GM 5.3 V8 Better Performance

[lsbrodsky]

After realizing that several of my recent cars have had tunes to improve performance, I did some research and found http://www.blackbearperformance.com/. There are a number of forums discussing bbp expertise. This will void your warranty so do not read on if you will not take that risk.
I bought their hardware logged my stock condition and sent it to Justin. He asked what I wanted in a tune and I told him when towing, better grade performance, better cooling on grades, and generally better acceleration. I also wanted 87/89 octane options.He then sent me tune files that I downloaded into the hardware and into the truck.
I recently returned from a trailer trip, on level topography. But wow! You can feel the improved low-end torque and as a result, acceleration and shifting are improved. I especially notice that cruise control is now useful. The truck used to downshift on very moderate grades just driving down the interstate, but now I can use cruise control without it always hunting.
He returns stock tunes as well so if you are worried about warrant work, you can keep the hardware in your glove box and return the tune to stock before going to service.
I have been told by tuners for many years that GM is very conservative on their ECU settings so I am not at all worried. On the other hand, I am most pleased with the improved performance.
Larry

[hoagies_OTR]

I was fortunate to be in the area where Black Bear Performance was having a tune meet about a month ago. I can't tell you how pleased I am with his work. I went with a 93oct tune but also have the stock maps and an 87oct tune for "bad" gas from the Gulf of Mexico. Shift times are down and shift firmness is up. I noticed my transmission temps are at least an average of 15-20F lower than what I was experiencing before the tune, no more lugging in too high of a gear followed but a 2 gear downshift. Throttle response and power delivery has improved across the entire RPM range.

I'm thinking about performing another data log to send to Justin to tweak soon. I must have had a lot of carbon build up in the combustion chamber because I was getting some audible pinging at WOT. I ran a can of Mopar Combustion Cleaner through the throttle body and that seems to cleared up the carbon knock nicely. I tried Seafoam twice before that, one aerosol can through the TB and the a can of liquid stuff delivered through vacuum lines, and I was still getting timing pulled (or pinging at WOT). The Mopar CCC seems to work better, or maybe the Seafoam just loosened it up first. Maybe he can squeeze a little more out of my small block. Also want to get E85 tables when Class 1 is available again, curious how that'll feel compared to dino gas.

[nvestysly]

Interesting topic. I'll do some research and see if this applies to the tow vehicles in our stable. A friend of our is always tweaking/tuning his vehicle. Don't know that I want to always be searching for that "just right" setting but I wouldn't mind a little better all-round performance.

[RFP]

Originally Posted by lsbrodsky

[snip]
He returns stock tunes as well so if you are worried about warrant work, you can keep the hardware in your glove box and return the tune to stock before going to service.
[snip]
Larry

While I can't speak with any authority about the truck engines, I do know for a fact that you can't make "tuning" changes to Corvettes and then change back without your tuning leaving a fingerprint. When you think about it, it really makes no sense that the engineers would leave such a loophole in the system that would allow people to fiddle with the operation of the engines (perhaps even with disastrous results) and their "fiddling" still be undetected.

Of course, you correctly warned about this voiding the warranty.

[dznf0g]

RFP Is absolutely correct, but do as you will.

[USAtraveler]

You can not just muck around in the ECU without having to pay the piper someday. Automotive engineers spend a great deal of time designing and testing the best possible all-around performance algorithms. Sooner or later there is a price to pay for second guessing what is "best."

[lsbrodsky]

I think you are incorrect. Their view of optimum is what their target user needs, with a big margin of safety. I think there is a lot of wiggle room in their ECU without jeopardizing integrity of the powertrain. I have had tunes before, as have many people. If you tune at the razor's edge you are taking a big risk, but there is a lot below the razor's edge.
Larry

[dznf0g]

Originally Posted by lsbrodsky

I think you are incorrect. Their view of optimum is what their target user needs, with a big margin of safety. I think there is a lot of wiggle room in their ECU without jeopardizing integrity of the powertrain. I have had tunes before, as have many people. If you tune at the razor's edge you are taking a big risk, but there is a lot below the razor's edge.
Larry

It would be nice if that were so, but it's not. But if that opinion makes you feel better and justifies you messing with the programming, be my guest.

It it also more expensive to engineer in "that big margin of safety" and "wiggle room", which make your position illogical.

[rostam]

Originally Posted by USAtraveler

You can not just muck around in the ECU without having to pay the piper someday. Automotive engineers spend a great deal of time designing and testing the best possible all-around performance algorithms. Sooner or later there is a price to pay for second guessing what is "best."

