Nissan with a Cummins?

[dznf0g]

Silverado/Sierra Assembly plants

Flint, MI = HD Crew cabs
HD Regular cabs

Fort Wayne, IN = LD Double cab
LD regular cabs
HD double cabs

Silao, Mexico = LD crew cabs

[m.hony]

I have seen a couple of the Nexico ones-
Both 2011 half-ton LTZ Crew cabs- identical except one had a 5.3 and the other had a 6.2.


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[switz]

The Duramax diesel is an Isuzu design. That company is based in Japan and partnered with GM who could not make a decent small diesel to save their hide. Just down the GM corporate hallway is Detroit Diesel that could have made that V8 diesel that Oldsmobile and the Suburban desperately needed.

The Cummins in the Dodge and Ford's diesel engines are US made.

[dznf0g]

Originally Posted by switz

The Duramax diesel is an Isuzu design. That company is based in Japan and partnered with GM who could not make a decent small diesel to save their hide. Just down the GM corporate hallway is Detroit Diesel that could have made that V8 diesel that Oldsmobile and the Suburban desperately needed.

The Cummins in the Dodge and Ford's diesel engines are US made.

Detroit Diesel was sold several decades ago.
Dmax is a joint venture with shared engineering responsibilities.

"DMAX is a joint venture, 60 percent owned by GM, 40 percent owned by Isuzu Diesel Services of America, Inc. The award-winning Duramax 6.6-liter V-8 is a four-valve high pressure common rail direct injection diesel currently equipped with a diesel particulate filter to meet the stringent 2010 emissions requirements. Available in GM's Chevrolet Silverado and GMC Sierra heavy-duty pickups, the engine delivers a segment-leading 397 horsepower at 3,000 rpm and 765 lb.-ft. of torque at 1,600 rpm – an improvement of 32 horsepower and 105 lb.-ft. of torque over last year’s engine. The Duramax is also available in GM's full-size vans, Chevrolet Express and GMC Savana."

Duramax engines are produced in Ohio:

"From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
This article is about the Duramax V8. For the Duramax 6-cylinder, see Isuzu 6H Engine.
Duramax Diesel engine
Overview
Manufacturer DMAX
Production 2001–
Chronology
Predecessor 6.2 and 6.5 L Detroit Diesel
The Duramax is a General Motors diesel engine family for light to medium duty trucks, designed by GM and Isuzu. The 6.6-liter Duramax is produced by DMAX, a joint venture between GM and Isuzu in Moraine, Ohio. The Duramax block and heads are poured at The Defiance GM Powertrain foundry in Defiance, Ohio. This engine was initially installed in 2001 model year Chevy and GMC trucks and has been an option since then in pickups, vans, and medium-duty trucks. In 2006, production at Moraine was reportedly limited to approximately 200,000 engines per year.[1] On May 9, 2007, DMAX announced the production of the 1,000,000th Duramax V-8 diesel at its Moraine facility.[1]"

[DHart]

The Duramax is a rock solid diesel engine that has been thoroughly time-tested and well-proven. We Duramax owners are most appreciative of them in our GM trucks.

[m.hony]

Conversation at work with several guys about the Nissan/Cummins-
5 guys drive Chevys- (1) Duramax/Allison 3/4 ton, (1) 6.0 gas 3/4 ton, (1) 5.3 half ton, (1) 5.7 half ton Silverado, and (1) 5.7 Suburban
1 guy drives a Ford 5.4 F150
1 guy drives a Tundra 5.7
None of them think the Nissan is a game changer-
Not even in the game-



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[crispyboy]

Originally Posted by switz

The Cummins in the Dodge and Ford's diesel engines are US made.

I thought the Ford 6.7 motor was manufactured in Chihuahua, Mexico......

[n2916s]

Brand loyalty in pickup trucks is a powerful force. I'm as guilty as anyone -- I am a Nissan guy and will be buying an XD once the initial hoopla dies down and deals can be made BUT I realize that this truck is not going to pry many pickup owners out of their Fords, Rams and Chevys.

If Nissan is going to sell enough of these to make a few bucks, they are going to need to market them to people just entering the market for a pickup.

So far, their marketing for the XD has been pitiful so maybe the new Titan ends up like the old Titan, a solid vehicle that just languishes without any meaningful updates for a decade or so...

For me, it fits perfectly as I've had a great ownership experience with my 2004 Titan and the XD will give me 3000# more towing capacity (in case I trip across a cherry '34 Airstream) and about 500# more payload.

