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Old 12-08-2012, 08:11 AM   #57
CLOUDSPLITTER "Tahawas"
 
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Question

How many know exactly what their rig weighs? Ready for Camping.
25' 2003 Classic 15960lbs


A lot of talk about how what your TV is capable of, tire pressures, hitch set-up, weight transfer.
You've 'gotta start somewhere, get the "real" info, makes doing the rite thing a lot easier.
If I hadn't done that at the start, I wouldn't have learned thru some research
that our 03 Classic has a listed GVWR of 7300lbs, (actual 7640lb), with an axle rating of 7000lbs, (two 3500lb), a CCC of a whopping 676lbs, that's everything your loading in your trailer.
A listed tongue weight guess of 760bs, (actual 1200Lbs).


Point is....it's a lot easier to get where your going if you know from whence you started.

Bob
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Old 12-08-2012, 08:12 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeppelin 1235422
This is kind of interesting/fun, but also kind of frustrating.
Welcome to the world of internet wisdom.

The two most frustrating topics are:
- Selection of Tow Vehicle,
- Selection of Tires for your Trailer.


There are other minor scirmishes around choice of selant for your Airstream, or hitch selection, but the two above are the biggies.

Convention wisdom is that you need a big truck to pull a trailer. There is a considerable body of evidence however that there are other alternatives.

One of the best posts to a similar thread is quoted below:

Quote:
Originally Posted by mstephens View Post
It's really great to see the progressive/creative camp, like Andrew, using empirical methods to develop good TV options. This is the essential element of good science - the basis of the scientific method. It's how progress is always made. From everything I have read thus far, the evidence is real, plentiful, and strongly supports the ideas that are being employed by these 'radicals.'
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstephens View Post

When I first got my trailer, I was completely unaware of this camp's thinking and results, and I followed the conventional wisdom and got the Suburban. I like it a lot and have few complaints, but when it is time to retire the Sub, I will definitely be looking in the progressive camp to see what they are up to, and hopefully end up with a good TV that is both a pleasure to drive and competent at towing - and with better gas mileage to boot. That Lexus SUV looks really great!

It appears that the people towing with these "progressive" rigs are not in fact demolishing school buses, rolling over on the highway, losing their brakes on grades, or twisting off their receivers with half the back end of the car. Rather, I seem to be reading about thousands of towing miles with comfort and reliability and confidence.

This information is not very common. I didn't see any of it when I first started out looking for a TV. I relied then on the CV to inform my choice. So, I hope you progressives and empiricists will continue to post your results (even through the scoffing), and your details and continue to creatively search out more options!





This is from:


which is a very interesting read.

My advice is to take your time and explore all the options. If you have your heart set on a new truck, and you like trucks, then it's a perfectly acceptable solution.

But there have been plenty of good suggestions on less expensive options to address what appear to be the major concerns without spending a huge amount of money.


You will not go wrong with the Hensley or ProPride hitch. There's little bashing of these hitches other than the cost compared with other solutions. The only other item to watch out for is the weight. These are heavy, so you need to watch the truck's payload.

My mantra for tow vehicles is to watch the payload ratings. This is almost always the limiting factor in what you can haul - and it's why I ended up with an F-150.

One more note on internet wisdom - not all opinions are well informed, or maybe were well informed 10 or 20 years ago - but times have moved on. There are many who say you cannot pull with an 1/2ton PU. But this ignores the capabilites of 1/2ton PUs of today which when properly equipped outperform the 3/4ton pick-ups of only a few years ago.

So yes...it can be frustrating, especially if you are the kind of person that just 'wants the answer'. The reality is that there is no one right answer to this question. It's too personal.

At the end of the day, decide what type of vehicle you want to drive every day, and go from there.

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Old 12-08-2012, 08:19 AM   #59
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Wink Rong....

"At the end of the day, decide what type of vehicle you want to drive every day, and go from there." .......that is capable of safely towing your trailer.
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Old 12-08-2012, 08:28 AM   #60
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Yea, I know how much it weighs, but just because you have a tow vehicle that is rated for the weight you are towing, or more, does not mean you will necessarily have a good towing rig. The setup is always the important point, and many times depending on hitch type, could take a great deal of time to get right.
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Old 12-08-2012, 08:50 AM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS View Post
"that is capable of safely towing your trailer.
Completely agree -

I should likely have expanded -

If you want to drive a truck, then look for a truck that can safely pull the AS,
If you want to drive a minivan, then look for a minivan...
If you want to drive a cross-over, etc.

but what is safe or not safe is still a personal decision. There are no carefully crafted independent studies that demonstrate superiority of one solution over another. There is only opinion.

Similarly there are no published safey stats (at least not that I have found or seen referenced).

I would argue that the most important safety components are proper hitch set-up, Tires, good maintenance and the nut behind the wheel.
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Old 12-08-2012, 09:21 AM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxTow View Post
Completely agree -

I but what is safe or not safe is still a personal decision. There are no carefully crafted independent studies that demonstrate superiority of one solution over another. There is only opinion.

Similarly there are no published safey stats (at least not that I have found or seen referenced).

I would argue that the most important safety components are proper hitch set-up, Tires, good maintenance and the nut behind the wheel.
Yes, and there is another point that lots of people choose to ignore, and that is towing conditions.

Just because something works in one area of the country and in certain types of terrain, absolutely does not mean it will work everywhere. Also, there are different driving conditions and laws in different parts of the country, and those must be considered as well.
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Old 12-08-2012, 10:48 AM   #63
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Fastway is owed by the same folks who build the original equalizer. Dealers tend to offer them as part of the package. My 28 footer came with one that the PO got with the trailer new (2010 model). It was sorely undersized and not set up properly at all.

