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Old 08-30-2008, 09:54 AM   #29
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Youre right, I dont know how we got on that debate. I will say it is one as a G wagon owner I am forced into often. That being said I am very concerned about the short wheelbase and how that will affect towing capabilities as you said, no matter what technology is in the benz. The fact is looking cool is always trumped by saftey, and who says any TV doesnt look cool with a Airstream behind it. I would rather drive a f250 on the road than a g in a ditch right. Not to mention, could you imagine the phone call to my insurance guy on that wreck, nobody would ever insure me again!
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Old 08-30-2008, 10:58 AM   #30
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I suppose I'm sort of old school. There are many an RVer that will tow a 34' with a Nissan Quest or a Dodge Intrepid. There are some the believe that you need a Freightliner or a Mack truck to tow a 20' RV.

I think it all boils down to common sense, intuition and running the numbers objectively of both the tow vehicle specs and what potential real world applications you'll be putting against those specs. You've been given lots of great info here and I think regardless of what is said here, you seem to have a good head on your shoulders and I'm fairly confident you'll make the best choice for your situation.

Here is some reading that might help put some wheelbase questions into perspective...use it as a guide, not law:

RV Towing Tips - How long?
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Old 08-30-2008, 11:48 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Jim View Post
The fact is looking cool is always trumped by saftey, and who says any TV doesnt look cool with a Airstream behind it. I would rather drive a f250 on the road than a g in a ditch right. Not to mention, could you imagine the phone call to my insurance guy on that wreck, nobody would ever insure me again!
And there's your answer. Besides, when you get to where you're going (if you can tow it there), it's all about the Airstream and enjoying your surroundings...

With a gross of 7300# for the Silver Cloud and a max tow rating of 7K# for the benz, you're 300# over. Probably more and that's going down hill with the wind behind you, having been on a diet loosing alot of weight, driving alone with an almost empty tank... Avoid anything with an elevation higher than a berm, avoid highway entrance ramps, rain, snow and well... nature, you should be OK with the benz...

Otherwise, look for something that might not look as "cool" (always subjective and seasonal) but that has the ability to get you where you want to go safely and easily. Anticipate the unexpected.

Happy camping, Big Jim!
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Old 08-30-2008, 02:02 PM   #32
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...I dont know how we got on that debate...
no debates here, we agree the gee is a WAY nicer road machine than an H1...

but earlier it was suggested that
Quote:
I was told it would be equivalent to a H1 in many ways
and the point is, THAT'S a SILLY COMPARISON for TOWING....

because the H1 is poorly suited for towing LONG HEAVY 'streams and so is the gwagon.

great brakes, good suspension and some low end grunt are wonderful features, but there are many other pratical issues.

other than throwing out brands and models i see no mention of the important factors related to selecting a tv.

-past experience towing
-expected travel pattern (distance, frequency, location, cargo, days of use)
-accessories/toys that will go to
-people on board and so on....

so far mentioned are safety (which is nebulous at best) and comfort/speed as roading attributes.

it is tough to get folks to agree on what combination of gear is "safe" when it's the gearHEAD that matters.

NOONE is knocking the benz and if you wanna try towing with it, do so,

just keep in mind the setup will require some thought, added equipment and so on...

there are links to the relevant threads, and i could point u2 the 4-5 members here towing with the old g or the H1...

but doubt that info would be useful either.

using a 3/4 ton diesel truck isn't the only other option, there are folks here towing that trailer with...

f150s, tundras, VANS and other rigs too, and not all are NEW.

buying an older dedicated tow beast is a good move for many, then u can keep the g.

winning is about the most toys right!

it's neat the trailer is NOW being built, that is an exciting stage, trumped only by the delivery and maiden trip.

of course there are also lots of tips/tricks/issues and guides on inspecting and accepting that new trailer or not.

it's all posted so read on...

cheers
2air'
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Old 08-30-2008, 02:30 PM   #33
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Hello,...I am interested in a 2009 28'...and want to know if I have enough tow vehichle. I have ... a tow rating of 7000 pounds... the salesman says to pull it dry... I would like to hear from someone who doesnt stand to make a commision as to how close to the net weight a trailer is in a " real life" situation...
so lets back track to the original post and questions...

working UP from the bottom.

