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Old 10-27-2011, 09:20 PM   #85
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Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS View Post
I was working at a Chevy store at the time, and had bugged our Factory Rep for a year with no luck.

Believe it or not I finally found this one on ebay. It didn't sell, so I called the owner, got some info and when I ran the vin# found out it was a GM fleet car, and was sold as a demo in mid 2007 with 5500k on the clock. Drove down to NC, picked it up and haven't looked back since.

Sometimes it's better to be lucky than smart.....

Bob
Some guys have all the luck.

I had an in at Lexus about 10 years ago and could have gotten one of their manufacturer demos, basically a car that one of the higher ups had to drive home on occasion. But I would have had to have a Lexus employee buy it and then I would have to buy it from them. Too much hassle.

My main problem buying used is that the used cars I get always seem to need me to put in a couple of thousand within a couple of months of my getting them no matter how slightly used they are.

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Rion
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Old 10-28-2011, 06:43 AM   #86
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five million five hundred thousand miles? WOW!

Yes but it was at "warp speed" and i haven't caught up to myself yet.

Bob
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Old 10-29-2011, 08:06 PM   #87
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Diesels

Questions for you guys that know more than I about diesels (which is most anybody). Somebody mentioned a few posts back that the cost of a diesel added about $1k to the price of a new TV. Why is that? My impression is that diesel technology is simpler than a gasser. Why would the price go up instead of down? What am i missing here? Marketing nonsense maybe?

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Old 10-30-2011, 06:39 AM   #88
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Diesel engines add quite a bit more to the original MSRP than $1k on a pickup truck, more like from $5 -$8k. While the engine doesn't use an ignition system to work, the very high combustion pressures require a more substantially built engine, from block to rods to valves. The fuel injection system also uses expensive components. The attendant systems (cooling, transmission, etc) also have to deal with very high torque and heat output as a result of the engine working hard. Thus, a good deal more weight as well.

A well-designed diesel will outlast the gasoline engine, and perform better in it's lifetime (more efficient fuel burn). The tradeoff of weight, complexity, etc, is usually best for those who will work the vehicle, not just use it as a commuter and occasional TV.

In smaller vehicles -- SUV's -- the diesel adds a price premium and often substantially better fuel economy. Diesel as a fuel has quite a bit more energy embodied per gallon, and diesel engines are quite a bit more miserly than gasoline ones in using that energy.

With the advent of direct-injection gasoline engines the gap is closing on fuel efficiency. The diesel will always have the advantage due to fuel type.

But it all comes at a price, on both sides of the ledger.
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Old 11-01-2011, 03:28 PM   #89
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Never had any diesel issues with the Duramax, like the old Ford diesels, other than dealing with the big rigs at the truck stops. They kind of really don't like the TT types in their space, but we all share the same fuel tax and road.
SL4BLLT,

I used to have a job in college as a transfer driver for Ryder trucks. Basically, I would show up at the Gardena, CA facility at 5AM and then get a ticket and a ride to LAX followed by a flight to some part of the Western U.S. where I would pickup a truck and drive it back to Gardena. During this time I noticed that there were basically two types of truck drivers, locals and over the road types. I found that most local drivers were rather rude, but the over the road drivers were true professionals and in addition to be very courteous were always willing to share their knowledge and experience and as a result I have a great respect for what these guys and gals do and put up with. Of course there are both courteous and rude drivers of both types, so maybe you just managed to come in contact with the wrong type. I hope that if you don't know any of the good over the road drivers, that one day you get to meet some. I have one as a client now and he is one of my nicest clients.

Of all the advice that I received from over the road drivers during that job, the one thing that really sticks in my mind was a moment in a Northern California truck stop restaurant, where after breakfast, the driver at the counter next to me when we were parting said, "Stay safe out there."

Happy Airstreaming,
Rion
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Old 11-01-2011, 03:31 PM   #90
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Questions for you guys that know more than I about diesels (which is most anybody). Somebody mentioned a few posts back that the cost of a diesel added about $1k to the price of a new TV. Why is that? My impression is that diesel technology is simpler than a gasser. Why would the price go up instead of down? What am i missing here? Marketing nonsense maybe?

Jim
Jim,

In a word, numbers. Detroit makes more gassers than diesels, so they can amortize the cost of production across a large number of trucks. In my recent shopping trips for a new TT, the difference was actually closer to 5 ~ 6K though.

Cheers,
Rion
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Old 11-02-2011, 08:47 PM   #91
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When you really look at the total cost of gas vs diesel engine life, the gas wins hands down. The diesel engine even when it lasts 300-400,000 miles takes an enormous amount of costs for normal maintenance, injector replacement, glow plugs, and other diesel maintenance issues. A gas rig only needs a new set of plugs every 60k with a fuel filter every 20k at $12. Even if a gas rig needs to be rebuilt, it is 1/2 or less the cost of a diesel engine rebuild. Most diesel engines will make it 200k if they are lucky and then things begin to fail. Most gas engines will last that long easy. Diesel dudes love their diesels but the reality is that a gas rig will do the same thing cheaper in every respect. Been to diesel land and returned to a gas rig.

