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Old 07-06-2011, 06:13 PM   #43
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I'm almost afraid to ask this. What is the cost of one of these (drive off)? Do you boys get the idea Ford dealers are overly "proud" of them? I'm a dedicated Ford guy. Five of them in the driveway. My current TV is a '98 F150 Lariat. Nice truck, but a little long in the tooth at 165k miles. Looking at an upgrade in the next couple of years.

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Old 07-06-2011, 07:39 PM   #44
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Motzen,
Get the ecoboost. I have supercab with 8 foot box and hd payload package and max tow.
You won't even know the bike is in the back and the trailer will pull just fine.
I have a 400 lb commercial cap on mine and tow a 31 foot airstream. Just went from Toronto to Pennsylvania and it towed in sixth and dropped to fifth on the hills. Now those aren't mountains but those are both overdrive.
I didn't even need to put it in towhaul mode.
They say to do that if the tranny is hunting for gears and shifting a lot.
Also the fuel economy when not towing is great.
Al
Al, thanks for the info. Great to hear that you are happy with it and that it pulls fine. Any idea how the ride w/ the hd payload pkg is compared to the F250? I am hoping that it is not as harsh.
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Old 07-06-2011, 08:11 PM   #45
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The ride is definitely firm. With the cap and some tools in the back it seems fine.
When towing the trailer it is very smooth. If you put a 800 lb load in the bed along with the trailer it would be very nice.
I think you need to see what the payload of the 250 is and compare it that way.
If I remember correctly it isn't much more payload. The 250 is a heavier vehicle without payload.
And the 250 is more expensive to buy and I am sure brakes etc. are more expensive.
Al
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Old 07-07-2011, 08:52 AM   #46
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The ride is definitely firm. With the cap and some tools in the back it seems fine.
When towing the trailer it is very smooth. If you put a 800 lb load in the bed along with the trailer it would be very nice.
I think you need to see what the payload of the 250 is and compare it that way.
If I remember correctly it isn't much more payload. The 250 is a heavier vehicle without payload.
And the 250 is more expensive to buy and I am sure brakes etc. are more expensive.
Al
Good to hear, and yep, the 250 payload is just over 3k lbs.
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Old 07-07-2011, 10:42 AM   #47
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It is amazing to read about all of the good reports on this V6.
It seemed to come out of nowhere. Who designed this engine? Was it a Ford design or did an outside company put the ideas in motion?
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Old 07-07-2011, 11:16 AM   #48
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It is amazing to read about all of the good reports on this V6.
It seemed to come out of nowhere. Who designed this engine? Was it a Ford design or did an outside company put the ideas in motion?
It's a Ford engine, but the turbo+direct gasoline injection isn't entirely new. Several other companies have already used it, it's just that the technology required to make it usable in daily operation has gotten affordable. The sensor and computation parts of engine management systems are fast, reliable and powerful enough now to make this work. Other markets have had engines using this technology since the '90s, and there have been a few engines on the market in the US in the last few years.

What makes these engines worth the effort is the ability to run in different modes under different loads... lean-burn in low-power cruise modes, stoichiometric mixtures for medium power and richer-than-stoichiometric for maximum output, without having to approximate the mixture with only predetermined fuel maps. In addition to the fuel quantity, they can vary the fuel injection timing for a stratified charge, and injecting the cold fuel later in the compression stroke lets them manage knock much better than a port-injected engine.

It's not magic, it still will burn a bunch of fuel if you're dragging 11,000 lb of trailer, but it doesn't waste as much dead-heading around town as a big-displacement engine does. If it does well in service and longevity, my next tow vehicle will most likely be an EcoBoost.
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Old 07-07-2011, 11:27 AM   #49
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Having experienced the turbos of the '80's, it is hard not to be skeptical. I understand computer technology is light years ahead of the '80's, but are the turbos themselves more reliable?

I assume other manufacturers are working on similar technology—any news of that?

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Old 07-07-2011, 11:59 AM   #50
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Having experienced the turbos of the '80's, it is hard not to be skeptical. I understand computer technology is light years ahead of the '80's, but are the turbos themselves more reliable?

I assume other manufacturers are working on similar technology—any news of that?

Gene
Compared to the '80s, modern turbos are VASTLY more reliable. (I had an '80 Mercury Capri with a 2.3l turbocharged 4-cylinder, with a carburetor!) Modern turbos typically have a cooled bearing and a pressure accumulator to maintain oil pressure to the bearing for a few minutes after shutdown.

We have had 4 modern turbocharged cars in the family ('01 VW GTI 1.8T traded in at 80k miles for my current '05 Subaru Legacy GT Ltd. wagon 2.5T with 66k miles, and an '02 Subaru WRX wagon with a 2.0T traded in at 155k miles for an '06 Subaru WRX wagon with a 2.5T that currently has 85k miles.) Zero problems with the turbo in any of the 4, though the VW had "entertaining" software issues from time to time.

VW has had turbocharged gasoline direct-injection engines in the US market for a few years. Hyundai and Kia have a 2-liter GDI turbo in their Sonata and Optima. I think BMW's current inline-6 turbos have direct injection, but I wouldn't bet a mortgage payment on that without doing some research first. I'm sure other manufacturers will bring competitive engines to market as well.
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Old 07-07-2011, 12:15 PM   #51
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Other markets have had engines using this technology since the '90s,
For sure. My buddy has an 18 year old Nissan Skyline GTR. It has a straight 6 (2.6L) with twin turbo's.
It is also all wheel drive with very heavy duty drive train components.

This car has been driven hard throughtout it's life, is still in one piece and drives fine today.
Still stock, it did the 1/4 mile last year (clocked at TIDragway) 13.60 @ 109MPH.
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Old 07-07-2011, 12:32 PM   #52
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For sure. My buddy has an 18 year old Nissan Skyline GTR. It has a straight 6 (2.6L) with twin turbo's.
It is also all wheel drive with very heavy duty drive train components.

This car has been driven hard throughtout it's life, is still in one piece and drives fine today.
Still stock, it did the 1/4 mile last year (clocked at TIDragway) 13.60 @ 109MPH.
The RB26DETT is an impressive engine with good specific output, but I'm pretty sure it's not direct-injected, which is one of the important features that makes the EcoBoost really stand out. It's a good example of the durability of more modern turbocharged/intercooled gasoline engines, though.

My intermediate response to CrawfordGene about the reliability of modern turbo engines didn't specify, but none of the engines I mentioned as working out so well for us are direct-injected either... I think Gene was asking about the reliability of the turbo itself.
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Old 07-07-2011, 12:40 PM   #53
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Yes DKB, Ford has almost 20 years of technology advancements since the Shyline's 6 was put into production.
It may be a big factor in the fact it is so tough and so far durable/reliable.
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Old 07-07-2011, 01:01 PM   #54
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How accessible is the water pump? Cooling has been a long time concern on turbo engines. My brother just spent big bucks getting his replaced, looks like it's in the same position on the EB.

Never mind just found out...
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Old 07-07-2011, 02:58 PM   #55
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Aluminum dissipates heat so much better than the big old iron engines.

Even on a hot summer day after coming off the highway with trailer in tow I have lifted the hood on our V6 G35. No blast of hot air like we used to get with the big iron V8's.

I guess the turbo's have their own cooling issues.
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Old 07-07-2011, 04:21 PM   #56
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Ford F-150 Turbo

When towing a trailer with the new V-6 and turbo. Is the turbo always engaged? I live out west and am concerned pulling the mountains
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