For a 28' flying cloud you need 1000 or 1200# bars. The dealer set it up with 800# bars and the wrong drop. The PO only took it on one trip and seemed very tense about towing it. After I bought it, I found out why!

I spoke both the AS customer service and Equalizer. I sold the Fastway and bought an Equalizer. I bought large enough bars to set it up properly for weight distribution. It provides the anti-sway as advertised and also was resonably easy to set up for weight distribution. I considered the Hensley and Propride but cost and additional tongue weight (they're heavy) caused me to go in another direction.


Your description of big trucks sucking you over on the interstate is evidence the anti-sway isn't functioning and if that's the case, you are highly likely not gettting adequate weight distribution to the front either. Both are dangerous conditions and you were wise to slow down and get off the fast lanes.

So:
1. Check the E2 bars for their capacity. There should be a sticker on them showing bar capacity.
2. If the bars are large enough, assure that the hitch is adjusted properly and that you are getting weight distribution to the front of the vehicle. Installation instructions are on the Fastway E2 website. This means the proper elevation of the ball (i.e. the drop must be adjusted properly) and then the angle of the bar trunions to cause the appropriate down force of the bars on the L-pads attached to the trailer A-frame/tongue.
3. Proper adjustment within the specs will get you a level vehicle when the trailer is hitched and also provide the anti-sway you need.

You can get adequate anti-sway with an Equlizer style hitch. Equally important with all hitch set-ups is the weight distribution that is needed. It takes both to safely tow a trailer. So don't neglect either.

Longer term you may need or choose to step up to a vehicle that can handle the gross weight and tongue weight of a 28' trailer. But I suggest you sort the hitch issue out first.

I have been through this same tangle with Fastway and a 28' FC - holler if I can help you.
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Old 12-08-2012, 11:15 AM   #64
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I would not have anything but a diesel if i were going to pull anything in hilly conditions. There will be people who say gas motors can do the same, they just cant. As far as gas engines, your tahoe probably has a 5.4 motor, so any upgrade to a 3/4 to vehicle should give you the 6.0l motor. This itself will give you a better towing experiance. Basically it is all in what you want for comfort in towing and day to day driving. The 6.0l motor will be a little worse on fuel economy on the day to day and probably about the same on the pulling if you take into account how hard the smaller motor has to work. To bad Ford doesnt make the Excursion any more with the power stroke motor, problem would be solved !!!!Once you pull with a diesel you will never go back!!!!
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Old 12-08-2012, 11:33 AM   #65
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Since your Tahoe won't pull your trailer up a hill (It'll really get fun when you go where there are mountains.) You need a tow vehicle with more power.

The 3/4 Suburban with the larger engine will get you up the mountain and the larger brakes will get you down. The stronger suspension will help all around.

Once you do that you can sort out hitches, tire pressure etc.
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Old 12-08-2012, 02:45 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveH View Post
Yea, I know how much it weighs, but just because you have a tow vehicle that is rated for the weight you are towing, or more, does not mean you will necessarily have a good towing rig. The setup is always the important point, and many times depending on hitch type, could take a great deal of time to get right.
Steve,

Are your trailers the lightweight versions?

1 no wd
2 wd adjusted

Bob
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Old 12-08-2012, 03:01 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS View Post
Steve,

Are your trailers the lightweight versions?

1 no wd
2 wd adjusted

Bob
Two different trailers. The first ticket is for the current '10 31' Classic, and the second is for the previous '04 28' Classic, but with the ProPride.

The weight tickets were not testing hitch setup, but for Texas licensing purpose as both were bought out of state, and neither title had a weight stated.
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Old 12-08-2012, 04:27 PM   #68
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Steve,

Were you loaded for camping on your tickets?
Hard to figure why your 31 Classic weighs so much less.


Model: 2010 - 31' CLASSIC LIMITED DINETTE TRAILER

CHASSIS
10,000# GVWR 10,000# Axle System 7153# UBW 2847# NCC 760# Aluminum Wheels 15" Radial Black Wall Tires, LRD 12" Electric Drum Brakes W/Nev-R-Adjust Brakes and Nev-R-Lube Hubs Electric Hitch Jack Manual Stabilizer Jack w/Pads Aluminum Step w/Extension Stainless Steel A-Frame Protectors Spare Tire & Bracket.

It's nice to see that AS saw fit to match the axles to the loaded weight, and you have a more realistic CCC of around 2000lb.

Bob
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Old 12-08-2012, 04:58 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS View Post
Steve,

Were you loaded for camping on your tickets?
Hard to figure why your 31 Classic weighs so much less.


Model: 2010 - 31' CLASSIC LIMITED DINETTE TRAILER

CHASSIS
10,000# GVWR 10,000# Axle System 7153# UBW 2847# NCC 760# Aluminum Wheels 15" Radial Black Wall Tires, LRD 12" Electric Drum Brakes W/Nev-R-Adjust Brakes and Nev-R-Lube Hubs Electric Hitch Jack Manual Stabilizer Jack w/Pads Aluminum Step w/Extension Stainless Steel A-Frame Protectors Spare Tire & Bracket.

It's nice to see that AS saw fit to match the axles to the loaded weight, and you have a more realistic CCC of around 2000lb.

Bob
Bob,

It's been a while on the 28' so I honestly don't remember, but the 31' was loaded with our normal stuff that we keep in there for going to local rallys, not loaded for a long trip. I figure we easily tip the scales at 8K on a trip.
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Old 12-08-2012, 05:48 PM   #70
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But in both cases, all water tanks would have been empty, and mostly full propane tanks.
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