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Old 11-03-2011, 03:42 AM   #92
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When you really look at the total cost of gas vs diesel engine life, the gas wins hands down. The diesel engine even when it lasts 300-400,000 miles takes an enormous amount of costs for normal maintenance, injector replacement, glow plugs, and other diesel maintenance issues. A gas rig only needs a new set of plugs every 60k with a fuel filter every 20k at $12. Even if a gas rig needs to be rebuilt, it is 1/2 or less the cost of a diesel engine rebuild. Most diesel engines will make it 200k if they are lucky and then things begin to fail. Most gas engines will last that long easy. Diesel dudes love their diesels but the reality is that a gas rig will do the same thing cheaper in every respect. Been to diesel land and returned to a gas rig.

Pap
Hardly know where to start. Opinion is one thing, but the facts to arrive at the conclusions are another. A well-chosen diesel will have similar or lower op-costs, and work considerably longer than a gas engine. Some diesel engines from some manufacturers don't have a good record, and are designed to last only 250k miles (some Ford & GM years).

Were these contentions true then commercial operators would run gasoline and they decidedly do not. The advantage to diesel is clear: the more miles contemplated, the more likely it is the right choice.

It may not matter for an RV'er, granted, especially when trading vehicles every few years.
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Old 11-03-2011, 07:59 AM   #93
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Were these contentions true then commercial operators would run gasoline and they decidedly do not....

It may not matter for an RV'er, granted, especially when trading vehicles every few years.
Ups runs vehicles in 10-25k gvw similar to our gcw when towing. They went from almost all gas in the 80-90 to some diesels 90-2000s and now are buying almost all gas again. Gm 6.0 and 8.1s with some cummins 6.7.

The planned lifespan of their vehicles are 25years...

I believe they are one of the biggest private commercial operaters around. They very carefully track cost per mile over those 25 years and the gassers win hands down.

If someone wants to pretend they are a 80000lb semi rig then go diesel. Under 25000lbs? I like gas
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Old 11-03-2011, 09:43 AM   #94
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Speaking of pickup trucks owned by individuals or small fleets. If the rest of us were as big as UPS then we could influence external costs in our favor as well.
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Old 11-03-2011, 11:04 AM   #95
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Ups runs vehicles in 10-25k gvw similar to our gcw when towing. They went from almost all gas in the 80-90 to some diesels 90-2000s and now are buying almost all gas again. Gm 6.0 and 8.1s with some cummins 6.7.

The planned lifespan of their vehicles are 25years...
The planned lifespan of their vehicles may be 25years, but not their vehicle engines.

I know they have a regular rebuild schedule on the engines in their fleet vehicles, as I have a friend who bid on the contract in this area. The engine rebuilds are part of the operating cost. So, they don't run their vehicle engines any extrordinarily high mileage.
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Old 11-03-2011, 11:51 AM   #96
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Yes most of the gassers go 300,000. Ive seen some give out around 200 highest ive driven was 400k. In my building the motors are pulled (and sold i guess) and new or refurbs are put in. Most run .5 - 1.5 million unless operating costs are to high. First ran of sprinters where scrapped at 200-300k due to high cost per mileand some ford chasis diesels got scraped at 10years.

Rednax you said commercial operators do not run gas, i guess if you scale it back to small fleets that run diesels than its accurate. But in the real world lots of commercial operators run gas. Sure the costs are lower if you have 200,000 units but the costs for the diesel work would be lower as well.
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Old 11-04-2011, 06:53 AM   #97
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If you tow all day,every day, then by all means get a diesel, but your overall costs are still going to be more than with a gas rig setup to tow. Big diesel rigs are a totally different animal than your normal pickup truck. All I am saying is the normal person doesn't "need" a diesel, they just "want"; which is a big difference.

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Old 11-04-2011, 06:54 AM   #98
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Who brought in vehicles unsuited to use as TV's?

Running packages around town is not the same job description as for a TV that is expected to range widely in re climate & terrain, cross-country.

As to "commercial operator" I should have clarified the point for those for whom a pickup truck and a few of it's variations are the preferred vehicle. Unless someone is using Fed-Ex spec vans to pull TT's now. "Commercial operator" should also have been clarified as being also those for whom the pickup truck was more closely developed with their needs: farmers, ranchers, contractors, etc, whose use is close to that of an RV'er.

As a Suburban is just a variation of a pickup truck -- and I don't see this style vehicle used in package delivery (or similar use) -- I hardly see the point of this other introduction. Unless we include fleets from overseas where I doubt gasoline is the preferred fuel.

A Suburban with the proposed (roughly) 300-HP / 500-TQ engine would cover all contingencies for use. And with economical fuel use. As is (was) seen in earlier pickups before non-DEF emissions controls and stoopid horsepower wars took off.

If I am lazy and not paying attention, my pickup falls below 20-mpg. In the city. My single "repair" has been an ignition switch. Oh, and I replaced the u-joints. All of this past seven-years and 150k miles, an experience not at all unique. So choose well, and don't believe that all brands or designs are the same, that personal preference (as equally stupid as "lifestyle") being the sole factor for "choice" is well-advised.

.
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