F350 With 34' AS Setup

[elolson]

I dumped my 3/4 Dodge and picked up this 2002 F350 Dually. Spent a few hours on the setup up. Comments on the pics? I was running 1200lb bars with a Reese dual cam anti-sway setup. I pulled off the cam bars, switched to 600lb bars, and am just running a weight distributing setup. The truck has a 4'' lift so I had to get a new shank and I left my Voyager in the Dodge when I traded it. Should have kept that , oh well picked up a P3, we'll see how that does in comparison. There is a slight slope on the part of the driveway that the truck is on. The trailer tires are on level concrete.

[M2HB]

I pull my 34' Avion with a 2000 Ford F-350 SRW truck and it works great.

[ElCamino Man]

Looks like one heck of a set-up! Proud to see ya traded a Dodge for a Ford lol. Is that a Lariat LE?

[SteveH]

The setup looks good, but I have to ask why you removed the Dual Cam sway control? Seems to me it could only help, not that much trouble, and doesn't weigh too much.

[dwightdi]

I pull my 34 with a 1 ton Chevy crewcab dually with a full box. I use a Reese dual cam and found that adding the frictional dampener made it even better. I do not transfer all that much weight, as the 8.1 engine puts enough weight over the front wheels. Trailer sets level and all the wheels are evenly loaded. Yours should work well, but if I were you, I would try out adding the twin cam and frictional dampener into the mix and run them for 500 miles or so to see how they compare.

[Big C]

Our TV is a 2001 F350 single axle with an EAZ-Lift hitch, 1000 lb bars. Anit-sway control is always used after that first time a semi passed me doing 75-80. Sure came in handy while up and back to Canada in Wyoming on I25 with those crosswinds.

[slowmover]

The Dual Cam is worth the small trouble to set up on a scale. This thread goes part of the way through setting up a Suburban with a late model trailer. The "chart" works the same way: restore FA weight to the solo value via leverage for best steering, and proper distribution to the TT axles increases their braking force. Benefits all around, not "just" anti-sway improvements.

The size of the TV has little to do with best performance.

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[ElCamino Man]

O boy here we go again lol. The typical "do I need a weight distributing hitch" argument lol.

[elolson]

Originally Posted by SteveH

The setup looks good, but I have to ask why you removed the Dual Cam sway control? Seems to me it could only help, not that much trouble, and doesn't weigh too much.

I took off the dual cam to see if there was a difference. I have never towed without that setup before. When we first got the trailer I tried a 1/2 ton pickup, short bed, single cab, yeah you all can laugh, but I did not know any better at the time and I barely made it from 1 highway exit to the next and then had to stop at urgent care to have my finger nails removed from the steering wheel. Went from that experience to the Dodge and dual cam setup which worked great. I did think it put a lot of stress on the A-frame, made a lot of racket on turns, and I was always taking it off to back into my driveway to get the sharp cuts I needed.

So add a 1 ton dual rear wheel and I figured why not try something different. Just got back from our first trip in the Frogger and it towed like a champ without the dual cam. Then again, DRW is a pretty stable setup and I guess I expected nothing less, plus less racket and I did not hear a peep backing up or on sharp turns. Of course to those folks considering a dual cam, don't let my neurotic tendencies in this post influence you, it worked really well and did what it was supposed to, I simply would rather be without it for reasons that are not entirely rational.

Ford MPG 12.2 at 63.5mph (4.11 gears and I heard to keep it under 2k rpm for mileage)
Dodge was 14.3 same route and 70-75.

I guess the good old days of a 7.3l were not quite as good as advertised. I think I read some article where a guy was hauling RVs for retirement, with basically the same truck, and getting 19 with a million miles. All I can say is that is not my experience driving conservatively and pulling a stream, one of the most aerodynamic trailers on the market.

2002 Ford to 2005 Cummins was not even close, it is hard to beat the low end torque of a straight 6. Powerstroke needed to be 2k or better or it was hurting but I am also learning its personality and it is a standard which takes even more learning. But 3 years in the diesel wars is a long time. I think the 6.0l, if you could keep it running, was a mean machine, or so I have heard. Now days, all 3 have 800ft-lbs plus which is probably real close to being able to tear stuff up if you are not careful.

Thanks for the great comments. It is a Lariat. I do not know about the LE part. It has every option that was available, leather, dual power heated seats, 6 disc changer, etc. The interior is way better than the '05 Dodger.

[ElCamino Man]

If it was a Lariat LE, itd say Lariat LE on the seats. I dont think it is since they were usually two tone.

Im gonna sway wayyyy off subject here: I am debating tradin in the ol gas hog of a 460 and get a truck almost identical to yours. What are some things you like/dislike about it?

[excellaf350]

nice set up. You wont need much on the bars there is enough spring rate on the truck to handle the weight but the sway control of the hitch helps. A nice brake control also helps alot.