-real life means weighing the trailer. axle and tongue weights.

-YOU will have to do that. there is VERY LITTLE real iife info reported on 2009 trailers here.

-this figure is affected by OPTIONS, fluids, lpgas and cargo, which are all part of real life rv use.

--the 'stream published weight figures do NOT include any of these things. infact they may still not include a SPARE TIRE...

-in all likelihood the TONGUE WEIGHT for that 28 will approach 1000lbs.

-so far i read posts from only ONE member who remotely might benefit financially from your choices,

so the rest of us are just trying to help, or not.

-towing DRY is no fun. MUCH of the fun of rv travel is the journey,

-and it's a lot of fun to make lunch, a jug of tea, use the crapper or take a shower in route, so dry travel is counter to that.

-the published tow capacity is only partial info.

-that figure is REDUCED by cargo, people, fuel and accessories on the tv...

-payload of the ACTUAL TV will be a primary issue. WHAT IS THAT FIGURE 4 your ride?

-the tongue (900lbs) + a hitch (100-250lbs) + people (500lbs) + stuff in the tv (??) ===1600----2000 lbs of PAYLOAD...

-now decide is the tv adequate for the LOAD and do YOU have enough tow vehicle?

-does the 80% guideline matter 2 you?

so "enough tow vehicle?"...

---to get to the local city park, yes.
---across the state, maybe.
---to the coast and around the country or for lots of local trips with toys on board, WHO KNOWS till you try it.

cheers
2air'
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Old 08-30-2008, 05:06 PM   #34
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Thanks for the info, and honestly I live @ about 7300 ft above sea level and many of the places I would like to go are up from here, I think I am going to need more power and more wheelbase for sure. I think a dedicated TV may be the way to go. With my growing family I want to be safe but I also like the room of a SUV. How about a 3/4 ton suburban? I have a friend who has allready found some with "quadrasteer". Are you familar with that? I have been told that might be a good TV and lately they are around @ a good price. I really would like to avoid a pick up although it might be nice to have for some other odd jobs as well, I just thought I might be able to get that third row of seats in the suburban. How about a Ford Excursion? vs a suburban? Could I find either one of these for under 20K. Boy, if anyone needs help spending money call me, I am becoming an expert. O well, stimulating the economy right, just doing my patriotic duty( remember, I paid US taxes on that Austrian Benz too.) Do you think my Airstream will be like a plane or boat, by that I mean do you just throw money @ these beautiful trailers alot. My guess would be ,not on a new one, or am I wrong about that too?
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Old 08-30-2008, 07:36 PM   #35
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...I live @ about 7300 ft above sea level and many of the places I would like to go are up from here...I also like the room of a SUV. with "quadrasteer"... I really would like to avoid a pick up although...How about a Ford Excursion? ...do you just throw money @ these beautiful trailers alot...
at altitude i like forced induction.

the easiest approach to that is a turbo diesel.

obviously a supercharger (or turbo) can be added to many domestic gassers for some money.

i too was attracted to q-steer, but it wasn't available on the models with the highest towing capacity or diesels.

moosetags has 2 q-steers, so he can tell ya all about it.

suv or truck? besides people how much stuff will ya haul?

i prefer tools, bbqs, gensets, WET CRAP, blue totes, bikes and so on in the truck bed (under shell) AWAY from people.

and i don't want loose/heavy STUFF flying in the cab in emergency situations.

many are very happy with large suvs and LOTS of streams are towed with 'em.

imo the larger 'burbons are so HEAVY that they don't have nearly the carry capacity as u might imagine,

space YES but payload is still an issue on the big burbs.

unless you opt for the 2500 series and go with E rated tires, which make it a legit 3/4 ton,

but it will still be a slug at altitude, look for the ones with the 8.1 L gasser.

the excursion can be had with a turbo diesel, lots of mods available to enhance it.

the diesel exc' is a good towing beast and gets better mpg than the burbs...

a v10 is also available and with LOTS of gettup, but it is a heavy drinker too.

bambi's bandit used one (till the new f250) and did lots of mods, his posts are useful on excursion.

