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05-06-2016, 09:40 PM
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#1
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2 Rivet Member
1976 Argosy 26
diamond bar
, California
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 95
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Planning not to use WDH, bad idea?
Recently acquired 26 Argosy, came with a Reese WD hitch (1000lbs bars). I was not planning to use it or any other WD/sway control. But reading the most of the posts it may be a requirement even for long wheel base trucks.
I have experience towing boats, utility trailers, construction equipment since the early 90's. I have even experienced violent sway and hit a K-rail due to a shifted load to the rear. I was much younger then. I check and recheck tie downs from that experience.
I understand the concept of safety vs. cost. But what is it that makes the Airstream different from my friends toy hauler? The shape? Axle placement? Or is it when the front fresh water tank is empty and the rears are full (tongue weight)?
My TV is a crew cab dually. It should be enough truck but reading it's not safe to tow without has me concerned.
Is sway control without weight distribution available or even an option?
Sorry, if its a beat to death topic
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05-06-2016, 09:57 PM
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#2
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2 Rivet Member
2004 28' Safari S/O
pittsburgh
, Pennsylvania
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 59
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My 2 cents....
Quick answer is no you don't need it. Load the tongue right and use the break controller to control sway etc.
Long answer...
Use them both! I have towed a lot of stuff with small cars to 1 ton dually trucks. The weight distro and sway really work and come into play for that emergency stop or swerve. Or maybe just that uneven highway dip that takes down force off of front wheels at highway speed.
Its interesting to see my dually squat without the weight distro but I doubt I would feel sway without the sway control. But I would not want to tow without either.
Airstreams tend to have a lower CG and the profile catches air different than other brands and I think they tow better because of it. Google search and you may find sway control only or load only.
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05-06-2016, 10:21 PM
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#3
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Rivet Master
1972 31' Sovereign
1975 31' Excella 500
Currently Looking...
Benton
, Arkansas
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 5,868
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Both of my 31 foot Airstreams want to sway above 60 MPH.
I tried all kind of "tricks" to eliminate the sway by moving weight here and there.
Some success was found by removing weight from from the very back of the trailer, but I eliminated it with a Hensley.
My guess is that these trailers want to sway because there is so much trailer behind the wheels, kind of a pendulum effect.
My trailers towed solidly without any WD or sway control below about 62 mph, but could become a handful over 62 particularly over rutted roads, when large vehicles passed, and in down hill grades.
Superat stultitia.
__________________
The fact that I am opinionated does not presuppose that I am wrong......
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05-06-2016, 11:19 PM
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#4
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Rivet Master
2000 25' Safari
Davidson County
, NC Highlands County, FL
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 4,493
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My 2 cents.
Whether or not you need WD depends on 2 things:
1. If the downward load on your hitch and/or payload in the bed that behind the rear axle reduces the load on the front axle to a point it affects steering, then you need weight distribution to shift load onto the front axle. Consider these loads when you hit a bump and everything is bouncing downward in the rear.
2. If the downward load on your hitch and payload in the truck is to the point of overloading the rear axle, you would need weight distribution to transfer load off of the rear axle onto the front axle and trailer axles.
I'll bet your tow vehicle's owners manual will give you a pretty good idea at what hitch weight that WD will be needed for your specific vehicle.
Friction bar sway control can be used with or without WD. Maybe not the best method, but it has served for a long time. Those HaHa and PP hitches are definitely better if you are willing to spend the $.
If you have some type of WD and sway control, why not use it? It would only take a few minutes each time you hook up. It would never be less safe if you use it, probably it is safer. It might save your life in that one time you need it. Then again, it could be a waste of time. It's your choice, your life.
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05-06-2016, 11:31 PM
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#5
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Rivet Master
2012 25' FB Eddie Bauer
Vintage Kin Owner
Virginia Beach
, Virginia
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 7,801
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A W Warn
... It might save your life in that one time you need it. Then again, it could be a waste of time. It's your choice, your life.
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But if you wreck and the trailer hits a mom van in the opposite lane and kills a two year old... it's not just your life.
My grandparents drove for decades with no idea of what seatbelts were. Never needed them. Most of us will never NEED seatbelts or weight distribution. But ONCE in a lifetime IS enough.
Live Long and Prosper - Paula
__________________
Today is a gift, that's why they call it the present.
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05-07-2016, 01:32 AM
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#6
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Rivet Master
2008 22' Safari
Spicewood (W of Austin)
, Texas
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 2,921
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foiled Again
But if you wreck and the trailer hits a mom van in the opposite lane and kills a two year old... it's not just your life.
My grandparents drove for decades with no idea of what seatbelts were. Never needed them. Most of us will never NEED seatbelts or weight distribution. But ONCE in a lifetime IS enough.
Live Long and Prosper - Paula
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And if North Korea drops a nuclear missile on us you've wasted your money entirely.
With your tow vehicle sized properly and your trailer loaded properly you may not need a WDH. Test drive it and see.
