My observations of a Power Wagon as a tow vehicle

[slowmover]

Quite a drop to that hitch shank. Leverage.

I'd rather have the Reese 42995 hitch receiver on there than the factory piece. Still doubt the factory piece is as substantial. And given the leverage I'd consider additional bracing. Is your approach of lightest bars what Thomson recommends?

[Bruce B]

Originally Posted by BoldAdventure

It rides really nice thanks to the D load range tires and soft suspension. The Power Wagon probably rides softer than most 2500's because the springs are so soft to allow for greater articulation off-road. That's also the reason they suffer a payload hit. But it's what we wanted.

It doesn't have tow mirrors, but has power fold. This is a current issue. It had every option I wanted but those. Still, I went for it because I bought used, and it was the first one I've seen configured the way I wanted it without the silly graphics in months.

It was one owner and custom ordered according to build sheet, it might be that selecting power fold removes tow mirrors.

1AAuto had power fold tow mirrors in stock. They temporarily stopped selling them after several customers had problems with the motors. They said they were getting them back in stock this month with the issue fixed. I've been looking, but they haven't yet.

I would like to hold out for power fold. But if they are not available in the next couple of weeks, I am just going to move forward and purchase the manual fold tow mirrors.....

I love the power fold option of our Ram tow mirrors on our 2016 but talk about strange mirrors to get used to!

I'm still not 100% comfortable when using these mirrors in either tow mode (flipped up) or even in regular mode.

I have taken pride in my ability to adjust the regular (non tow) mirrors of car properly for years to eliminate blind spots. It has always allowed me a grasp of whatever is happening behind me at a glance with ease.

With the mirrors on this truck, I'm kind of at a loss as to the correct setup.
I'm getting there but it has taken me time and some adjustment! It is the convex smaller mirror that baffles me and throws me off... I adjust the main mirrors just as I did before so that I can see a car approaching from a side lane transition from the inside rear view mirror into both inside and outside mirrors to the outside mirror only. The convex mirrors kind of pick up everything outside of that for now but as I said, I'm still struggling.

I'll figure it out...

Bruce

[crispyboy]

Originally Posted by slowmover

Quite a drop to that hitch shank. Leverage.

I'd rather have the Reese 42995 hitch receiver on there than the factory piece. Still doubt the factory piece is as substantial. And given the leverage I'd consider additional bracing. Is your approach of lightest bars what Thomson recommends?

The Reese receiver or any other aftermarket would likely hang lower and would hinder the off-road capability of the truck.
I have not had any troubles with the class 4 factory receiver on our truck.

[KJRitchie]

I just keep my Ram tow mirrors in the tow position for solo. I have to admit the passenger side I'm always adjusting because when passing cars I can't tell as well as the drivers side when I'm far enough past to pull back into the lane with enough clearance to the passed vehicle. I didn't seem to have this issue with my Tundra's tow mirrors.

I set my convex mirrors so I can see the trailer's wheels so when turning I can tell the trailer tires will clear.

Kelvin

[CORockies]

Nice to know that I am not the only one who has issues with the passenger side mirror. I put an adjustable spot mirror between the two mirrors to bridge the gap that the stock mirrors have. Doesn't look pretty, but it works great imho. On a side note had to take the AS to the dealer to get some recall work done. It was a 200 mile round trip and the PW returned 12 mpg. I thought that was rather impressive.

Zane and Diane

[interstateflyer]

I've been using the mirrors in tow mode recently while not towing just to get used to them.

[Zybane]

Originally Posted by slowmover

Quite a drop to that hitch shank. Leverage.

I'd rather have the Reese 42995 hitch receiver on there than the factory piece. Still doubt the factory piece is as substantial. And given the leverage I'd consider additional bracing. Is your approach of lightest bars what Thomson recommends?

The Power Wagon has the Ram 2500 receiver hitch which is quite robust. An Airstream isn't going to come close to challenging it's strength.

[slowmover]

Scales tell the tale. An upgrade on my CTD 2500 made a difference. Far easier now to transfer weight to Steer Axle. It's the length of the drop shank that was questioned.

[BoldAdventure]

It's the same hitch in the same position as the previous truck. Well I adjusted the head tilt to move weight forward onto the truck. It's a 4 1/2 inch drop with the hitch head I have: https://www.etrailer.com/Accessories...s/RP63971.html

I'm going to replace it with this Titan since it's designed for a 2 1/2 inch receiver. https://www.etrailer.com/Accessories...e/RP54977.html

I don't need all that drop though.

You can see in these photos how it sits without W/D and with. My Airstream sits an inch higher already and I'm seriously considering doing the Dexter lift, just had a friend install it. And we've smashed steps twice by accident with our boondocking adventures.

