F150 can tow anything within its capacities- by design. People have different comfort levels. My old F150, 2009, was heavy feeling and lugged along and, strained on hills. The new one is limber and light feeling and barely notices the trailer. The max tow models with 3.5 liters can tow around 11-13K depending on configuration. The ONLY limiting factor Airstream-wise, will be that door sticker number (payload). Shop for your truck knowing that it will tow the trailer but just subtract about 1000# from the door sticker and consider what is left for everything else. Also, shop by checking the stickers! It is amazing how each truck differs.

[slowmover]

Inexperience = buy a magic one ton

Experience = dial in the hitch rigging on a better TV.

[AirMiles]

"rethink your focus on GVWR as the holy grail, while still respecting axle and tire limits."

I don't understand the logic behind respecting some ratings and ignoring others? I also don't understand how stating that you follow the ratings raises such a nasty response on this forum.

One common denominator of all of these threads is that any further comments from the new member asking the question and those suggesting to follow the rules gets silenced.

Time for me to take a break from Airforums along with many others who in the past attempted to defended weight ratings and non-magic hitches.

[Rocinante]

We've not heard from the OP, so at this point maybe we can all take a breath and see whether they come back with additional questions.

[jcl]

Originally Posted by AirMiles

"rethink your focus on GVWR as the holy grail, while still respecting axle and tire limits."

I don't understand the logic behind respecting some ratings and ignoring others? I also don't understand how stating that you follow the ratings raises such a nasty response on this forum.

One could equally ask why the focus on one regulation (that applies only to commercial carriers) but not the others?

No need for nastiness IMO.

The risk of focusing so much on one figure is that posters are directed to what is regarded by many as a suboptimal vehicle purely because of that choice to go only by payload. Sure, payload is a factor. It isn’t the most important one. And a singular focus on it leaves little room in the conversation for the other factors.

[billrector]

Yeah....I don’t get it. Follow the “rules” and you are considered ignorant and inexperienced. If anything, shouldn’t it be the other way around? Enough already. It’s a free country, do what you want but don’t criticize those of us who take ratings seriously.

[Mollysdad]

1. This is a terrible place for unbiased opinions. Everyone will tell you to get what they have.
2. Payload is the amount of gear the truck is designed to carry IN THE BED. (and I'll throw in the tongue weight.)
3. Using a weight distribution hitch takes some of that weight off the rear axle and moves it using leverage to the front axle and the trailer axles.
4. The fact you'll be using the truck as a daily driver leads me to advise you to get a half ton with a plenty of towing power.
5. I see you're in the Phoenix area. 99.9% of the time you'll be on flat terrain.
6. I'd forget the "super crew" cab if it's just you and the wife. The same configuration with a smaller back seat will give you more capacity.
7. The true measure of weight is to take the entire rig to a Cat scale and weigh the front, rear, and trailer axles separately.

In the interest of disclosure, I have a 26' towed with a Tundra 5.7 and Equalizer hitch, and it's easy to forget the trailer's back there.

[HeadWest]

When we bought our 28' International, we went through a lot of thought on an F150 verses a heavy duty pickup (F250 or F350). At that time, the Ford Super Duty's seemed very dated and we were also using the truck as a daily driver which the F150 is more manageable. The F150 has been great with towing our trailer, plenty of power with the Ecoboost (unlike our son's almost same F150 but with the 5l V8). The F150 has been rock solid towing with a Propride hitch and LT, not P metric tires, even in strong cross winds.

Now with 115k miles on the F150, we decided to buy a new truck. With the complete redesign and updates, we went with an F350 diesel. Much more power, larger brakes, exhaust brake, and no worries with payload. We wanted all the toys on the truck and numbers on the current F150s would have been reduced payload from where we have been at with the old truck, around 1450 pounds.

We have not towed with the new truck, only have had it a few weeks but it is much more of a beast as a daily driver. A foot and a half of additional length is substantially less maneuverable and harder to parallel park although all the cameras do help. I'm sure i will be complaining a bit more in our travels when I'm unhitched and in urban situations with the bigger vehicle.

From the numbers you are looking at with the truck mentioned, I'm sure you will be fine with the F150. It will be a better daily driver. If you plan to bring a ton of extra crap along or loads of mountain driving, you might be better off going with a larger truck.

[Countryboy59]

Originally Posted by billrector

Yeah....I don’t get it. Follow the “rules” and you are considered ignorant and inexperienced. If anything, shouldn’t it be the other way around? Enough already. It’s a free country, do what you want but don’t criticize those of us who take ratings seriously.

Neither approach is ignorant. Just remember testing of vehicles goes way beyond the numbers, and it won't instantly break at one pound over max, just like it doesn't break when you speed (they're also tested way above recommended speeds).

[billrector]

Originally Posted by Countryboy59

Neither approach is ignorant. Just remember testing of vehicles goes way beyond the numbers, and it won't instantly break at one pound over max, just like it doesn't break when you speed (they're also tested way above recommended speeds).

I don't believe that anyone has posted saying that one pound over the limit will break the truck. I am a believer that the more overloaded your truck is (vs. GWVR), the less safe you become to yourself and others. However, there are people on this site who say to ignore the payload rating and place your focus elsewhere.

[jcl]

Originally Posted by billrector

I don't believe that anyone has posted saying that one pound over the limit will break the truck.

I don’t know about one pound, but I did see a reference to removing the floor mats to lighten the tow vehicle.

Originally Posted by billrector

I am a believer that the more overloaded your truck is (vs. GWVR), the less safe you become to yourself and others. However, there are people on this site who say to ignore the payload rating and place your focus elsewhere.

There are load ratings that matter. Tires and axles come to mind. But payload ratings are set based on things other than vertical loads (which are more precisely addressed with tire and axle ratings) and for horizontal loads, there are combination ratings (which consider stopping, starting, grades, etc). One of those other things is load placement. You can address that one through use of WD equipment, as an example. What else is GVWR giving you, other than DOT tax and licensing bands?

It isn’t a case of ignoring numbers, as much as it is understanding what they contribute, and what their limitations are.