Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 11-15-2014, 04:34 PM   #29
Slowpoke
 
Gnorts's Avatar
 
2012 27' Flying Cloud
Portland , Oregon
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 255
Quote:
Originally Posted by Siegmann View Post
Setting aside the tow ratings, but with regards to my original question, how can the F-150/Ecoboost get such a larger GCWR than the Ram/Hemi (with similar rear axles), while having less HP (but slightly more torque).... is that Ram has gone to the J2807 standard and Ford has not?
When towing a load uphill, it's torque that matters, not HP. Thanks to the marketing guys, we all buy HP, but in the real world we drive torque.
__________________

__________________
Like the tortoise, travelin' slow with the house on our back
2012 FC27FB "Ted Zeppelin"
2010 Tundra Crewmax Platinum "Silver Rhino"
Gnorts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-15-2014, 06:05 PM   #30
jcl
Rivet Master
 
Currently Looking...
Vancouver , British Columbia
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,049
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gnorts View Post
When towing a load uphill, it's torque that matters, not HP. Thanks to the marketing guys, we all buy HP, but in the real world we drive torque.
Yes, but it is wheel torque, not flywheel torque. Fortunately we have gearing to relate the two. Flywheel torque only matters to hill climbing if you have no control over gearing.
__________________

__________________
jcl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-15-2014, 06:10 PM   #31
Rivet Master
 
SteveH's Avatar
 
2005 39' Land Yacht 390 XL 396
Common Sense , Texas
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 5,311
What makes the Ford 3.5L Ecoboost engine pull so well for it's size is it get's it's torque at a lower RPM than the normally aspirated engines, and then it's a very flat torque curve right up close to max horsepower point.

http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2011/04...8-engines.html

Again, so why doesn't Ford put it in a F250?
__________________
Regards,
Steve
SteveH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-15-2014, 07:32 PM   #32
Rivet Master
 
tjdonahoe's Avatar
 
2013 31' Classic
billings , Montana
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,844
Talking

It is the same old story, it takes iron to move iron, it is a lot easier to pull that airstream with a 3/4 diesel than a souped up gas v6.....
__________________
tjdonahoe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-15-2014, 08:17 PM   #33
Full Time Adventurer
 
BoldAdventure's Avatar
 
2007 27' International CCD FB
Nomadic , USA
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 2,743
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveH View Post
Again, so why doesn't Ford put it in a F250?
because they have a turbo diesel already ??
__________________
Family of 4 living, working & exploring the USA in our Airstream.
OUR BLOG | FACEBOOK | INSTAGRAM
BoldAdventure is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-15-2014, 08:36 PM   #34
Rivet Master
 
SteveH's Avatar
 
2005 39' Land Yacht 390 XL 396
Common Sense , Texas
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 5,311
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoldAdventure View Post
because they have a turbo diesel already ??
No way they compare. The Ecoboost would deliver good gas mileage in a truck that would have a really good payload.
__________________
Regards,
Steve
SteveH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2014, 08:51 AM   #35
3 Rivet Member
 
2015 27' Flying Cloud
Washington , Washington, D.C.
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 218
In most cases the half tons with the advertised high towing and or cargo capacity are regular cab 2wd trucks. In the case of the Ram 1500, the limiting factor is cargo capacity not towing. For the typical A/S of upper 20s length, the truck is fully loaded with just the tongue weight and a few passengers. I suspect the weak link is either suspension, rear axle capacity or tire capacity.
Regarding the ecoboost, most tests show that it uses more fuel "on boost" than a larger displacement normally aspirated engine of equal or greater horsepower. So it would not be a good candidate for replacing the 6.2 liter gas engine currently supplied with the F-250, which IIRC weighs over 1000 lbs. more than the F-150 of similar configuration.
That said, the F150 ecoboost seems like an attractive tow vehicle for the larger Airstreams. At least the previous model was available in a high cargo capacity version able to carry about a ton in a 4wd crew cab version. For a truck that is versatile enough to be comfortably used as a DD as well as a tow vehicle (unlike a 3/4 ton diesel which is not a good grocery getter) that's the one, albeit at perhaps a 10 percent mileage penalty when towing compared to other gas 1/2 tons. The new interior is better but in my opinion not up to the standard set by Ram and GM.
__________________
DC Bruce is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2014, 11:46 AM   #36
Rivet Master
 
tjdonahoe's Avatar
 
2013 31' Classic
billings , Montana
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,844
Like I said before, if the trailer is much heavier than the tv, then the tail will wag the dog, and that is not a good experience, but one to remember, whether it is caused from a wind gust or ruts in a 2 lane road.
__________________
tjdonahoe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2014, 01:02 PM   #37
Rivet Master
 
crispyboy's Avatar
 
1994 30' Excella
alexandria , Kentucky
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 1,656
Images: 3
Is the J2807 towing test subjective to the driver?
I don't know specifically how the test is performed but for everything to be equal between the tested vehicles does the driver hold his foot to the floor the entire length of the test?
There is a difference between a "driver" and a "steering wheel holder". A "driver" knows the feel of a vehicle and can anticipate how hard to push it - which will effect ground speed, engine temperature, brake fade etc.......