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05-07-2016, 04:11 AM
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#7
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Rivet Master
2012 27' Flying Cloud
W
, New England
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 7,402
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxite
And if North Korea drops a nuclear missile on us you've wasted your money entirely.
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The difference is - you have no control over North Korea. You can exercise much more control over your rig, no?
To the OP: much much better to have and not need than the other way around. You won't need it until you do. #NikeSlogan 😀
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05-07-2016, 04:49 AM
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#8
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Rivet Master
2014 20' Flying Cloud
Sag Harbor
, New York
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 17,523
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 909kenu
. . .
My TV is a crew cab dually. It should be enough truck but reading it's not safe to tow without has me concerned.
. . .
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Welcome to the forum!
"Does your truck have OEM built-in sway control?" would be my first question.
Second, what kinds of roads are you planning on driving on?
Third, how willing are you to accept the risks associated with not using your Reese WD hitch (and there are some IMO), compared to the minimal effort needed to hook it up?
I had a 25' AS years ago with the same Reese set-up. I hardly ever towed without the Reese engaged. As a novice, I was told to use it by the prior owner, a squared-away Marine general. "Yes sir!" was my response.
We now have a Reese hitch [w/o sway control because the van has OEM SC] with 800# bars for the new FC20. I have not tried towing without the Reese, although the dealer said it would be fine. So I can't report on this aspect . . .
The main reason I like using a WD hitch is to control hobby-horsing of the rig on rural roads which have lots of ups and downs -- which sets up a bad resonance of the tow vehicle and trailer bouncing up and down separately. The Reese dampens the oscillations and allows the two vehicles to bounce around more like one less-loosey-goosey articulated single vehicle IMO.
At least this is what happened with my old trailer, and I have read that it is common because the trailer has a lot of weight well behind the axles, for instance the fresh water tank in many models. Not sure where yours is.
Anyway, as you suggest, lots of opinions and options. The carpenter in me says: "why not grab the sharpest tool in the bag when you need it?" It only takes a little extra time.
The other thought is that I don't want to end up in an out-of-control rig, thinking: "why was I too lazy to hook up the dang WD, as it might have saved my life right now . . . "
Overly dramatic? Maybe, but only maybe IMO.
Good luck!
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05-07-2016, 05:16 AM
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#9
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Rivet Master
1972 27' Overlander
Denver
, North Carolina
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 768
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To me it's like wearing a helmet when you ride motorcycles. Can you ride this way? Sure. Should you ride this way? Matter of opinion. One other consideration is this : what does your insurance company think? If you have an accident without WDH will it be covered? I don't know the answer to this, but you might want to check.
Sent from my iPhone using Airstream Forums
__________________
Lucky Dave, Denver NC
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05-07-2016, 06:06 AM
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#10
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Retired.
Currently Looking...
.
, At Large
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 21,276
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I'm pretty sure if you read the owner's manual, it will distinctly tell you whether you should use WD and sway control.
__________________
Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy, and taste good with ketchup.
Terry
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05-07-2016, 06:56 AM
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#11
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Rivet Master
1981 31' Excella II
New Market
, Alabama
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 6,145
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You don't need 1000lb bars for that trailer. I am using 750lb bars with my 31 foot trailer and it is plenty. The newer trailers have much higher hitch weight so you need larger bars for for those. I would definitely use some sort of sway control. Another issue is the stiff suspension beating your trailer to death. I pull with an Excursion that has the heavy running gear but relatively soft springs. You may not need weight distribution but you do want some bounce between the trailer and the truck. The trailer structure would probably be happier without the bars.
Perry
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05-07-2016, 07:58 AM
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#12
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"Cloudsplitter"
2003 25' Classic
Houstatlantavegas
, Malebolgia
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 19,977
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WD & SWAY control...
......."My TV is a crew cab dually."
Your plans for sway are?
Your trailer will sway, with the dueler you may not feel it 'til the point of no return.
I believe that configuring both to your rig would be advisable.
600-800lb bars with dual friction sway...easy way out.
Bob
__________________
"You don't know where you've been until you leave, enjoy life" RLC
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05-07-2016, 08:33 AM
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#13
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2 Rivet Member
1976 Argosy 26
diamond bar
, California
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by overlander63
I'm pretty sure if you read the owner's manual, it will distinctly tell you whether you should use WD and sway control.
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I have been trying to read that manual and figure it out. I copied this from RAM website.
Towing
The Ram 3500 dominates with a Best-in-Class towing capacity of up to 31,210 lb (14,157 kg)3. A Class V receiver hitch with 18,000 lb (8,164 kg) capacity, 4- and 7-pin trailer tow wiring connectors, and Electronic Stability Control 16 with Trailer Sway Control come standard.
Payload
Hauling loads is just as important to heavy duty owners so get the best. The Ram 3500 also dominates with
Best-in-Class payload of up to 7,390 lb (3,352 kg)3.
