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Old 08-31-2012, 10:19 PM   #29
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We agree with hhendrix. The F250 did a great job. At Alumapalooza we were told that if you used breaks to control speed going down hill, you were not in the correct gear. The F250 tow mode allowed us to relax as the computer did its job.
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Old 09-04-2012, 03:50 PM   #30
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250 vs 150

I have had 12 Ford trucks, the last 3 being diesel, to me it's hands down better than the 150 in performance, now I have no experience with the new ecoboost but I think it would be hard to beat the 250 SD. We had a 5th wheel that weighed 5.5 tons and I still got 18 mpg with the SD.
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Old 09-04-2012, 05:29 PM   #31
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Can't comment on the F150, but I have a 2002 F250 SD that I used to pull a 37 ft 5th wheel until this year when I traded for the AS. The 250 did a fine job even in the Rockies. Pulling the AS is a big difference. Now we have a much smoother ride and less shifting on the hills. Truck stays in over drive most of the time. I'm sure the F150 can do the job, but suspect it'll be working a lot harder. I like having some reserve power in the truck. I plan to trade for another similar diesel in the future.

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Old 09-04-2012, 06:36 PM   #32
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Towing or Not?

What is under the hood/cab of over the road trucks? (Kenworth, Peterbilt, Mack, Volvo, Freightliner, etc.) A gasser or a diesel?

I bought a Dodge Ram with a Cummins turbodiesel. I pull a 10,000lb 36' long Avion 34X (Avion measures the box for their length....bumper to ball is longer) and have never hit a hill I could not accelerate up...including the Great Smokey Mountains.

I've always had gassers. But after getting the Cummins, I will never look back. The big straight six has perfect primary and secondary balance and is smoother than a V8 (like the 447 in my Charger).

I can get 21mpg running empty. I get between 12.5 (at 75mph plus on 95) and 15mpg towing the Avion at 60mph across the flat lands.

I like diesels. I wish I'd gotten one sooner.

But to each their own. Slam the door on a new F-150 and watch the panels jiggle. Where I work we have 150's as a company car (I actually have an Escape). Ford lightened them up alright....the sheet metal is about like mylar. A deer ran into the back of my buddy's 2011 150 and destroyed the rear quarter panel. He was parked. The deer ran into him!

Diesels in general run about 30% more efficient than a gasser, all else being equal. A Brit car mag did a test of a BMW 5 series against a Prius. They drove them 700 miles from A in France to B in Germany. They biased the test toward the Prius hybrid by going through as many towns as they could. The Prius driver had the a/c off and the radio off, trying to conserve as many electrons as possible. The Bimmer driver had the a/c and the radio on. When it was all said and done, the diesel Bimmer got 4mpg better than the Toyota. Diesels work.

If you don't have a big trailer, then the EcoBoost would be fine. If you're pulling a big one....I'd go with the weasel.

Cheers,
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Old 09-04-2012, 07:17 PM   #33
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Except that diesels past 2008 are now laden with emissions requirements that affect both fuel mileage and longevity versus the ones we have. The initial expense, the operating expense and the likely somewhat shorter life means that gassers (which have seen significant improvements) have closed most of the gap.

It's a money loser if it were a business -- done this way -- as spec'ng a TV for .05% of miles traveled makes no sense at all. 10-mph slower up the mountains just means that the TV chosen can do the job (all jobs, not just an otherwise insignificant one), and do it at lower all-inclusive costs.

I'd like for mine to make the 15+ year mark (2018), and hope that by then an acceptable choice can be made that combines the longevity, reliability & low operating costs that this has had.

.
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Old 09-13-2012, 06:45 PM   #34
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Rednax, you are right on. I pulled a 40' Carriage monster with both my '97 F-250 7.3 and my 2002 F-350 7.3 and I never had an issue on the pulling power of a diesel. Frog leap to 2012 and between the "sootbag" or the urea tank, plus upwards of $250 for oil and fuel filter changes, not to mention the .50-75 cents difference in fuel/gas, a gas rig will do the job of towing (especially any AS) and get you to 100k + with little more than oil changes and maybe a spark plug change. Most guys buy a diesel rig because they WANT one, and that's ok too, those car companies need you.