From a marketing aspect I don't think the 3.5 Eco motor would sell too well in a f250. It's been a long time since Ford put the 300 straight 6 engine in the F250 and would have to reeducate the buying public that a 6 cylinder would do the job. It could happen but I think the target market for the 3.5 and F150 are weekend warrior campers and those who occasionally tow a utility trailer.
__________________
Steve, Christy, Anna and Scout (Border Collie deceased 11-30-2016)
1994 Classic 30'11" Excella - rear twin
2009 Dodge 2500, 6 Speed Auto, CTD, Quad Cab, Short Bed
Hensley with adjustable stinger
WBCCI # 3072
crispyboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2014, 02:02 PM   #38
TinCan
 
graysailor's Avatar

 
2016 30' Classic
Apache Junction , Arizona
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 798
True that one has to order carefully. If you want payload and tow then you have to order accordingly. You really have to press the salesperson to do their homework.
__________________
TinCan
graysailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-21-2014, 06:17 PM   #39
Rivet Master
 
tjdonahoe's Avatar
 
2013 31' Classic
billings , Montana
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,844
20 years ago an aquaintance had a 300 6 in his f150 , he was always telling me how much torque it had, I always said yea, right. He hooked up his 28' fifth wheel here in Billings,mt at daylight to go to Butte,mt 225 miles west, It was after dark when he arrived, we never heard about all the torque his 300 6 had again...I still have to laugh...
__________________
tjdonahoe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-22-2014, 09:40 AM   #40
Rivet Master
 
carl2591's Avatar
 
2005 31' Classic
Garner, , North Carolina
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 775
Quote:
Originally Posted by crispyboy View Post
Is the J2807 towing test subjective to the driver?
I don't know specifically how the test is performed but for everything to be equal between the tested vehicles does the driver hold his foot to the floor the entire length of the test?
There is a difference between a "driver" and a "steering wheel holder". A "driver" knows the feel of a vehicle and can anticipate how hard to push it - which will effect ground speed, engine temperature, brake fade etc.......

From a marketing aspect I don't think the 3.5 Eco motor would sell too well in a f250. It's been a long time since Ford put the 300 straight 6 engine in the F250 and would have to reeducate the buying public that a 6 cylinder would do the job. It could happen but I think the target market for the 3.5 and F150 are weekend warrior campers and those who occasionally tow a utility trailer.
I had a 1992 e-250 van with the straight 6-300 engine set up for carpet cleaning business.. The Truck-mount we used weighted some 600 lbs along with all the hoses, bottles of cleaning agents, tools etc. Plus while we did not carry fresh water on-board we did have a 125 gal. waste water tank that we tried to keep drained but some time that was not possible.

The van with empty tanks weighted appx. 7000 lbs more or less. Gross was 8200 on the van.

The 6 cylinder, while not a speed queen, had no problem holding speed up and down hills around the Raleigh NC area some time with a full tank of waste water sloshing around as well.. The MPG was hard to determine as the truck mount also used fuel from the trucks tank. It was not bad on gas and this was during the time of $4.00 a gallon gas after the Katrina Hurricane mess.

I would buy a f-250 SD with a 3.5 eco boost 6 cylinder any day of the week. What would be better could be a 3.0 liter diesel with twin turbo like the sprinter van from MB.. I know a couple of guys that have them, one a HVAC and the other a carpet cleaning guy.. They both report MPG around town in the 19+ range and both are heavy loaded all the time with equipment and parts.

my BIL has a 2012 6.7L diesel Ford with a bed cover and only get 18-19 on the road with that dude.. that is not towing anything.
__________________
Carl, Raleigh NC
2-24-16 got a 2005 Classic 31D
Timeshare owner/user since '99
TUG2.net check it out for good rental deals
2003 F-250 SD, CC, 7.3L PowerStroke
WBCCI#1691, Piedmont Unit #161, Region #3
carl2591 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2014, 11:02 AM   #41
Rivet Master
 
pappy19's Avatar
 
2002 30' Classic S/O
Garden Valley , Idaho
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,418
Here are the latest figures for mpg by each engine for the 2015 F-150.

2015 Ford F-150 Fuel Economy Released » AutoGuide.com News
__________________
2008 F-250 4X4 Lariat V-10
2002 Airstream Classic 30' w/SO #2074
2007 Kubota 900 RTV
1996 Ford Bronco
2007 Lincoln LT
pappy19 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-19-2014, 08:50 PM   #42
Rivet Master
 
tjdonahoe's Avatar
 
2013 31' Classic
billings , Montana
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,844
Why would any want to pull their trailer down the road running their engine at 4500 rpm? My ram cruises, like my big truck with a 500hp cat, at 1500 rpm. No ford in the future for me...
__________________

__________________
tjdonahoe is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Serial Numbers on a '64-what they mean ts8501 1964 Safari 1 10-26-2008 09:19 AM
Towing numbers...not always what they seem Wayward Tow Vehicles 16 08-07-2008 09:27 AM
I need numbers, Part numbers that is. thenewkid64 Airstream Motorhome Forums 1 07-19-2003 11:51 AM
What do they call these?Awning?Glass Guard? Chitown AirStreamers Rock Guards, Segment & Window Protectors 5 05-16-2003 10:20 AM
They don't make them like they used to femuse Our Community 23 04-29-2003 08:15 AM


Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:03 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.