I tow a 29' with a 2003 F350 CCSB SRW (7.3L PSD) and I use a Hensley. It tows great. Honestly I am very pleased with the way it rides. Wife, kids and bed full of equipment I can set the cruise control and sit back and relax, it just goes. Pulls hills no problem. Earlier this year we did a trip to NY on the way home took about a 5% grade for about 5 miles and it was no sweat. I rarely have to take it out of OD. One of my friends tows his 34 with a 99 F350 CCLB SRW and he has no problems either. Only other difference is the 4x4 and I have 4x2. At 65-70 mph I get about 13/14 mpg.

[Wazbro]

Originally Posted by elolson

Ford MPG 12.2 at 63.5mph (4.11 gears and I heard to keep it under 2k rpm for mileage)

Powerstroke needed to be 2k or better or it was hurting

The theory about keeping the RPM under 2K only works when the vehicle is not towing and not heavily loaded for many vehicles. Many vehicles struggle and get worse mileage if you keep the RPM too low.

[elolson]

Originally Posted by ElCamino Man

If it was a Lariat LE, itd say Lariat LE on the seats. I dont think it is since they were usually two tone.

Im gonna sway wayyyy off subject here: I am debating tradin in the ol gas hog of a 460 and get a truck almost identical to yours. What are some things you like/dislike about it?

It is a great truck. I spent a *lot* of time on the internet before searching for a replacement for the Dodge. I wanted 4x4, reliability, and a manual transmission. The IH 7.3l came up as having good power and rock solid reliability. It has 4x4 and the interior is very nice. It is quiet and very well appointed for a pick-up of that vintage. I just like manual transmissions and this one works great. The ride is stiff there is no question about that, more so than I expected.

I have only owned this truck for about 3 weeks and have only taken it on 1 trip, so my opinion on it is not worth a whole lot, but here goes

OK likes:
Interior finish is outstanding, very comfortable.
4x4
Stable as a rock
Manual is easy to use, I mostly shift without the clutch
Seems to have decent power, I have just not learned how to use the engine yet with the manual. When I got my gears right it pulled just fine, when I missed a shift it was painful since I lost road speed and rpms and the turbo unwound.
Roomy back seat, much more room that the Dodge crew cab. We are going to have #4 show up in about 5 weeks and the space is a definite advantage.


Dislikes:
The lift kit is stupid, but that is what it came with. Who would put a lift kit on a truck spec'd for towing is beyond me but it is what it is. it would be way to cost prohibitive to remove it so I am going to live with it.
The ride is stiff. I mean real stiff. The 3/4 ton Dodge was much softer than this ford. I think the new fords have coil suspension and ride better, this one has leafs in the front. I have heard that this is hard on Airstreams but I went out and jumped on the hitched trailer and it had good pliability if that is meaningful. I ran the truck at 52lbs air on the way back and it did not seem to make a difference, it was 60lbs on the way up (as spec'd on the inside of the driver door). This is also partly why I tried the 600lb bars and took of the dual cam sway control, to soften up the ride for the trailer.

So right now the dislike list is pretty short. I bought a low mile truck (63k for a 2002) and I paid for it and I pretty much got what I was looking for (sans the lift kit but that is minor in the big picture). New trucks are new trucks, they get more powerful every year, the interior gets better, and the ride gets better but they also get a whole lot more expensive. I guess if I ever want more power I can spend a few grand and get the turbo upgrades, exhaust, chips, etc but I'd rather have the reliability right now.

Gearing is a bit steep, I mean 4.11s, it is at 2500 If I want to go 75. I might throw in some 3.55s. The whole point of having gears is that you can pick a lower one if you need more torque multiplication and with a 4x4 with a low speed option, you have all the gearing you would ever need. For right now I am going to let it be and learn. I intend to take that same trip at 75 the next time and compare the mileage and see how it does.

Thanks for the comments and interest.

[elolson]

Originally Posted by Wazbro

The theory about keeping the RPM under 2K only works when the vehicle is not towing and not heavily loaded for many vehicles. Many vehicles struggle and get worse mileage if you keep the RPM too low.

Thanks for the comment. I do not know much about this engine at this point, on paper it should have been close enough to my Dodge to not make much of a difference but boy it sure was different towing on the hills. But I honestly don't think I was driving the truck right, wrong rpms, wrong shift points, etc. I am going to try more RPMs next time. The Dodge would down shift and run up almost to the 3k redline but would pull like an animal. I was not that hard on the Ford, I only took it up to 2200 rpms and did not try to push it and seemed to wiff it every time but a few on my downshifts. I have driven semi trucks with 10 speeds and downshifting on hills just seemed a lot easier in big trucks. You just let off the fuel, pull it out of gear, rev the engine a bit, and slide it into the next lower and everything was lined up, road speed, engine speed and gear choice. But those are straight cut gears without synchros and enormous engines that keep their rpms better which works to slow everything down. I nailed it a few times with the Ford and it was sweet, kept the turbo wound, smooth shift, and kept right on pulling but coming out of OD into 5th was not a smooth shift for me in general.

[elolson]

Originally Posted by excellaf350

nice set up. You wont need much on the bars there is enough spring rate on the truck to handle the weight but the sway control of the hitch helps. A nice brake control also helps alot.

