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Old 11-16-2003, 03:50 PM   #41
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Here is the VW
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Old 11-16-2003, 03:53 PM   #42
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I missed the first try.....
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Old 11-17-2003, 07:15 AM   #43
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Beware of the Touareg!

To anyone considering the VW Touareg please think again! I'm the poor guy in the CBS piece who first reported this problem to VW. I went through a very heated battle with VW for months and finally after contacting CBS they relented and re-purchased my Touareg and gave me a full refund.

I am now towing my 22ft CCD with a Lincoln Aviator and it's a breeze.

Please stay away from that car if you are towing anything other than a couple of jetskis or something. They have not fully tested it's capabilities, and it's not worth the risk.

Bluvalley
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Old 11-17-2003, 08:09 AM   #44
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Unhappy

Bluvalley-

I've followed your difficulties with the Airstream/Touareg towing combination on the VWvortex T-reg forum and viewed the CBS segment. You've been through a very frustrating experience and I'm glad you're happy with your new setup.

I'm curious, though, was the nature of the problem due to the fact that VW requires the use of their ball/hitch stinger in order to be covered under their warranty? (Thus preventing the use of a weight-distributing hitch setup)

Or, are there other factors involved with the Touareg which led to your conclusions.
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Old 11-17-2003, 07:42 PM   #45
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BluValley,

Am I understanding the previous posting that the Touareg's tow equipment doesn't allow for load leveling bars? No wonder you wer having problems!
We tow a 3300 lbs 20 ft 1967 Airstream Globetrotter with an '03 Discovery Land Rover with no air load- leveling rear suspension, just coil springs all way around.
We use an Equalizer brand load-leveling hitch and it tows beautifully.
Good work grinding on a major auto company.
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Old 11-17-2003, 08:24 PM   #46
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Re: Beware of the Touareg!

Quote:
Originally posted by bluvalley
To anyone considering the VW Touareg please think again! I'm the poor guy in the CBS piece who first reported this problem to VW. I went through a very heated battle with VW for months and finally after contacting CBS they relented and re-purchased my Touareg and gave me a full refund.

I am now towing my 22ft CCD with a Lincoln Aviator and it's a breeze.

Please stay away from that car if you are towing anything other than a couple of jetskis or something. They have not fully tested it's capabilities, and it's not worth the risk.

Bluvalley
Only a 22'? That is way under what our overenthusiastic friends from Germany said it would do! They claim something like 7000lb towing capacity, and the CCD should weigh a little under 4000.
I am not familiar with the Lincoln version you have. Does it have a V8, or the 4.0 V6?
And let me add my congratulations for winning the battle with VW.
Terry
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Old 11-18-2003, 07:28 AM   #47
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The Lincoln Aviator is an upscale Ford Explorer, but with a 302 hp V8 (vs the 239 HP V8 available in the Explorer). Should be a great tow vehicle.
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Old 11-18-2003, 09:01 AM   #48
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Touareg

What VW specifically told me was that they would not recommend using a weight distribution sytem and that in order to not void the warranty I had to use their supplied arm/ball which of course would not work.

So that was the main problem. The underlying issue is the fact that the car is a unibody construction so it is not clear how a weight distribution system would affect the frame, if at all. Bottom line, to many questions and not enough answers.

As for the numbers VW provided, 616 tongue weight and 7700 lb towing capacity, I truly feel that these numbers were pulled out of thin air and were clearly overstated to sell the vehicle to a broader market. They even admitted as much.

In the end I did get my money back as a result of there "mishap" but I still haven't been able to use my Airstream since I bought it. Living in the Northeast most campgrounds are closed as of 10/15, so now I have to wait until next Spring.

I did take it on one trip. To the dealer to have it winterized. Boo Hoo.

Anyway, this is a great forum and I'm looking forward to sharing my first camping trip once it happens.

Bluvalley
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Old 11-19-2003, 04:36 PM   #49
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Re: Touareg

Quote:
Originally posted by bluvalley

In the end I did get my money back as a result of there "mishap" but I still haven't been able to use my Airstream since I bought it. Living in the Northeast most campgrounds are closed as of 10/15, so now I have to wait until next Spring.

I did take it on one trip. To the dealer to have it winterized. Boo Hoo.

Anyway, this is a great forum and I'm looking forward to sharing my first camping trip once it happens.