YES they (burbs, exc, 3/4 trucks) can be had found for under 20k, it's a buyers market now for the big trucks and suvs.

throw money? it's possible, really depends on how satisfied u r with the trailer, right out of the box.

the warranty will cover most of the nagging repairs at the outset, but travel to/from the dealer is on you.

a/v upgrades, solar, gensets, kitchen gear, mats, party lights, the list goes onandon....

a variety of basic & non essential rv STUFF will set most new owners back several k$ the first year or 2.

the other issue is, IS THE 28 big enough? many, many folks go up a size or 2 in the first 2 years of ownership.

so buying a tv with the capacity FOR THE NEXT LARGER 'stream can be a money saver.

cheers
2air'
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Old 08-30-2008, 08:26 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Jim View Post
Thanks for the info, and honestly I live @ about 7300 ft above sea level and many of the places I would like to go are up from here, I think I am going to need more power and more wheelbase for sure. I think a dedicated TV may be the way to go. With my growing family I want to be safe but I also like the room of a SUV. How about a 3/4 ton suburban? I have a friend who has allready found some with "quadrasteer". Are you familar with that? I have been told that might be a good TV and lately they are around @ a good price. I really would like to avoid a pick up although it might be nice to have for some other odd jobs as well, I just thought I might be able to get that third row of seats in the suburban. How about a Ford Excursion? vs a suburban? Could I find either one of these for under 20K. Boy, if anyone needs help spending money call me, I am becoming an expert. O well, stimulating the economy right, just doing my patriotic duty( remember, I paid US taxes on that Austrian Benz too.) Do you think my Airstream will be like a plane or boat, by that I mean do you just throw money @ these beautiful trailers alot. My guess would be ,not on a new one, or am I wrong about that too?
I would suggest you go to some local dealerships and test drive everything you might be interested in to get a feel for what's out there.

I spent waaaaay more money than I had planned on but I did so knowing I didn't want any compromises. I have a family of 4, wife two boys 12 & 9 and a 50 pound dog that only knows two speeds: sleep and wide open. My wife made me buy a new 2008 F250.

We found a year 2000 34' Classic and the seller also wanted to sell his 2000 F250 with it for $16,000. Had 89,000 miles and clean as a whistle. However, my wife could not stand the diesel noise and the truck like ride.

On the way home from looking at the combo she made me pull into a Ford dealership and had the salesman take her for a ride in one. She didn't even drive it, just wanted to ride in it. Came back 15 minutes later sold.

Its not an SUV, but I have all the creature comforts of a car/suv, leather, heated seats, GPS NAV with rear DVD entertainment for the boys. Huge I mean huge heated mirrors that telescope, integrated brake controller, tow command transmission, E rated tires and both 7 & 4 pin connectors in the rear.

There was nothing else to add other than some Rhino lining in the bed and a topper to cover all the crap I can carry.
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Old 08-30-2008, 08:36 PM   #37
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.... My wife made me buy a new 2008 F250...
that's one smart woman!

the difference in noise, smell, ride quality, steering, amenities and so on is dramatic going to the 08s...

and test driving EVERYTHING is a great idea, that's another reason i didn't opt for the q-steer gmc truck,

NO dealer had one to drive, even in 2005.

there might be a little bit of good info on the 08s here...

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f463...now-30023.html

i'm still waiting for the dealer to get some 09s, right now they only have prices and order sheets...

something about production and buyer interest moving toward itty bitty cars?

cheers
2air'
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Old 08-30-2008, 09:08 PM   #38
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Big Jim, if you get a 3/4 ton Burb get the 4.10s. For mountain type towing, 4.10s with a gasser will be far easier on the tranny. If you go Excursion, not sure what gears are avail, but would clearly go for something more then 3.73. If you go diesel anything, 3.73 or around there would be more than fine since diesel needs not torque multiplication.

