He says I need a dually??

[gmw photos]

Originally Posted by MaxTow

The F250 is an interesting beast from my research. When equipped with a gas engine it has good payload capacity at 3000lbs plus. However when loaded, it's towing capacity is limited as it's such a heavy vehicle.

Go for the diesel and you can pull a house - however the payload capacity drops to 2650 lbs.

This is all in comparison with a 2012 F150 with HD Payload and Max Tow packages. Payload is 2150lbs. When fully loaded it can pull 8900 lbs. Add a few options to the F250 and the payload difference is not that great.

For recent model year pick-ups in the Ford line-up it's the F150 ecoboost - or the F350 if you really need extra payload. The F250 doesn't seem to buy enough extra capacity.

My opinion...

well, and further, while we're confusing the issue with "opinions" . I'll throw another in here: to my mind, when considering whether 250/2500 or 350/3500, you might as well go with the one ton, because there is essentially no ride penalty to it in comparison to the 3/4 ton. And as I said before, if going 350/3500....what the hey.....might as well get DRW, because again, little downside to it.
....my opinion based on my experience.....

[MaxTow]

Originally Posted by gmw photos

.....might as well get DRW, because again, little downside to it.

...now that's just ridiculous!

[PharmGeek]

what is DRW

[2005 ford]

Duel Rear Wheel

[m.hony]

Originally Posted by PharmGeek

I thought so too of course, but the whole blowout scenario is scary...but I suspect such concerns are universal...what if you blow out in the front?

I am still undecided on 28 vs. 30 sofa vs. 30 bunkhouse...we lean toward 30 as I think it will do the job for 10K less and can accept the 2-3 feet loss...but seeing them in person will help us determine...then we will know what TV we want...

Although, I hear folks pull the 30' with tundra 5.7L V8....payload is the question though im still wondering....

...with fire wood and bicycles in the bed of the truck...

[PharmGeek]

m.hony....what is the stated GVWR for your tundra?

[gmw photos]

Originally Posted by MaxTow

...now that's just ridiculous!

ok. Explain to me why you think it's ridiculous.
I base my comments on the fact that around the stables, we have a F350 dually, and among our little group is a F350 SRW ( single rear wheel ) a 3500 D/A SRW, a new F250 super duty with the new 6.7 powerstroke ( nice ! ) and an older F350 dually with a 7.3.
I have driven all of them, ridden as a passenger in all of them, both solo and with various trailers from little cargo trailers to a 35' gooseneck horse hauler ( lots of miles with it ).

So I am curious why you would think the idea of a one ton duallie is ridiculous as compared to a 3/4 ton SRW super duty ?

[PharmGeek]

alright, I am about to talk weights here....dont laugh...dont say crap

I weight 147 lbs

My wife (and dont you dare say I said this) may weigh in the neighborhood of 170 or so right now (had a baby 5 months ago - she will likely lose 10 more pounds in the coming months).

Our kids make up what...uhh...less than 40 lbs....

So people = 350 ish lbs
Bicycles total, I have no idea - I will guess 50 lbs total
Canoe is highly unlikely to be honest in most all trips, but lets include it also...it has to be 75 or more lbs..ill say 100 lbs?
Future generator = 150 lbs
small portable grill = 20 lbs
let me stop there and sub-total = 670 lbs

Toungue weight of the 28' Ive been told when all is said and done can get to 1200 lbs

[gmw photos]

I would argue the number one question the OP needs to answer is this: am I willing to disregard specific load ratings in the tow vehicle ?

I'm not going to try to argue the validity of staying within stated vehicle limits. To some people, it is important. To other people it is of no concern at all, and I would not, for a minute try to convince anyone that I have all the answers to that question. I am simply saying that question needs to be answered, and only then does it make sense to start adding up all the numbers and see where it all falls in place regarding tow vehicle "A" vs tow vehicles "B thru Z". Lots of choices will "work". A few of those choices will work and still fall within manufacturer stated limits.
Take all that for what it's worth.

[MaxTow]

Originally Posted by gmw photos

ok. Explain to me why you think it's ridiculous.
I base my comments on the fact that around the stables, we have a F350 dually, and among our little group is a F350 SRW ( single rear wheel ) a 3500 D/A SRW, a new F250 super duty with the new 6.7 powerstroke ( nice ! ) and an older F350 dually with a 7.3.
I have driven all of them, ridden as a passenger in all of them, both solo and with various trailers from little cargo trailers to a 35' gooseneck horse hauler ( lots of miles with it ).