[slowmover]

Will be interested to hear about the differences in road going feel and performance (steering and braking) versus the previous pickup.

I get passed on a regular basis by lifted pickups pulling (usually) toyhaulers. Above 67-mph. My opinion of them is low. Not including you or your rig. My impression is that it appears that no feedback thru steering equates to "all is good". I avoided the choice of a Freightliner with bigger motor and more gears for the KW T660 I'm in . . can thread a needle with the steering, so to speak.

This concern goes double with a travel trailer (of whatever type), IMO. Tire pressure on the TV is the hardest thing to get right. Most choose too high. Finding the lowest number per axle and working upwards, slightly, is my preference. But, the better the suspension and steering design, the easier this is to get "right".

Unrelated, do you think this TV will send more gravel towards the TT?

[BoldAdventure]

We're moving to the Grand Canyon tomorrow, so lots of towing. So far only towed 24 miles. Found a Cat scale nearby too so I can fiddle with things and make sure all is right.

I'll do a full report after that. It does already feel different. Old truck had AT tires too, and threw rocks, but I had mud flaps. For some reason the PW didn't come with flaps or side steps. I think I might actually buy a rock tamer now for this truck.

[Zybane]

Originally Posted by slowmover

Unrelated, do you think this TV will send more gravel towards the TT?

Oh yes, certainly. Tall vehicle with off-road tires to catch and sling a lot of debris from its tread.

I put on mud flaps and also plan to use a secondary net system to protect the airstream.

[BoldAdventure]

Well we actually towed 144 miles today. With a lot of grades, up and down the whole way here. We started from Callville Bay campground. You start with a 4-mile climb up 2000 ft. Then we drove 167 which becomes 169 to I-15 all the way to the Dixie National Forest.

A really good test I felt. We averaged 11.3 according to the ECM until we hit the Dixie National Forest. It was a solid climb to our camp site, not sure of the elevation gain but it dropped all the way to 10.1 by the time we got here. "BOO" I was quite smitten.

But I see how single digits are possible. If I want to tow at speeds other than 60/65ish, forget it.

I need to fill up to do a hand calculation.

Overall, the Ram 2500 feels more planted on the road in comparison to the Ram 1500. Road feedback is harsh however through the steering. But there is less feedback from the Airstream transmitted to the truck.

With the Ram 1500 if the Airstream went over a bump, you knew it.

I felt that the transmission engine braking was better than the 1500 Ram.

I'm pretty happy overall with the performance. It does feel a bit like a heavier Ram 1500 with the 5.7L Hemi.

I wonder if the 4.56 rear end ratio the 5.7L Hemi Power Wagon had would have been a better choice for Ram.

The truck has the power, but for some reason, it feels like you have to insist on it giving the power to you. The Ram 1500 had a softer peddle with better throttle response. You just eased into it and that thing took off. The 6.4L Hemi seems to want to take it easy unless you mash the peddle. Then it gives you the power. It's there, but it's reserved. Not sure why Ram did this.

I didn't try out the 800 lb bars for my Reese today. We left camp at 11:00 am and I packed everything up and hitched up, then went to put the bars on and realized I needed to adjust the cam arms in order to do so.

Well, it was 85 degrees outside. And I already put my tools away. So... it was 85 degrees outside.

We stopped at a pilot and ran the scales today too.

Feel free to make comments about my death. Or FLAIR or however it's spelled. Or actual constructive feedback I can use. I don't know everything, even though I play a know it all on the internet.

First, just the truck loaded with all of us and some gear.
Steer: 4620 .lbs
Drive: 3740 .lbs
Gross: 8360 .lbs

The second pass is truck and Airstream but no weight distribution.
Steer: 4180 .lbs
Drive: 5140 .lbs
Trailer: 6780 .lbs
Gross: 16100 .lbs

So tongue weight is 960 lbs. Not bad.

Third pass, truck + Airstream with weight distribution applied
Steer: 4580 lbs.
Drive: 4620 lbs.
Trailer: 6900 lbs.
Gross: 16100 lbs.

Think I might play shift the weight around some more. Overall looks within ratings for the axles and tires.

Obligatory new truck with trailer photo.

[Hittenstiehl]

So your first response to this post is not a criticism.

You made me smile with that beautiful photo. What a caption of a great advertising image. RAM should pay you to use that in one of their brochures

The laugh came from the "play a know it all on the internet" self proclamation.


Safe travels to your new spot.

[dkottum]

A white Ram Laramie in front of an Airstream tugs looks especially good to us, really nice looking outfit.

Ours is a Ram 1500 so I don't know your weight ratings and it's not my business, but looking at your first and third pass I wonder why you would go down to 800 lb w.d. bars. You're pretty close to where you might want to be?