Bluvalley
You could come to South Florida. Our camping season has just started. Temps in the low 80's, lower humidity, fewer mosquitoes, less rain.
6 million winter residents can't be wrong...
Terry
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Old 11-19-2003, 05:29 PM   #50
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Thumbs up I agree

DPeakMD
As I was at the dealership today having my Burb fixed, I walked over to the VW section(multi-dealership) and, got a bird's eyeview of the underside of the Touareg.
Yes, everything you said is completely consisted with what I could judge..I didn't test drive it but, as for the finish, I completely agree.
Interesting tho, in talking to the sales manager, they are being told by VW now, that only a Class 3 or Class 2 receiver can be installed. Also, VW is stressing not the spec of the tow weigh but, more importantly..the spec on the tongue weigh`!
Just thought I'd throw that in for what it's worth, since it seems to be the latest grind..

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Old 11-19-2003, 05:30 PM   #51
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The VW

I have driven the 03 model. It is a very nice car, SUV or whatever they call it. The V-8 makes it a rocket. So much of one that if you aren't careful you could kiss your license good bye. The hitch is a dealer installed option that goes in behind the bumper. The dealership that I went to said that they actually remove the bumper to install the hitch. I have seem one installed and it looks good under there. Now as for the 7700# tow rating...I'm not to sure it would do a good job with my '86 32' Excella. Over all a great ride. We are considering purchasing one.
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Old 11-19-2003, 05:42 PM   #52
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Florida

Thanks Terry,

I just might consider that. My mother and Aunt are both there for the winter and they keep bugging me to visit.

Happy Thanksgiving!
James
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Old 01-03-2004, 08:23 AM   #53
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From the North American Auto Show WEB site today,

"At the NAIAS 2004, the German automaker will debut one of the most powerful diesel engines ever available in a passenger vehicle. The Touareg, VW’s new SUV, will feature a 5.0-liter V10 TDI engine that will produce more than 550 lb-ft of torque at just 2000 rpm. In addition, the Passat TDI, Jetta GLI and the sporty Golf R32 will be featured. Also on hand will be the Concept R roadster, first shown at the Frankfurt Motor Show last September."
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Old 02-20-2004, 12:48 PM   #54
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Touareg good tow vehicle?

Just got my latest copy of RV Lifestyle, they are testing the Touareg with a 28 ft Airstream. First the VW dealer installed a trailer hitch, with a towning capacity of 7,716 pounds. (I think that was the main problem with the hitch on the CBS tape.) Then they installed a Hensley on the Airstream. This is one of the coments. (An outstanding tow vehicle,the Touareg easily pulled the 6,700 pound Airstream. It handled sudden lane changes at highway speeds effortlessy, with no evidence of body rolll or of diving in the corners.) Not what I would want for a tow vehicle bud don't like seeing VW get a bad rap because something wasn't set up properly. Marvin
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Old 02-20-2004, 06:05 PM   #55
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Question

Marvin, did they happen to mention in the article whether the Touareg was equipped with the optional air suspension? I was just wondering how this might interact with the weight distribution effects of the Hensley. Any guesses at what the hitch weight of the Airstream plus the added weight of the Hensley is? Is it over their recommended hitch weight??? It's got to be getting close!
----Dallas

P.S. Here's the link to the magazine's website with a couple of teasers for the articlewww.rvlifemag.com and a picture of the T*reg with RV mirrors and a Hensley visible!
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Old 02-20-2004, 07:16 PM   #56
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Dallas, Yes they said their test vechicle was equiped with air suspension but didn's say anything about the effects on the trailer. Also they said that this was a 30ft classic but they also said that the dry weight was 6700 pounds which is the dry weight of a 28 ft. I think the 30 ft classic is a little over 7000. Marvin
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Old 02-20-2004, 07:29 PM   #57
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You're right, Marvin. I took a look at the RV Lifestyle website. The Airstream they tested is the 30'. The dinette is visible in one of the pictures, so it's got to be the 30'. The Airstream website lists this trailer with a hitchweight of 730# (w/o options or variable weight) and a dry weight of 7320#. I have a Hensley arrow and I would guess the added weight is close to 100# more! So it looks like this was quite a bit over the hitch weight but still under the allowable towing weight. What does it all mean? I'll wait for others to comment. Thanks for the reply!----Dallas
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Old 02-25-2004, 05:16 AM   #58
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Lightbulb

I provide the following for discussion - no flames, please!

-------

The article below is from the current issue of RV Lifestyle Magazine:

The Volkswagen Touareg for 2004 ... by Garth W. Cane

This is not your father’s Volkswagen Bug- that had a rear air cooled engine and terrible heater. This premium luxury SUV frees you from the obstacles of travelling in areas that have difficult road surfaces for ordinary cars to manoeuver. The Touareg name means "free folk" and is the name of a nomadic tribe from the Sahara. With a full-time four-wheel-drive system and room for five passengers with lots of cargo (31 cubic feet with the rear seats up and 71 cubic feet when folded), the Touareg boasts a trailer towing rating of 7,716 pounds in both V6 and V8.

