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Old 09-06-2012, 03:56 PM   #57
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"While according to Ford a properly equipped EcoBoost can tow 11,300 pounds, the max payload is only 1,718 pounds. Now, maybe I'm wrong, but this figure includes only the weight of the truck and driver, no gas, no passengers, and no "stuff."

Hi Rion,

It is my understanding that max payload is the maximum weight you can have in the tow vehicle including fuel.

Another way to look at max payload is to take the curb weight of the vehicle and add the max payload and these two combined figures will give you the GVWR of the tow vehicle. The same is true for the Airstream trailers (subtract unit base weight from GVWR to get the max allowable weight/cargo you can carry).

Just my 2 cents :-)
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Old 09-06-2012, 04:54 PM   #58
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Hi Rion,

One more thing I forgot to mention above is don't forget your hitch weight. Some of the hitches out there (Hensley and ProPride 3P) weigh 200 pounds! So, when you're calculating the weights in your tow vehicle (fuel, passengers, stuff) make sure to add the hitch weight as well to ensure you don't go over the recommended GVWR.

Just my 2 cents :-)
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Old 09-06-2012, 04:54 PM   #59
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2012 Ford F250 MPG

4 weeks ago i bought a new 2012 F250 6.7L Supercab, shortbed. I'm getting ~17MPG mixed driving (not towing). I'm not going by the computer, I'm checking the numbers manually. I have ~1400 miles on the truck. I'm very pleased with it.
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Old 09-06-2012, 08:26 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by sierrafun View Post
"While according to Ford a properly equipped EcoBoost can tow 11,300 pounds, the max payload is only 1,718 pounds. Now, maybe I'm wrong, but this figure includes only the weight of the truck and driver, no gas, no passengers, and no "stuff."

Hi Rion,

It is my understanding that max payload is the maximum weight you can have in the tow vehicle including fuel.

Another way to look at max payload is to take the curb weight of the vehicle and add the max payload and these two combined figures will give you the GVWR of the tow vehicle. The same is true for the Airstream trailers (subtract unit base weight from GVWR to get the max allowable weight/cargo you can carry).

Just my 2 cents :-)
Hi,

Thanks for pointing out my mistake. What I meant to say before my brain was sidelined by the heat today, was that it is my understanding that the curb weight includes only the base truck weight and driver, without fuel, passengers, or cargo. Thus my concern that when adding fuel, three extra people, and cargo there is precious little room left over for the weight that the AS will apply hitched to the back of the truck. Thank you though for pointing out about the weight of the hitch itself, I hadn't remembered to include that as a separate item, but had rather included it in the total weight being applied to the receiver of the truck.

Cheers,
Rion
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Old 09-06-2012, 08:50 PM   #61
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Hi Everyone,

For those that are interested, here are the window and weights stickers for the 2012 F150 EcoBoost Lariat that I test drove just before the 2012 F250 Diesel. I'm also attaching the window sticker for the F250. Unfortunately, the F250 loading sticker didn't come out well and I prematurely deleted the photos of the RAM and GMC. Which I now wish I hadn't, but that only gives me an excuse to go look at them again. At this point, while I like the Ford products and have been a long time Ford man, I'm beginning to lean towards the GMC / Chevrolet a little bit more. Mostly due to the DuraMax / Allison combo. I don't completely trust Ford on either their Diesel or EcoBoost engines yet and I switched to Ford from Dodge decades ago due to problems with their transmissions and breaks.

On a side note, I hope that someone from Ford is reading this, having to drill out spark plugs at 100K miles or having to replace turbochargers at 50K or having exhaust valves fall apart under normal driving conditions doesn't say good things about Ford trucks. Ford here is your opportunity to wow all of us and prove that Quality really is "Job 1".

Cheers All,
Rion
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Old 09-06-2012, 11:49 PM   #62
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4x2

I sold my previous 2008 GMC Sierra Duramax 4x4 in 2010 as a two year old. My phone was ringing off the hook at 40k from guys in Canada and the Great Lakes. The first thing everyone asked was 'is it a 4x4'? If you tour the dealerships, you will be hard pressed to find a Ford or GM 3/4 ton that has 2 wheel drive. ( I saw a few Ram's with 4x2 and Laramie package). I have never seen one in the high end packages at Ford. You can order a 4x2 equipped the same as a 4x4, but then it becomes a pretty rare animal. I selected a 4x4 then and with my 2012 Denali last month because even if I use the 4x4 rarely, the resale value will exceed the cost. There are large numbers of 1/2 ton trucks sold with 2 wheel drive. But, here in California, very few 3/4 ton trucks don't have 4 wheel drive. An interesting item for those considering a GM 3/4. I checked with several dealers and determined that the Z71 suspension option has the exact same components as the standard 3/4 ton! There are differences in shocks, jounce bumpers and sway bars for the 1/2 ton, but not the 3/4. Those parts all have the same part number! The Z71 gives you skid plates (but those are standard on the Deali) and decals. So, on a Denali, you are paying $200 for decals!
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Old 09-07-2012, 06:50 AM   #63
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I realize I am biased toward Ford. But.....GM bought all three vehicles that participated in the competition. Therefore they chose the location and other specifics of the face off. I think they had to know that the Ford would not perform as well at elevation (when making runs closer to sea level the Ford actually won). The Ford engine braking also performed better at other speeds.

I really don't think it's a coincidence that Chevy wins the events when they are the ones that put the money out there to host it.

Just my opinion.....
Im still waiting for ford to come out with a comparison video..