So I am curious why you would think the idea of a one ton duallie is ridiculous as compared to a 3/4 ton SRW super duty ?

It was meant as a joke (hence the smiley) -

I was arguing a few posts back that the F250 doesn't make much sense as compared with the fully decked out F150 - and that the F350 is the logical move for a significant increase in payload / towing capacity.

But that going to DRW was over some other arbitrary imaginary line and was now 'ridiculous'.

It's hard to convey sarcasm on line sometimes...

[MaxTow]

Originally Posted by PharmGeek

alright, I am about to talk weights here....dont laugh...dont say crap

I weight 147 lbs

My wife (and dont you dare say I said this) may weigh in the neighborhood of 170 or so right now (had a baby 5 months ago - she will likely lose 10 more pounds in the coming months).

Our kids make up what...uhh...less than 40 lbs....

So people = 350 ish lbs
Bicycles total, I have no idea - I will guess 50 lbs total
Canoe is highly unlikely to be honest in most all trips, but lets include it also...it has to be 75 or more lbs..ill say 100 lbs?
Future generator = 150 lbs
small portable grill = 20 lbs
let me stop there and sub-total = 670 lbs

Toungue weight of the 28' Ive been told when all is said and done can get to 1200 lbs

Kids have a habit of growing as they get older. Presumably the plan is to keep the TV for some years?

There's also the weight of any cover you put on the bed of a pick-up.

Plus the weight of the vehicle portion of the hitch. This can run 50 to 200 lbs depending on the hitch selection.

In the less payload department, if using a WD hitch, then some of the tongue weight will be redistributed to the trailer axles.

[gmw photos]

Originally Posted by PharmGeek

alright, I am about to talk weights here....dont laugh...dont say crap

I weight 147 lbs

My wife (and dont you dare say I said this) may weigh in the neighborhood of 170 or so right now (had a baby 5 months ago - she will likely lose 10 more pounds in the coming months).

Our kids make up what...uhh...less than 40 lbs....

So people = 350 ish lbs
Bicycles total, I have no idea - I will guess 50 lbs total
Canoe is highly unlikely to be honest in most all trips, but lets include it also...it has to be 75 or more lbs..ill say 100 lbs?
Future generator = 150 lbs
small portable grill = 20 lbs
let me stop there and sub-total = 670 lbs

Toungue weight of the 28' Ive been told when all is said and done can get to 1200 lbs

And if you are like most folks, in time, you find other junk to take with you. It may be firewood. Or for a boondocking trip, it might be extra water. Who knows, at some time, you may want to take a couple of the kids friends. And kids have this annoying habit of growing too. At some point in the process, I will guarantee you you will decide to have a small tool bag. Etc.
And at some point even further in the process, you'll probably look at it all and say, "holy cow, I REALLY don't need all this stuff !" At that point, you'll start sorting out the wheat from the chaff, and the weight will actually go down.

All I am saying with all this is that a person needs to be realistic and honest with themself, and than make informed decisions. If you read around on this or other forums, you will find some folks who are adament about staying within load limits. You will find others who say it's importance is all overblown. Honest men can disagree, but "you" need to figure out what is comfortable and acceptable for "you".

I see you have started a couple of threads, and it sure looks like you are asking all the right questions, and more important, you are asking at the right time....that is, BEFORE you buy. Lots of us learned a lot of this the hard way over the years of trial and error ( who, me ?! ). Some of things I towed, and towed with, and in what manner, back in the late 60's and early 70's.......ummmm....let's just say I really don't want to admit to !

[PharmGeek]

thanks everyone

My weight list was not meant to be all inclusive...I just was kicking it off with the purpose to try and begin to rule out options.

I fear the tundra even with some conservative estimates will not provide the payload I need as determined by the limits set by manufacturer.

Indeed the kids grow..and believe it or not I have a big dewalt toolbag that is damn heavy with tools I got for xmas 2012 I would keep my toolbag pretty basic, but it still would be 50 lbs at least when I was done with it I expect. Boondocking is a real likelihood...so yeah, extra water....some firewood possibly....gas...im unfamiliar with how much propane one needs when out and about so knowing if I would end up needing more propane...

Point being, it may be of help for me to create some estimated reasonable "heaviest" load to consider.

Indeed, I plan on keeping the truck till the wheels fall off...i am NOT the type of person to trade in a reliable well functioning vehicle - despite it's age.

Im so confused by the interwebs...folks will talk of diesel reliability and longevity...and others will talk about them being a cost sink hole....I do not have a dog in any of these fights, but would enjoy making an informed decision.