I agree 100%.

[field & stream]

Originally Posted by dznf0g

It would be nice if that were so, but it's not. But if that opinion makes you feel better and justifies you messing with the programming, be my guest.

It it also more expensive to engineer in "that big margin of safety" and "wiggle room", which make your position illogical.

With respect to all comments here, one of the factors controlling (limiting) how the ECU's are programmed is the required EPA testing and gas mileage stickers on the new cars. They are programming the motors to do well on those tests.

In my opinion and experience (with a re-programmed and supercharged 6-liter GM motor) there is plenty of room for improved performance -- perhaps at the expense of gas mileage and emissions -- without any adverse impact on engine longevity.

[dznf0g]

Originally Posted by field & stream

With respect to all comments here, one of the factors controlling (limiting) how the ECU's are programmed is the required EPA testing and gas mileage stickers on the new cars. They are programming the motors to do well on those tests.

In my opinion and experience (with a re-programmed and supercharged 6-liter GM motor) there is plenty of room for improved performance -- perhaps at the expense of gas mileage and emissions -- without any adverse impact on engine longevity.

As a manufacturer's rep, I agree with all your statements except the last line. I have seen a number of "tunes" which have indeed trashed engines and transmissions.

[field & stream]

Originally Posted by dznf0g

As a manufacturer's rep, I agree with all your statements except the last line. I have seen a number of "tunes" which have indeed trashed engines and transmissions.

Good point and I agree with you. My statement was too broad: some people can screw up anything! My motor was built and programmed by pro's with years of experience.

In addition, I am sure that some of the owners who had their motors "tuned" abused them by driving too hard.

[slowmover]

Specific output per cubic inch is far higher than in years past. It's a very different world now. Drivetrains are almost more software than hardware.

And cautions about messing with software are spot on, IMO. In the past twenty years in the Diesel community I've noticed that "tuned" vehicles get sold sooner, the owner on to abuse the next vehicle, also IMO. It was a buying requirement of mine now nearly ten years ago in the purchase of my one ton Dodge that no evidence of a tuner or GN hitch be present.

Someone who wants "more" performance is better off changing to shorter axle ratios and/or tires.

Absolutely, there is NO free lunch.

As one CTD owner used to sign his posts, "I am my own warranty station". With this attitude comes appropriate responsibility.


1990 35' Silver Streak
2004 555 Cummins

[lsbrodsky]

I worried about that with my Corvette a lot, until I joined the Corvette community and discovered so many owners had tunes without any problems. Some of them even drove the pixx out of their cars. So, I had a supercharger and a tune done on my Corvette, but only tracked it once. There are numerous cars where the manufacturer simply tunes the car for more performance and sells it as a higher cost/more powerful model, without adding any hardware. My wife's Volvo Polestar tune is an example of that.
I understand that if the manufacturer does it you get a warranty, not so in other circumstances. I also understand that you take a big risk if you use Joe's Backyard Tuning. If this shortens the life of my truck, you can say I told you so.
Larry

[field & stream]

I agree that there is "no free lunch". But if done properly you may be paying in top-end horsepower to get more low-end torque, which is a better tune for towing. You may pay in somewhat lower gas mileage for better performance, but that is a personal choice and may be better for towing.

I don't think tuning means that you are necessarily paying in engine life expectancy.

[USAtraveler]

It's not just the longevity factor that may be affected by retuning for higher output. You will likely pay in the short run by lower gas mileage, increased exhaust emissions, and damage to components such as your catalytic converter. You may be personally indifferent to your impact on the environment we all share, but you may feel it in your pocketbook when you have to replace expensive drive train components or the ECU itself. I don't know the vehicle laws in your state, but here your vehicle has to pass periodic emission inspections. Test data is fed directly to the DMV where it is instantaneously compared to mfg's specs. Testing now includes detection of any ECU reset just for the inspection procedure. How do you think they caught

[USAtraveler]

The German weekly Welt am Sonntag first reported over a week ago that the California Air Resources Board (CARB) had known for several months about software which uses automatic transmission programs to vary vehicles' CO2 output by detecting if they are being tested for emissions. The sophisticated sofware is suspected of having been used by Audi models until relatively recently, and could also be triggered by a button inside the car by those with knowledge of its operation.

Read more: http://autoweek.com/article/vw-diese...#ixzz4QItqHQ6q

[BTB]

It makes my blood boil to see all that soot coming out of some jackasses "tuned and deleted" diesel - why someone like that thinks its ok for them to trash our lungs, cause athsma for thousands of people etc, is beyond me.