P.S. If you ever locate the aftermarket power-fold tow mirrors, kindly let me know. I'll keep an eye out as well.

[SCOTTinNJ]

Originally Posted by BoldAdventure

The truck has the power, but for some reason, it feels like you have to insist on it giving the power to you. The Ram 1500 had a softer peddle with better throttle response. You just eased into it and that thing took off. The 6.4L Hemi seems to want to take it easy unless you mash the peddle. Then it gives you the power. It's there, but it's reserved. Not sure why Ram did this.

I have the F150 with 5.0 and I've also driven the Ram 5.7 a bit.

I test drove both the GM 6.0 and Ford 6.2 3/4 ton gas trucks and they felt exactly like what you are saying. The power was there but you had to coax it out compared to the 1/2 tons.

Not sure if that has to do with the weight of the truck or the power delivery characteristics, but I suspect a bit of both. Plus these 3/4 ton trucks don't have that much power/torque over the 1/2 ton compared to the extra mass.

Sounds like Ram is in the same boat as the competitors. I suppose it is something you will just get used to?

[BoldAdventure]

I suspect it's a combo of things, but mostly tuning on Ram's part. Guys with the older Power Wagon's (2010-2013) that had the 4.56 gears report that the car feels more sporty than the 6.4 with the 4.10's.

If you think that more and more people buy half tons as daily drivers and probably even more of them are younger buyers than newer and are moving to more and more car-like handling characteristics, it would make sense to make them more responsive and car like.

And why I think it's purposefully tuned this way, is that Ram claims the PW has a different throttle response and torque curve when in 4WD that focuses on low end grunt. And I noticed the throttle is way more sensitive off road.



The 6.4 is drive by wire when it comes to the throttle, so it's electronically controlled. So another point in the 'tuning' column.

Also, the 5.7 I could sit in the drive way and rev the engine. I discovered after my exhaust install a 3K rev limiter... WTH. Why so low? But if I mash the peddle on the street, she'll rev way higher. So why the rev limiter in park on the 6.4 but not the 5.7? So, Ram's engineers have a reason, but it's not publicly stated anywhere.

Maybe part of it is just how the manufacturers think people use 3/4 tons and what they want them to drive like. No one really expects a 3/4 ton heavy truck to be sporty.

But I think it could be better. The power is clearly there. I can only take others at their word. A few guys on RamForum say that tuning completely makes a huge improvement. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

On Ramforums there is a discussion about why the Cummins is also slow. And I think it's all about the trucks being engineered and tuned towards doing what they are designed to do. Which is move heavy loads. And being reliable and durable. Which means, slow and steady with smooth power curves where the focus is on grunt, not on off the line.

Might just be something you get used too. And I'm sure the weight is a part of it.

--

What I forgot to mention in my feedback was the cooling. Very impressive. The 1500 did good, but sometimes I got concerned. Yesterday with all the grades, 85 degree outside temps and A/C going, the transmission never climbed about 178F and the coolant stayed at 208F.

The 1500 5.7 while never over heating, would always have the temps climb on grades. It recovered very quickly, but seeing 190 trans temp and 215 coolant after a grade for a few seconds was common.

[SCOTTinNJ]

I'm not up on my "rock crawling techniques," but is it possible that RAM did some of this just on the PW to give more feel off road? Wouldn't you want less instant torque in such a situation? If so, could the regular 6.4's be different?

[BoldAdventure]

You'd want more torque since that is what turns wheels in a situation where you need to get unstuck.

Ram did a number of things different for the PW so yes a standard could be different.

I have a manual t-case that isn't in the regular 2500's and full electronic lockers front and rear. The regular 2500 4WD has open diffs that aren't true lockers with a different t-case that isn't split 50/50 like the PW.

There is a lot of power loss through a drive train like that. I bet a 2WD 6.4 would feel completely different.

They also beefed up the suspension and use radius arms on the Power Wagon with what could be the stupidest marketing term the "articulink" system.

[CORockies]

Glad to hear that your mpg's are very similar to mine. I need to put my vehicle on a good scale. The last time I was on one the scale said the truck was 400 pounds lighter than advertised. That was with the whole family in it! Made me wonder if the payload is higher than what the paperwork says.
15' and newer trucks need to send in their pcm in order to get it tuned. Not sure if the tuners have cracked the codes or not. I agree that the truck feels reserved. Makes it feel like a truck and not an SUV. IMHO the best thing that Ram could do for their HD gas lineup is put an 8 speed automatic transmission in them with a 5:1 first gear. That would make the truck jump.
Anyway, I definitely need to do some more homework on my setup. The truck uses 1200 lb bars for the EQ hitch that came with the Airstream. Based on some of the reading that I have done I wonder if I should be using lighter bars. Comments?

Zane and Diane