Ive started reading that towing guide PDF

[PharmGeek]

on a quick side note, my wife (also a pharmacist) had switched jobs back in april to another pharmacy (publix) and she started off "floating" - they fast tracked her to a store of her own that is up the road from our house...and that means going from 30 hour workweek to 42 hour workweek...that means that we are in even better shape now....mo money (sorry, just an exciting side note, thought she was going to have to float for a while before something opened up)

[dwightdi]

I have had a Chevy dually crew cab, full box since 2003. Before that we towed with several 3/4 ton vans for 30 years. I had to fight the wheel on the vans when the trucks passed. My wife had an even tougher time with the trucks on the interstates. She really did not like driving in construction. The dually has a wider and longer wheelbase that the vans and she now has no problem towing. Since it has graduated springs, the ride, when lightly loaded, is no more stiff than the vans. We use light w/d bars on a Reese and do not find the ride more harsh than the vans when we are towing. We do run the tire pressures a little lower that when we used the vans. We also use it to tow fairly heavy sailboats. It is a 8.1 L gas hog, but the vans were only slightly better.

[Ag&Au]

If one is inclined to buy a dually to protect from lose of control in case of blowout, I believe that finding a truck with 4 wheels on the front axle would be a better investment. A front blowout is much more difficult to control than a rear tire one.

You can add all sorts of options and upgrades to a truck and trailer to protect against unexpected failure. The best option however is to inspect everything frequently and ensure every component is functioning up to spec and within specs.

A tire pressure monitoring system is an excellent hedge against blowouts.

In short there is no Airstream trailer that I know of that would require a Dually to tow. Just be sure whatever you use is within specifications and set up correctly.

In addition don't believe everything you hear in a hospital or read in a forum. Put most of your faith in what manufacturers specify about their equipment. Their financial gains or losses depend on the specifications' accuracy.

Ken

[gmw photos]

Originally Posted by MaxTow

It was meant as a joke (hence the smiley) -

I was arguing a few posts back that the F250 doesn't make much sense as compared with the fully decked out F150 - and that the F350 is the logical move for a significant increase in payload / towing capacity.

But that going to DRW was over some other arbitrary imaginary line and was now 'ridiculous'.

It's hard to convey sarcasm on line sometimes...

Ah....got ya !
And yes, regarding the heavier pickups, I would encourage anyone who "needs a truck" to go test drive a late model one ton duallie. If you have not been in a modern one, I will almost guarantee you, it is not what you think it is.....you will likely be pleasently surprised.

[perryg114]

You forgot about the pink flamingos and the yard gnomes. Those things can really add up.

Perry

Originally Posted by PharmGeek

alright, I am about to talk weights here....dont laugh...dont say crap

I weight 147 lbs

My wife (and dont you dare say I said this) may weigh in the neighborhood of 170 or so right now (had a baby 5 months ago - she will likely lose 10 more pounds in the coming months).

Our kids make up what...uhh...less than 40 lbs....

So people = 350 ish lbs
Bicycles total, I have no idea - I will guess 50 lbs total
Canoe is highly unlikely to be honest in most all trips, but lets include it also...it has to be 75 or more lbs..ill say 100 lbs?
Future generator = 150 lbs
small portable grill = 20 lbs
let me stop there and sub-total = 670 lbs

Toungue weight of the 28' Ive been told when all is said and done can get to 1200 lbs

[gmw photos]

Originally Posted by PharmGeek

Im so confused by the interwebs...folks will talk of diesel reliability and longevity...and others will talk about them being a cost sink hole....I do not have a dog in any of these fights, but would enjoy making an informed decision.

Realistically, in my opinion, the difference in engine longevity for these diesel pickups compared to a gas engine is of little significance. Honestly, a well maintained modern gas engine will likely outlast the body and interior of the truck anyway. The thing that really ends up causing us to get rid of high mileage vehicles is the sub systems ( electrical, heating and air, etc ) begin to get unreliable, so we start thinking....."I don't trust this thing to go far from home in.". Yet the engine is often still fundementally sound.

So, don't buy a diesel for it's longevity, nor for the hope of having lower overall operating costs. Buy it because you need or want 600 lb-ft of torque.
When I drop the gooseneck of the four horse trailer on the pin, and load up to go to a show, we are right at 21,000 lbs gross combined. In this scene, a turbocharged diesel is a very nice prime mover.

[PharmGeek]

there should be some basic calculator we can plug in our numbers and out comes TV's that fall within those acceptable limits....plug and chug