I did not know TSC was standard. Is it good enough? Will the old Reese with the 1000 lbs bars help? Or buy new WD and/or sway control? Or PP or HaHa?
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05-07-2016, 08:43 AM
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#14
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2 Rivet Member
1976 Argosy 26
diamond bar
, California
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by perryg114
You don't need 1000lb bars for that trailer. I am using 750lb bars with my 31 foot trailer and it is plenty. The newer trailers have much higher hitch weight so you need larger bars for for those. I would definitely use some sort of sway control. Another issue is the stiff suspension beating your trailer to death. I pull with an Excursion that has the heavy running gear but relatively soft springs. You may not need weight distribution but you do want some bounce between the trailer and the truck. The trailer structure would probably be happier without the bars.
Perry
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This is infact the roughest riding truck I have owned. Rides best loaded. Through my reading the posts, I wondered about the trailer structure, and I think I would agree....no WD. Some sort of sway control? Would the trucks sway control be enough?
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05-07-2016, 08:56 AM
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#15
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2 Rivet Member
1976 Argosy 26
diamond bar
, California
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS
......."My TV is a crew cab dually."
Your plans for sway are?
Your trailer will sway, with the dueler you may not feel it 'til the point of no return.
I believe that configuring both to your rig would be advisable.
600-800lb bars with dual friction sway...easy way out.
Bob
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That is exactly what the previous owner said. He wanted me to use his old set up but the receiver was non adjustable booger welded mess that was too high for the trailer. Towed the Argosy back at speed limit with rotted tires, San Diego to Los Angeles, 2am, no traffic. Trailer tows well.
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05-07-2016, 09:01 AM
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#16
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Moderator
2015 25' FB Flying Cloud
2012 23' FB Flying Cloud
2005 25' Safari
Santa Rosa Beach
, Florida
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 13,153
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We tow our 25FB with a Silverado one ton SRW. I would not tow our Airstream without a weight distribution/anti sway hitch system.
Brian
__________________
SuEllyn & Brian McCabe
WBCCI #3628 -- AIR #14872 -- TAC #FL-7
2015 FC 25' FB (Lucy) with ProPride
2020 Silverado 2500 (Vivian)
2023 Rivian R1T (Opal)
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05-07-2016, 09:27 AM
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#17
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Rivet Master
1974 Argosy 26
Morrill
, Nebraska
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,014
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I use an Andersen WD - sway control to tow my 26' Argosy. It works well on my 3/4 ton Dodge, also on my Tundra.
My concern is the 1ton truck rides hard and some of that hard ride will transfer to the coach. There are "air ride" systems but I don't know if they are compatible with WD systems and/or anti sway systems.
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05-07-2016, 10:35 AM
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#18
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3 Rivet Member
Currently Looking...
belen
, New Mexico
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 191
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ANYthing 3/4 ton and above NO worries! I had air bags in my cummins and I would put the hight at a perfect place for no sway!
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05-07-2016, 10:52 AM
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#19
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Rivet Master
Airstream Dealer
Corona
, California
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 16,497
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 909kenu
Recently acquired 26 Argosy, came with a Reese WD hitch (1000lbs bars). I was not planning to use it or any other WD/sway control. But reading the most of the posts it may be a requirement even for long wheel base trucks.
I have experience towing boats, utility trailers, construction equipment since the early 90's. I have even experienced violent sway and hit a K-rail due to a shifted load to the rear. I was much younger then. I check and recheck tie downs from that experience.
I understand the concept of safety vs. cost. But what is it that makes the Airstream different from my friends toy hauler? The shape? Axle placement? Or is it when the front fresh water tank is empty and the rears are full (tongue weight)?
My TV is a crew cab dually. It should be enough truck but reading it's not safe to tow without has me concerned.
Is sway control without weight distribution available or even an option?
Sorry, if its a beat to death topic
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SAFETY AND MORE SAFETY
Be sure to tell all your passengers that you kicked to the curb all the rules of safety and Physics.
Using a load equalizing hitch, properly rated, properly installed and properly adjusted, could never ever create negative safety. Using it will add safety to some degree and that's a positive.
Should you lose control and hurt someone or their property, any attorney in the world, would through the book at you, simply because you had a unsafe rig on the highways.
Do everything you can, to create a safe rig as possible. Then if something negative happens, you can at least say that you did everything you could to be safe. In the absence of a load equalizing hitch, you did nothing. That, fellow Airstreamer, will haunt you the rest of your life.
How do I know ? I was the sole field rep for the old Insurance division of Airstream. Having to deal with survivors of a bad accident that could have been prevented, was indeed a very tough job.
Andy
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05-07-2016, 11:57 AM
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#20
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4 Rivet Member
1976 25' Caravanner
Salt Lake City
, Utah
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 398
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alantbird
ANYthing 3/4 ton and above NO worries! I had air bags in my cummins and I would put the hight at a perfect place for no sway!
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I'm just curious . . .
What do you mean to say by "no worries" with a 3/4 ton? No sway control? No wd? Or minimal bar rating?
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