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Old 09-13-2012, 07:21 PM   #35
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Well, maybe

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Originally Posted by pappy19 View Post
... a gas rig will do the job of towing (especially any AS) and get you to 100k + with little more than oil changes and maybe a spark plug change. Pap
Maybe. But one of my diesels is fast closing on 250k miles with nothing more than oil changes, tires and wiper blades. Oh, yeah, two headlight bulbs. I know two guys with over 500k on theirs, but mine is for sure a limited sample.

I will say that a 3/4 ton diesel of any brand is a real truck ... you'll never mistake it for a passenger car, that's for sure.
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Old 09-14-2012, 11:56 AM   #36
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There are many examples of HD gas rigs making it to 250-300k with nothing done but oil and spark plug changes including the 5.4, 6.8 (V-10) and the Chevy 350. You don't see many diesel pickups going over 100k very far and needing new injectors, glow plugs, fuel pumps, etc. Plus, if a diesel ever gets into bad fuel, it's a disaster, while water in gasoline make make the engine sputter some, but that's about it. Again, if a person wants a diesel, then go buy one, but most folks don't need a diesel to tow an RV unless it's a big 5th wheel.

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Old 09-14-2012, 12:33 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pappy19 View Post
Rednax, you are right on. I pulled a 40' Carriage monster with both my '97 F-250 7.3 and my 2002 F-350 7.3 and I never had an issue on the pulling power of a diesel. Frog leap to 2012 and between the "sootbag" or the urea tank, plus upwards of $250 for oil and fuel filter changes, not to mention the .50-75 cents difference in fuel/gas, a gas rig will do the job of towing (especially any AS) and get you to 100k + with little more than oil changes and maybe a spark plug change. Most guys buy a diesel rig because they WANT one, and that's ok too, those car companies need you.

Pap

Just curious, where are you seeing .50 to .75/per gallon difference? The national average between regular and diesel is .27 as of earilier this month? We are paying about .25/gal. now, was about .18 most of the summer but difference always goes up here in the fall.
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Old 09-14-2012, 12:44 PM   #38
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Quote:
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Just curious, where are you seeing .50 to .75/per gallon difference? The national average between regular and diesel is .27 as of earilier this month? We are paying about .25/gal. now, was about .18 most of the summer but difference always goes up here in the fall.
35 cents or so is a pretty common delta between regular and diesel around DFW. I don't think I've ever seen 75 cents, but I've seen the split over 40 cents.
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Old 09-14-2012, 01:08 PM   #39
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Here in Canada diesel is $0.40 a gallon less than gasoline. It sure helps to justify the diesel.
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Old 09-14-2012, 02:08 PM   #40
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Regular $3.74

Diesel $3.94

Bargains
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Old 09-14-2012, 04:24 PM   #41
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Costco gas $3.59
Diesel @ gas stations $3.99

San Antonio area
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Old 09-15-2012, 08:09 AM   #42
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Im not gonna start start an argument or be involved with one, but im gonan put this to rest as best I can. All statements are being made about NEW vehicles.

If you want good mpgs while towing, both gas and diesels get nearly the same towing. If you want the ground pounding torque to merge into traffic effectively, its hard to beat the 700 ft lbs that Super Duty is cranking out, even though the EcoBoost is making 420, the best in its class. Gas trucks offer nothing in terms of exhaust/engine braking, but the diesels do. A simple intake, exhaust, and chip will put the diesel at over 20 mpg and give you more than enough power to hook onto a mobile home and use it as a camper (not really... dont do that). Same can be said with the gasser although gains are far less. With a diesel, remove all the smog bull spit and gains go through the roof again. By this point youve got a couple grand more dumped into an already $45,000+ truck, where a gasser F-150 starts at about $30,000 for an XLT 4wd. The diesel should get a couple mpg more than the gasser, but if they get the same then theres the gas vs diesel cost comparison. Diesel RARELY costs the same as gas here in the states. Its usually $.30 more, but can be anywhere from cheaper than gas, to $.50 more. Right now in my town gas is $3.85 and diesel is $3.98 or $3.99. I dont remember. Then maintenance... If you change both gas and diesel oils at 5000 miles, the gasser is far cheaper. Gas uses about 1.5 gallon, diesels chug 3 gallons using a more expensive oil.

So there ya go: diesels cost more in the long run BUT give you power to burn and have a ton of potential if you wanna pay for it. Not to mention they run FOREVER.

Gassers are less expensive, offer similar mpgs towing, better unhitched, and costs of ownership is less.
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