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Old 02-22-2008, 12:10 PM   #1
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Low sulphur vs ultra-lo sulphur diesel?

My TV is a 2007 F-350, 6.0 power stroke. The engine manual and the sticker on the inside of the gas access door both state that either low or ulsd is acceptable. However the sticker on the diesel pump at the local Wal-Mart states that it is against federal law to use ULSD in anything produced after 2007. Can anyone explain this to me? Am I reading something wrong? Thanks.
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Old 02-22-2008, 12:22 PM   #2
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Hi Scott. I believe the regs dictated that private vehicles produced from Jan 2007 onward were restricted to the ULSD 15ppm standard -- their pollution control equipment could get damaged by higher sulfur fuels. You should not be able to find anything except ULSD in this day and age! I've seen pump tags poorly worded like the ones you report. But your engine will do just fine with ULSD.

Diesel #2 is the normal fuel. Thinner Diesel #1 (operations at 10 below fahrenheit) is sometimes sold as 'Premium' -- an unnecessary expense that I almost never consider. My Duramax is garaged and I have an OEM block heater if it gets that cold -- which it has been doing regularly this winter. You're fine if you stay away from our end of the Mississippi!
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Old 02-22-2008, 12:30 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanoeStream
You should not be able to find anything except ULSD in this day and age! I've seen pump tags poorly worded like the ones you report. But your engine will do just fine with ULSD.
Thanks for the swift reply. I've been using it, waiting for a Federal Marshall to appear and confiscate my truck.
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Old 02-22-2008, 01:53 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanoeStream
You should not be able to find anything except ULSD in this day and age! I've seen pump tags poorly worded like the ones you report. But your engine will do just fine with ULSD.
I have found many stations that still have the LSD diesel fuel in their pumps. Especially at the "travel centers". My local Phillips station was still labeled this way so I went in and asked before I bought my first tank of fuel for my '08 I bought in December. The attendant told me that some one had asked earlier in the week so she called corporate and was told that the fuel was indeed the 500 ppm and she should not offer to sell it to anyone with an '07 or '08.

I make sure I always check before I pump just to make sure since I found out that this station had not just got lazy and not changed the labels. Last weekend I stopped at a Petro station and had already swiped my credit card and had the nozzle in my tank when I noticed that the label read 500 ppm so I canceled before I started pumping and went to the Shell station next door and paid a little more for fuel. I don't know how much use would be too much to use in an '08, but the engine cost too much to find out one tank is too much!
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Old 02-22-2008, 02:00 PM   #5
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Mine says ONLY Ultra-Low-Sulpher and I beg to differ as far as what's available. I went to the Can Opener and stopped at three different truck stops attempting to find a ULS pump. All of them had Low-Sulpher and had stickers saying it was illegal to be used in "PASSENGER VEHICLES manufactured in 2007 or 2008"..... Right down the street I'd find a Shell or a BP that had ULS for 20 cents more per gallon. Exxon's were a different story - some had ULS and some LS.

I'm breaking in a new engine and I sure don't want to void my warranty so I'm trying to be careful - and law abiding.

I've found several stations right here in Virginia Beach that are NOT truck stops that have LS, but also several with ULS.

BTW, does anyone know of any Wawa's that sell diesel? I swear I've seen a few, but boy not around here. They were always nice to use when trailering since virtually every one was on a corner or crossed two streets so pulling in and out weren't problems.

Paula Ford
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Old 02-22-2008, 03:29 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottW
My TV is a 2007 F-350, 6.0 power stroke....
on the ford side usld is required for 2008 powerstrokes, not 07...

the particulate exhaust filter that can be fouled with lsd is NOT on the 07 FORDs...