Chevy Silverado HD2HD | Pickup Truck Comparison | Chevrolet.com
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Old 09-07-2012, 06:51 AM   #64
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Originally Posted by rp709 View Post
I sold my previous 2008 GMC Sierra Duramax 4x4 in 2010 as a two year old. My phone was ringing off the hook at 40k from guys in Canada and the Great Lakes. The first thing everyone asked was 'is it a 4x4'? If you tour the dealerships, you will be hard pressed to find a Ford or GM 3/4 ton that has 2 wheel drive. ( I saw a few Ram's with 4x2 and Laramie package). I have never seen one in the high end packages at Ford. You can order a 4x2 equipped the same as a 4x4, but then it becomes a pretty rare animal. I selected a 4x4 then and with my 2012 Denali last month because even if I use the 4x4 rarely, the resale value will exceed the cost. There are large numbers of 1/2 ton trucks sold with 2 wheel drive. But, here in California, very few 3/4 ton trucks don't have 4 wheel drive. An interesting item for those considering a GM 3/4. I checked with several dealers and determined that the Z71 suspension option has the exact same components as the standard 3/4 ton! There are differences in shocks, jounce bumpers and sway bars for the 1/2 ton, but not the 3/4. Those parts all have the same part number! The Z71 gives you skid plates (but those are standard on the Deali) and decals. So, on a Denali, you are paying $200 for decals!

I don't believe your guy is correct on the Z71 comments....I'll check.
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Old 09-07-2012, 07:10 AM   #65
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Hi Everyone,


On a side note, I hope that someone from Ford is reading this, having to drill out spark plugs at 100K miles or having to replace turbochargers at 50K or having exhaust valves fall apart under normal driving conditions doesn't say good things about Ford trucks. Ford here is your opportunity to wow all of us and prove that Quality really is "Job 1".

Cheers All,
Rion
It appears Ford purposely created the spark-plug problem that would happen just after the warranty expired! Potential $3000 to $4000 spark-plug change on a v-10 for the dealers to cash in on. Its not likely you could find an engineer that would specify 3/8" of threads in an aluminum head for the spark-plugs. My God, a Briggs&Stratton 3hp has more threads than that!!!!!
It make you wonder....
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Old 09-07-2012, 07:33 AM   #66
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Z71 differences

There's a Z71 appearance package available ONLY with the Z71 off roda package. The off road package includes several differences in suspension as well as includes some items which would be free float options if not in the package, like skid plates and locking diff, etc.



Z71® Appearance Package
The Z71® Appearance Package, available with the Off-Road Suspension Package, includes a body-colored front bumper, chrome grille with body-colored surround, 18" forged polished aluminum wheels with LT265/70R18E all-terrain blackwall tires, body-colored outside mirrors and door handles, front fog lamps, unique "Z71" decals and sillplates.
Aluminum wheels can be upgraded to 20" forged polished aluminum wheels1 with LT265/60R20E all-terrain blackwall tires. This package is not available in Regular Cab models or with exterior colors Blue Granite Metallic, Mocha Steel Metallic, Blue Topaz Metallic or Blue Ray Metallic. Mirrors are Black if equipped with the available outside heated power-adjustable vertical camper mirrors.


Z71® Off-Road Suspension Package
For the true off-roader. The Z71® Off-Road Suspension Package gets serious capability from twin tube shock absorbers and a 33 mm front stabilizer bar. Jounce bumpers are designed specifically to handle huge suspension variants so you can hit the deep stuff. The skid plate package includes a frame-mounted shield to help protect the underbody, oil pan, differential case and transfer case. And don’t forget the automatic locking rear differential that sends maximum drive power to the wheel with grip whenever rear-wheel slippage happens. As a finishing touch, Z71 decals are included on both rear quarters.

The package requires trailering equipment and LT265/70R17E, LT265/70R18E or LT265/60R20E all-terrain, blackwall tires; it is not available with pickup box delete.
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Old 09-08-2012, 09:43 PM   #67
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Z71

If you check the part numbers using VIN numbers of vehicles with and without Z71 (HD trucks only!) you will find identical shocks, jounce bumpers and stabilizer bars. Those items are added to the HD trucks as standard and it is called Z85 suspension. The skid plate package is standard on the Denali with or without Z71. The locking differential is also standard on some trim levels with or without Z71. The Z71 appearance package is cosmetic only on some trim levels. Sorry, Z71 does not equal different suspension on the GM HD trucks. You do get decals though!
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Old 09-09-2012, 09:49 AM   #68
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If you check the part numbers using VIN numbers of vehicles with and without Z71 (HD trucks only!) you will find identical shocks, jounce bumpers and stabilizer bars. Those items are added to the HD trucks as standard and it is called Z85 suspension. The skid plate package is standard on the Denali with or without Z71. The locking differential is also standard on some trim levels with or without Z71. The Z71 appearance package is cosmetic only on some trim levels. Sorry, Z71 does not equal different suspension on the GM HD trucks. You do get decals though!
Hooray for decals!

Thank you for the information. I wonder though, I've read elsewhere in these forums about the Z71 package being the cause of greater rivet loss. Maybe that is only on the 1/2 ton trucks?

Cheers
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Old 09-09-2012, 10:11 AM   #69
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Any 3/4 ton rides rough though. Its the nature of the beast lol
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Old 09-09-2012, 11:45 AM   #70
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I pulled with a 2500 HD Z85 last year and a 2500 HD Z71 this year. Z71 is rougher. Just shocks, I believe. Springs are the same. (btw, there are 3 part numbers for front shocks and 2 for rear shocks for a Silverado HD 2500, but I'm too lazy to cross reference production codes with option codes) For towing, I'd recommend the Z85, unless your truck has to do double duty in true off road applications.
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