The cost of all the new pickups, foreign, domestic and semi-domestic, when decked out to tow, is pretty demoralizing.

Mike

[DHart]

Originally Posted by n2916s

For me, it fits perfectly as I've had a great ownership experience with my 2004 Titan and the XD will give me 3000# more towing capacity (in case I trip across a cherry '34 Airstream) and about 500# more payload.

Mike... be careful with payload... a 34' Airstream could have a tongue weight of 1100-1400# fully loaded. Then, depending on the weight of passengers and whatever else you might want to carry in the truck, you could be maxing out the cargo capacity quickly. If you're light on passengers and very light on other stuff you might want to carry in the truck, you may be fine. Otherwise, this truck's cargo capacity may not serve you well, in spite of its towing capacity.

[n2916s]

Thanks for the heads up! My current Titan is payload limited as well. Have learned to pack light...

Mike

[excellaf350]

here's my $.02

Looks like a nice truck. obviously copied some styling from the F150 but I am hopefull it will sell well. I personally have an older 03 F350 (7.3) and I tow a 34'. I have been looking at newer trucks but a new 3/4 ton diesel is largely overkill for a 9-10k lb trailer. But I don't want a gasser. IMO its fine for smaller trailers but with a 10k lb 34 I want more TQ and more pulling power. But im old school. I would rather have way too much than not enough.

This new Titan truck is promising. IMO, its a glimpse towards the future of cars and truck in the USA. It got more HP and TQ (310/555) than my old 7.3 (250/525) with the addition of better gearing and a 6 speed. Its tow rating is similar to my old F350 which is rated at 12,500 lbs and the Titan is 12,200 I think. I am quite comfortable pulling my 34 with 525 lbs of TQ behind a 4 speed. Set the cruise at 68-70 and roll. On steep hills I do have to drop gear and turn 2500 rpm with 16lbs of boost to get up the hill but its only on occasion.

the difference I see is the truck GVW itself. My old F350 is 9900 lbs and this new Titan is only 8900. The payload is only 2090 lbs. Its going to be hard to drop 1200/1300 lb tougne weight on that Titan AND have enough room for the people and gear I also want to carry.

Are these new ratings on the Titan XD conservative? I hope so. My gut tells me they are, and this truck will handle a 10,000 lb 34 no problem, reguardless of the "numbers".

There is a world of people out there who want diesel but don't need to haul a 17,000 lb 5er. This truck represents the possibility of having a Diesel truck with enough grunt to pull around a family with an RV or a boat, or even a race car. And not have to struggle up a hill with the ol gasser turning 4200 rpm.

I wont run out to buy one just yet. Being the first real world experience for Nissan I have more concerns of the tech in the shops trying to work on them. Brakes are brakes, tires are tires, transmission is a transmission. Getting a tech whos worked on Gas cars for 20 years to suddenly pick up a lifetime of knowledge and troubleshooting of a modern diesel and after treatment system??? that's gonna be a hard one and I will wait to see. Fortunately i'm not in a position for a new truck right now so its easy to say that. Many Ford/Chevy and Dodge dealers still have problems getting good work and troubleshooting from their service departments. They have had years of experience at this point.

In the end I see this Titan XD as a win/win for the future of trucks. IMO diesel is the way to go for better fuel economy and emissions. The Gasoline world as close to its topped out point but the Diesel world is just scratching the surface.

There are lots of videos out there and after watching a lot of them, I believe Cummins has stepped up and really made a game changer engine for the world of Pick up trucks. Kudos to Nissan for taking on the chalange.

Im a GM guy at heart but my 10 year old Yukon has been plagued with so many problems it has made me reconsider. Sure it starts and drives every day but at 95,000 miles the list of problems goes on and on and on. power widows, door locks, seat heaters, hvac issues, 4X4 problems, electronics problems.... I could literally list over 100 problems. I'm aware its 10+ years old but I paid $39,000 for a truck and the day the warranty ran out its been noting but nickel and dime stuff. Its had me thinking twice about jumping ship on brand loyalty.

[TG2500]

Just got a new Titan XD to pull my 26U - traded down from my RAM3500 which was an amazing truck but way more than I needed and not the greatest daily driver. So far, XD is great but haven't yet hitched up (still winter here in upstate NY).

[mojo]

Originally Posted by TG2500

Just got a new Titan XD to pull my 26U.

Please keep us updated on your experiences towing with the XD...the good, the bad, and hopefully not the ugly!