Since the trailer hitch for the Touareg is a $1000 dealer installed option, we took our test vehicle to CedarBrae Volkswagen on Markham Road where Mike Bruene dropped the rear bumper, bolted on the hitch, installed the lighting control unit and re-program the lights, re-installed the bumper, then wired the Tekonsha brake control under the dash. This process takes about three hours to complete. I would like to think that this would be done at the factory where nothing would need to be taken apart, but VW considers that the dealers should do the installation.

The permanent four wheel drive system is called 4XMOTION™ and automatically shifts power between axles to match driving conditions, such as pulling your trailer up a gravel hill to the campground. The 4XMOTION system includes an adjustable multi-plate clutch of the center differential that is automatically controlled by the Differential Control Module. During normal operation, torque is distributed from the engine to the front and rear axles (on a 50/50% split) by the automatic transmission and center differential. The multi-plate center differential lock is allowed to disengage whenever the Differential Control Module determines a power differential between the front and rear axles is required. A transfer case, equipped with off-road reduction, delivers power to drive the wheels via electronically controlled differentials. With the option rear differential lock, up to 100% of the torque can be used by any wheel that still has traction.

Touareg’s standard independent suspension contributes to the vehicle’s outstanding on-road and off-road capabilities allowing the vehicle to navigate very difficult terrain on the way to your favorite lake. Our test vehicle had optional air suspension and Continuous Damping Control that adapts the suspension to driving conditions and vehicle speed. The damping characteristics of the shock absorbers are adjusted from the input of sensors that monitor road conditions through vehicle movement. The air suspension will raise the body in two different stages to provide more ground clearance for off-road driving. The Touareg also features a Hill Climb Assist that prevents the vehicle from rolling back on a steep incline. Not only does it keep the vehicle steady, it makes it easier to accelerate up the hill from a standing stop after photographing the scenic view from the lookout on the mountain road.

The Touareg’s body has a completely new, self-supporting construction and provides as much static and dynamic rigidity as possible. The body does not flex or twist, even in the most tortuous off-road driving conditions.

The body’s high dynamic torsional rigidity contributes to Touareg’s stability and driving comfort. The rock-solid chassis allows the doors, hood and tailgate to close without problems, even with the tightest gap tolerances. The body structure also provides optimum design for the running gear properties, and the Touareg’s front mud wings are made of a flexible plastic material for added durability. The bumpers are made of thermal-resistant, extremely rugged plastic that protects them from heat emanating from the engine compartment and exhaust system, and they are flexible enough to protect against parking lot dings.

The center console provides quick, convenient access to the controls, including the gear shift selector, mirror adjustment switch and the switch for running gear and height adjustable self-levelling suspension. All controls are positioned ergonomically, in easy sight and reach of the driver, including a knob for dampening control. Our Touareg had the standard AM/FM radio with CD player, but for Rvers, the Navigation package would be ideal for travelling in unfamiliar country.

The large tailgate with an independently opening window guarantees optimum accessibility and convenience. The two-piece tailgate, opened by invisible spring absorber units, also offers a high degree of technical details and tactile luxury. The tailgate is unlocked electronically by either the keyfob or a switch on the driver’s door and an adjustable roof rack is standard.

Touareg’s luxury character begins with world-class dual-zone Climatronic™ air conditioning system with separate temperature levels for the right and left side. An available four-zone "Climatronic" system provides two individual temperatures, air flow and air distribution zones for the front as well as the rear passengers. Both systems feature residual heating function, activated charcoal dust and pollen filter, and an air-conditioned glove box.

Touareg offers exceptionally comfortable front seating with standard eight-way manual adjustment on the V6 and standard 12-way power adjustment on the V8. The 12-way power front seats are adjustable to longitudinal position, height, seat and backrest angle by means of buttons directly on the seat. Integrated lumbar support and electrically adjustable (up/down, front/back) controls conform the seat to the best anatomical, fatigue-free position. All front seats are heatable.

The noise and comfort level of this luxury sedan are guaranteed by the acoustically insulated subframe, with double wishbone construction of the front axle and four-link suspension of the rear axle. The enhanced Traction Control System prevents the drive wheels from spinning on snow or loose gravel with braking action or engine torque. The standard Electronic Differential Lock makes it easier to drive when one wheel is on the pavement and the other on the shoulder of the road, where different surfaces have different friction, by braking the spinning wheel.