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f463...now-30023.html


http://www.airforums.com/forums/f238...rld-25248.html

so the 6.0 liter series from 2003-2007 can use EITHER lsd or ulsd, legally.

now as to switching backnforth between lsd and ulsd....

many feel this isn't a great idea because of the different additive package,

and the potential for fouling the fuel filter more often doing this...

cheers
2air'

foiled and 'mate...

the 07 cummins and 07 isuzumax require ulsd as does the 08 ford...

using just a few gallons of lsd in ANY of the drivetrains with particulate exhaust cleaners, will KILL the exhaust filter.

not the engine.

these advanced particulate exhaust gadgets are somewhat like catalytic converters on gas engines...

and are rendered useless by sulfur, in the same way leaded gas kills a cat converter...

once the particulate exhaust filter is fouled up this affects the engine obd, computer stuff and so on back up to the engine.

a new stock 2-stage particulate exhaust filter/burner is about 2-3,000$ and the engine hs to be cleared of the wrong fuel too...
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Old 02-22-2008, 03:33 PM   #7
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2Air,
Thanks again for your comments. Not much LSD here, lots of ULSD, so mixing them shouldn't be too much of a problem. I appreciate your advice. thanks again.
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Old 02-22-2008, 07:51 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottW
My TV is a 2007 F-350, 6.0 power stroke. The engine manual and the sticker on the inside of the gas access door both state that either low or ulsd is acceptable. However the sticker on the diesel pump at the local Wal-Mart states that it is against federal law to use ULSD in anything produced after 2007. Can anyone explain this to me? Am I reading something wrong? Thanks.
Key word is "after" to me that would mean 2008 and up However some of the stickers I have seen say "2007 and later"...sounds like you can go both ways

FWIW I run a 1996 PSD and use an additive, because I don't think that the ULSD has enough lubricant in it. I love it when I can buy B80 because my truck loves that stuff, but it is hard to find along the major highways around here.

Aaron
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Old 02-23-2008, 08:22 PM   #9
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Presently the only diesel available is ULSD. This excludes off road (red dye) diesel for ag purposes. I have found that not all "labels" on diesel pumps conform yet. But like 2air said, for Ford's if its a 6.4L only ULSD is allowed. For the 6.0 & 7.3's you can use either but will find only the ULSD. Speaking of the 7.3's, there is a "cam sensor" recall (1997-2003). Reimbursements for previous cam sensor replacement is available (certain requirements apply). Attachment provides all info.
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File Type: pdf 07S57_Safety_Recall_R07S573.pdf (423.9 KB, 48 views)
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Old 02-23-2008, 08:51 PM   #10
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while cali completed the ulsd conversion in 06...

the rest of the country has until 2010...

many states are ahead of the game,

but some truck stops still have lsd available.

here is a petro company flyer...

http://www.mapllc.com/products/diese...guidelines.pdf

and a more detailed site on the conversion to ulsd...

Clean Diesel Fuel Alliance

cheers
2air'
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Old 02-23-2008, 09:07 PM   #11
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I use additive with the new fuel and the increase in mileage more than pays for it. BTW home heating oil is not ulsd in the northeast, not that anyone would actually use that. HHO was the same as Diesel in the past, no more. As reported by a friend who delivers them.
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Old 02-23-2008, 09:08 PM   #12
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I have read that the sulfur was a lubricant in the fuel and the lower the percent of sulfur the less lubrication you have. This is very similar to the effect of removing lead from gasoline. Does anyone know if this should be a concern for older diesel engines as they start using the new product?
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Old 02-23-2008, 09:27 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by azflycaster
I have read that the sulfur was a lubricant in the fuel...
not exactly

the sulfur is not a lubricant.

the current process to REMOVE the sulfur also reduces the lubricants in diesel.

so the petrol companies ALL claim to add additional lubricants as an offset...

but like wahoo' and over59, i use additional lubricants...

just BE SURE that the lubricants DO NOT contain sulfur...

because this will have the same negative effect on the particulate filter/burner on the new engines, noted above.

i use stanadyne or a small amount of bio-d for lubrication...

stanadyne snake oil works!

cheers
2air'
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Old 02-25-2008, 09:05 AM   #14
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In the event that a pump were mislabeled or you pumped some lsd instead of usld by accident...in other words if I had read the label after I had pumped the lsd instead of before, would having the fuel filters changed on a regular basis compensate for an occasional grievance? I was sooo close, I had put the filler hose in the tank and had turned to lift the lever to start the pump when I noticed the label...I was that close.

On my '05 I replaced the fuel filter every 15K to 20K miles. I think that was the recommendation in the manual. I also had the moisture separator drained and oil filters replaced with every oil change. These were done at my local Ford dealer since they were actually cheaper on oil changes than my local express oil change services.
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