[A W Warn]

I stopped by a Nisan dealer today to look at the new diesel 1/2 ton. The one I looked at was a crew cab tricked out with every option offered, except 4 wheel drive. My first thought was it was a really nice truck that I would consider. Then I looked at the door sticker, $59k+. Then I looked at the door placard payload capacity. It was 1,444 lbs. It is not rated to haul me and the 34's tongue weight at the same time!

The 2016's not the truck for me!

Maybe they are just being conservative with the new truck and will up the payload capacity in future year models.

[KJRitchie]

If it had 4x4 it would probably only have 1300lbs labeled payload.

Kelvin

[excellaf350]

Max payload is 2090 lbs when properly equipped. Wish I knew what the correct setup was for that payload. You are right though @ only 1400 lbs you basically have enough for the driver and tongue weight of a 34. Not enough for most peps.

My suspicion is that these numbers are conservative. My old 03 F350 is rated at 9900, 12500 tow, 20,000 combined. 3400 lb payload. (225 hp/525 tq) in the real world the only way that truck will hold 3300 lbs is if it only weighed 6000 lbs. my empty weight is almost 8000.

Ratings are just numbers the mfgs have to put out there by law. There's a lot of fluff and opinion with different mfgs. There's no real set standard. I'm not sayin to dump 2 ton of stone in your new Titan but, my gut says it can haul a 34 with the wife and kids onboard. (If you get one with that is set up right).

They got the hp and tq to be a player in the game. Time will tell if this truck can sell. If they are making a diesel truck that's decently equipped that One can buy for around 45-50k... It's definitely worth a look.

[dznf0g]

"Ratings are just numbers the mfgs have to put out there by law. There's a lot of fluff and opinion with different mfgs. There's no real set standard."

NOTTTTT!!!!!!! This myth keeps being perpetuated and lives...but it is a myth!

[excellaf350]

Originally Posted by dznf0g

"Ratings are just numbers the mfgs have to put out there by law. There's a lot of fluff and opinion with different mfgs. There's no real set standard."

NOTTTTT!!!!!!! This myth keeps being perpetuated and lives...but it is a myth!

I'll agree to an extent. Like I said if the truck is "rated" for 1000 lbs of payload I wouldn't suggest piling 4000 lbs in it. But there is a lot more wiggle room in ratings than you may think. But that wiggle room varys from MFG to MFG. Some may have little to none while others are very conservative. The regulations in this area just aren't stringent enough to be thoroughly accurate by all.

if a truck weighs 7000 lbs and has a GVW of 8900 how can it possibly have a payload capacity of anything more than 1900 lbs?


payload is calculated by GVW of the vehicle minus the actual weight. period. yet some MFG's still post payload numbers that are outside of this realm. It appears Nissan is posting number with the GVW minus actual weight standard. IMO (and its just an opinion) is that the Titan with 310hp/555tq and a 6 speed auto will haul a 34' and your family no problem. You may end up over the payload or GVW rating of the truck. I have no doubt I go over the 9900 lb rating of my 13 year old F350 every time we go camping and it does just fine.

[dznf0g]

The pure definition of Payload is GVWR - curb weight. Some manufacturers calculate payload as GVWR - curb weight + 1 (or sometimes + 2) occupants. Full fuel and fluids is pretty standard.

But where I have a problem is the belief that one can go over GVWR, GAWR, payload, etc. without any long term ramifications (at best), and that the numbers are just "marketing numbers", and mean nothing. Also, it is very risky to assume there is "wiggle room" or "margin" or "conservative assignment" in these numbers. I have seen some lines where this is true, to some extent....and some where it is in no way true. But to assign some margin number by the SWAG method is false!!! Period! I have had this discussion with many design and durability engineers in my career.

For example: My Silverado 1500 maxtow:

GVWR = 7600#
Curb weight = 5409#
Payload = 2034#

7600 - 5409 = 2191

2191- 2034 = 157 (150 pounds is the standard "allowance" for one occupant). There are 7#s I can't account for.

[rostam]

Originally Posted by dznf0g

...
But where I have a problem is the belief that one can go over GVWR, GAWR, payload, etc. without any long term ramifications (at best), and that the numbers are just "marketing numbers", and mean nothing. Also, it is very risky to assume there is "wiggle room" or "margin" or "conservative assignment" in these numbers. I have seen some lines where this is true, to some extent....and some where it is in no way true. But to assign some margin number by the SWAG method is false!!! Period! I have had this discussion with many design and durability engineers in my career.
...

I fully agree. If these numbers really meant nothing, why would Nissan slap a sub-par 1500# payload on Titan and put themselves in a disadvantage with their competitors? Why not slap a 2000# payload number?