I tow a 29' with a 2003 F350 CCSB SRW (7.3L PSD) and I use a Hensley. It tows great. Honestly I am very pleased with the way it rides. Wife, kids and bed full of equipment I can set the cruise control and sit back and relax, it just goes. Pulls hills no problem. Earlier this year we did a trip to NY on the way home took about a 5% grade for about 5 miles and it was no sweat. I rarely have to take it out of OD. One of my friends tows his 34 with a 99 F350 CCLB SRW and he has no problems either. Only other difference is the 4x4 and I have 4x2. At 65-70 mph I get about 13/14 mpg.

Thanks for the comparison. I also thought the Ford towed very nice, the DRWs make it rock solid. I looked for an SRW truck but just could not find one spec'd the way I wanted with low miles (2001 - 2002, 4x4, loaded, manual, long bed, 7.3). I am sure if I spent another 6mo something would turn up but this one was close enough and I am very happy with it so far to the point that my wife is sick of hearing me yap about it.

[elolson]

Originally Posted by Big C

Our TV is a 2001 F350 single axle with an EAZ-Lift hitch, 1000 lb bars. Anit-sway control is always used after that first time a semi passed me doing 75-80. Sure came in handy while up and back to Canada in Wyoming on I25 with those crosswinds.

Thanks BigC, that tells me I am close to your setup and you have had a very positive experience so far.

[excellaf350]

dually, 4x4 and lift kit will make it ride more like a truck for sure but it will handle the trailer with ease. The 7.3L definately doesnt have the power that some of the newer motors out there have.... but it is plenty capable of hauling around that 34. My truck has 3.73's and stock size tires cruising at 75 I am just a tad over 2000 rpm with the 4R100 auto trans. sweet spot seems to be right in that 1800 to 2200 rpm range you hit a hill and the boost comes up to about 11/12 psi and it just doesnt slow down. I have had to downshift on hills because of slower traffic. Ocasionally I have been stuck behind slower trafic say 55 mph hitting a hill and at that point its easier to just hit the OD button and leave it in 3rd till I get up to speed again. 55 in 4th gear lugs the motor down to 1500 rpm and lower so it doesnt have much "umph" there. As for reliability? Well thats why I bought this truck. I was lucky and found an 03 with only 35k miles on it. The truck could literially last me forever with the miles I put on it. The 7.3L had its share of problems but in a personal vehicle if you use good oil and change it frequently it will almost never have a breakdown. I love my 7.3l the truck doesnt have all the bells and whistles as some of the new stuff out there does but it tows great. Being 4x2 it rides smooth. I make sure I leave a little extra weight in the bed and I dont crank down the spring bars too much. More weight on the rear springs helps it ride smoother imo.

the Ford 6.0L has a ton of extra HP but I wouldnt touch one with a 10 foot pole. I actually have one in my 04 F450 (work truck) its in the shop all the time... rediculiously high maintenance bills and I change the oil on it religiously ay 5k miles. I can't believe my work is still keeping it. Every breakdown is a tow in and an average $2500+ repair. I have had 6 of them in the past year the truck has 200k on it.

the cummins and duramax are both plenty capable of haulin as well but price becomes a factor too.... I wont get into the diesel debate. I am a GM guy at heart but couldnt find a duramax with under 100k miles for less than $32k...

[excellaf350]

Oh forgot to mention 1 other thing you will see is that the 4x4 f350 has front and rear leaf springs so it will have a rougher ride... my 4x2 has coil fronts with a twin I beam system so it rides like a caddy . However I did put on 2" leveling blocks and an alignment to ge tht efront ride height to make it look like a truck while riding like a car.

[slowmover]

See if KONI has their new FSD shock absorber spec'd for your model truck (even with the lift; make measurements). It was designed for leaf-sprung solid axle vehicles such as Class C motorhomes. Not cheap at $170/ea, but there is nothing better than KONI out there. The reports are encouraging.

Also, as to ride comfort try to differentiate between "vibration" and "jarring" in attempting any changes. A gel type seat cushion, for example, is great at reducing felt vibration to the driver, and better (more sophisticated) shock absorbers are better at the jounces/jarring. Don't forget noise abatement as a rougher riding truck can be perceived as a better ride than a softer riding one just because the former has a more quiet cab. New weatherstripping on drivers door (given age & use) could make a difference, not just underhood (oilpan).

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[elolson]

Thanks excellaf350 for sharing the tips on bed weight. I have it set up so that the weight pushes the frame contacts to just touching the first set of overload springs. The ride was tolerable I have probably made too big a deal out of it. It is just not as soft as the 3/4 ton but is completely what I expected for such a truck.
" My truck has 3.73's and stock size tires cruising at 75 I am just a tad over 2000 rpm with the 4R100 auto trans. " That is exactly what I needed to know. A very good data point if I ever change the gears.



Rednax, thanks for the tip on the shocks. I need to see what is on it now. They seem like they are pretty fancy but I have not looked that closely.

The steering does seem like the deadzone is a bit more than I would expect. I am going to have the mechanic check the ball joints and tie rods for wear.