As for fuel economy of the 4.10s vs 3.73s, I can tell you first hand that the differences in MPG are nearly undetectable.

IMHO and I am not looking to start a GM vs Ford thing here, outside of the diesel Excursion, the 3/4 ton Suburban runs circles around any of the gasser Excursion models. GMs engines and transmissions are frankly really decent, and, GM still makes Suburbans, where there are no longer any Excursions still being made. Having a few 1996 GM cars, I can tell you first hand that with the state of the domestic auto industry, parts in a few years (fenders, lenses, etc) will be more and more difficult to find for older and particularly vehicles no longer in production. It was not uncommon in the past to find fenders, etc for some of the most mass produced vehicles. Lately, cut off for parts is getting sooner and sooner.

One other suggestion, regardless of what you get, if it has the rear DVD player, particularly with the wireless headphones, I can tell you hauling my wife's niece and nephew on a trip, we heard not a peep, or things like are we there yet. They could plug in their video games, watch movies, etc. 4-7 hours for them went by line it was nothing.
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Old 08-31-2008, 12:31 AM   #39
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Entertainment systems....

ST -

I was one of those parents that said "let them enjoy the scenery" and all that horse pucky..... until I went and got an aftermarket dual video set up for the headrests.... all was quiet after that purchase...!!!!!!!!

Here's a heads-up for all those considering a new vehicle purchase with a consideration of kids in the current or future.... GET THE VIDEO SET-UP!!!!! It will pay for itself in the shortest order!

OK, back the regular thread - now that I have that off my chest.

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Old 08-31-2008, 07:39 AM   #40
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I suppose I'm sort of old school. There are many an RVer that will tow a 34' with a Nissan Quest or a Dodge Intrepid. There are some the believe that you need a Freightliner or a Mack truck to tow a 20' RV.

I think it all boils down to common sense, intuition and running the numbers objectively of both the tow vehicle specs and what potential real world applications you'll be putting against those specs. You've been given lots of great info here and I think regardless of what is said here, you seem to have a good head on your shoulders and I'm fairly confident you'll make the best choice for your situation.
Jim, I'm with Twinke on this one - use your judgement. But do not over analyze things. Seeing you've got the Benz, why not hook up the Airstream with a nice WD/sway hitch and see how it tows? Use common sense, tweak things a bit if needed, sell the truck if you are not happy. Personally I'd take a well setup G500 anywhere with a light Airstream like the Flying Cloud - it is a very capable tough truck with an awesome motor. (not to mention an interior that makes a Lariat feel like a Yugo )

...............Scott
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Old 09-01-2008, 10:11 PM   #41
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Hey big jim there is another thread you might consider looking at called mercedes deisel. She is towing a 28 footer with a G? says it is great. Thought I might drop that in here.
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Old 09-06-2008, 03:30 PM   #42
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I'm not so convinced the G isn't a good choice. It's a stable vehicle with allot of technology you don't see in American vehicles. It's difficult to understand that vehicle's abilities without being in one and trying it. A few raw specifications doesn't do it for me. Mustangs have huge horsepower ratings but can be out driven on a track by a smaller nimbler vehicle. The point being is that wheelbase is great, but the suspension matters just as much. And if yu add electronics to monitor subtle shifts that a human can not detect and react to fast enough, you eliminate the problem before it becomes one.

As for the H1... Okay, maybe...maybe...it's a better vehicle in limited circumstances. A friend of mine has one and I don't think he's ever made it more than 10,000 miles without a major repair. There are some real problem points in that vehicle. Then there is the diesel mileage. It's horrible. Undoubtly the G wagon is a superior vehicle. It's ludicrous to even interject the H1 into this conversation. Why didn't you bring up a Harley Davidson, it's about the same level of applicability.
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