The standard engine is a V6 3.2L 24-valve that produces 220 hp at 5400 rpm and has 225 pounds-feet of torque at 3200 rpm. The optional V8 in our test vehicle produced 310 hp at 6200 rpm with 302 pounds-feet of torque at 3000 rpm. A deeper oil pan and a spraying tube facilitate oil distribution in off-road situations. More belt-to-pulley contact prevents the accessory belt from slipping when driving through water.

The six-speed automatic transmission reduces fuel consumption , and reduces emissions for quieter operation than five-speed units. The "Tiptronic" transmission allows manual-style shifting by moving the gear selector from "D" to the right and gently moving the lever forward or backward to shift the gears up or down. A Sport position automatically selects gears at higher engine speeds, resulting in quicker acceleration. This transmission is one of the smoothest shifting we have driven. It effortlessly shifts down from 6th to 5th on steep hills without losing speed, and the upshifts can hardly be felt.

The air suspension will raise the body in two different stages to provide more ground clearance for off-road driving. These variable settings give Touareg an advantage in off-road situations by providing outstanding approach angles, departure angles and breakover angles to permit the vehicle to easily negotiate hills, rocks and other rugged terrain that many conventional SUVs cannot handle.

Going down a steep hill is easier for Touareg because of Hill Descent Control. At speeds of less than 15 mph on a decline of 20 percent or more, this control automatically cuts engine torque to slow the vehicle and enhance engine control. If necessary, the brakes will be applied automatically. The sporty Touareg V8 (228 kW / 310 bhp ) develops no less than 302 pounds-feet of torque accelerating the Touareg to 100 km/hr in just 8.1 seconds.

The Touareg can climb a 45% incline and also remain stable when crossing the side of a hill. The door seals prevent water from entering, and with waterproof headlamps and connectors, special air intake ducting, the Touareg can ford water up to 500 millimeters ( 580 millimeters with air suspension) without a problem.

The key, that is like no other key, is a flat bar with grooves engraved in each side instead of notches along the edges, and has a transponder to recognize its driver.

We borrowed a 30-foot Classic Airstream travel trailer equipped with a Hensley hitch from Andy and Kirk Thomson at Can-Am RV in London for our test of the Touareg. We weighed the combination at the Flying "J" scale on Highbury Ave in London to be sure that we were within the 7700 pound design limts of the Touareg’s towing capacity. The Airstream came in at 6700 pounds giving us another 1000 pounds of load carrying capability for food and clothing.

This SUV was a delight to drive, both solo and with a trailer in tow. I had to watch that I did not accelerate too quickly with so much power available at the wheels. The Touareg handled the trailer very well in sudden lane changes at highway speeds with no body roll or diving in the corners. This is one fantastic tow vehicle that can tow a substantial trailer like the Airstream without any effort and in complete comfort.


My one disappointment was the placement of the cup holders for the driver and passenger. It was necessary to place your wrist in an unnatural position to insert the cup or remove it from its position at the rear of the console. Base price for the V8 Touareg in Canada is $60,550. Our test model equipped with Bi-xenon headlamps, winter package, 19" alloy wheels with summer tires, four corner air suspension, and rear differential lock was $69,350. The V6 will sell for $52,000.

Garth W. Cane
Technical Director
RV Lifestyle Magazine
Taylor Publishing Group
1020 Brevik Place,Ste 5
Mississauga, ON L4W 4N7
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Old 02-25-2004, 06:58 AM   #59
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I just don't agree towing a 30' Classic with that car. It's like the folks that tow with the Intrepids.

I have a very meaty V8 body on frame car and I am even kind of uneasy with towing my 25' Safari. I can tell you first hand that my car when it towed a 19' Bambi 4600lb wet weight you sure as heck knew it was back there. I've modded my tow vehicle in many areas too to compensate. My point, good VW, bad idea........ I feel the car does have merit, but I would not tow more than a 22' coach with it and most likely would only tow 19' with it. I think towing larger, regardless of what VW or the rag sheets say is really suicide.

Other than towing it's a really great SUV. As a matter of fact, you could spend more on it's Porshe sibling....but way?

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Old 02-25-2004, 07:46 AM   #60
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I think this is a good setup, as I said before it is not my choice, but I like a truck.
I have went to Can-Am and towed a 34ft trailer with the Dodge Intrepid it works great, good acceleration and handling got up to 70 mph very easy, tows better than my 25ft Tradewind with the truck.
I see on this fourm and others statements like, "That would be suicide" and "Let me know what road you are going to be on so I can stay off the road.
I would like to know the difference in towing a 7000 lb trailer with a VW going down a 6% grade and having the brakes go out on the trailer or towing a 15000 lb trailer with a 2500HD going down a 6% grade and having the brakes go out on the trailer? I think the end result would be about the same. Marvin
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