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Old 10-06-2006, 02:33 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by 2airishuman
hi truck trend watchers...

but the nissan and toyota offerings, when they are built will be every bit as good...just check back in 09.

cheers
2air'
Very nice analysis. Thanks for sharing!
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Old 10-06-2006, 04:19 PM   #16
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Bruno, I currently run LPG fumigation on my Duramax diesel engine. On my last LP fillup, my combination mileage yielded a cost of 93% of what it would have been on diesel alone. But, alas, diesel has dropped in price, so my LP switch is off, and the tank empty until the next refinery fire, hurricane or Mid-East military conflict starts.
Hi pick;
Our LPG is half the price of the diesel and more than with the gazoline. the consumption is the same. When diesel & gasoline prices increase as yours in USA, LPg increase too but not in a lower range. Then, driving with LPG keep the engine oil clear because the burning is cleaner than with the other product and life engine is very longer. Really, it's a great advantage.
Note that LPG is only mounted in Europe, on gasoline engines, not diesel.

Bruno.
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Old 10-10-2006, 12:09 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2airishuman
still most 1/2 buyers or other small truck buyers are shopping car alternatives...the truck as a personal image thing.

weekend towing, some camping, the occasional load from homedepot and LOTS of urban driving. that is why suvs and crucks can fill this need.

the 3/4-1 ton market is much different these are work trucks. contractors, plumbers, electricians and most construction workers from all trades shop 3/4-1 ton.


cheers
2air'
Couldn't agree more. I think the recent surge in fuel costs have knocked a lot of the pretenders (the casual 1/2 ton buyers just mentioned) out of the truck market. Lets face it-a truck is not the best form a transportation for most and many folks just don't "need" a truck. The HD truck segment is different though, as stated these are sold mainly to people who "need" trucks (lets add our kind to the list also=people who "tow"!). But I also think this segment is more stable, we buy trucks because we "need them" not to massage our ego. Having said that I also feel that this is a VERY brand loyal group (just look at some of the Ford vs GM threads!) so I am not so sure the foreign owned auto makers will have an easy time breaking into this market, and they may not want to, as in the future it will be smaller market than recently due to only those folks who "need" trucks, actually buying them. Why chase a shrinking market with a very loyal demographic? An uphill battle for sure...
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Old 10-10-2006, 12:47 PM   #18
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GM, General Madness

Loyalty my bum. I have a GM that went to the dealer 14 times under warranty. Every year I replace front end parts. My wife's Toyota has not gone for a warranty item yet with twice the miles per year. It was almost the same when I had a Tacoma.
I have been shopping for a truck for a while now and am waiting for a Toyota. The GMC seems to have forgotten how to build a truck. My buddy bought the same GM thing a year later and has terrible problems. If I can get the Airstream light enough a Tacoma might do it. But the snow......
It will not be long before Toyota has more Americans working than GM.
R
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Old 10-10-2006, 01:12 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by fastrob
Loyalty my bum. I have a GM that went to the dealer 14 times under warranty. Every year I replace front end parts. My wife's Toyota has not gone for a warranty item yet with twice the miles per year. It was almost the same when I had a Tacoma.
I have been shopping for a truck for a while now and am waiting for a Toyota. The GMC seems to have forgotten how to build a truck. My buddy bought the same GM thing a year later and has terrible problems. If I can get the Airstream light enough a Tacoma might do it. But the snow......
It will not be long before Toyota has more Americans working than GM.
R
fastrob,

Based on your experience, it doesn't sound as though GM has any Americans WORKING, so I wouldn't bet too much against your last sentence. I am not bashing GM, just stating an observation.

John
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Old 10-10-2006, 02:47 PM   #20
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]Yes, I was commenting on the topic of this post. Not trying to start yet ANOTHER brand war, I have a 10 yr old GMC in my driveway right now with 130k on it. Runs as good as the day it left the showroom. Just bought a ¾ ton to replace it (10 yrs is my personal limit for any vehicle. I feel I have justified my investment after so long). My wife had a Z-car in the 90’s, most dependable vehicle we have ever owned; sold that at 10 yrs old with 120k on it. I am on my 5th GM truck and have been very happy with each one. Had one tranny rebuilt at 50k, but the dealer picked up the tab as the truck was a little less than 3 yrs old. Other than that they have all been great, very dependable. Don’t know what I will own next, that is 10 yrs from now, God only knows who or what will be for sale then.

My wife’s sister has a Subaru, less than a yr old. Nothing but problems, she is pursuing a lemon-law refund. A buddy of mine owns a tow service; he’ll tell you he tows just as many Toyotas as he does Fords, etc, etc. BTW, my wife is due for a new car; she said she would like to look at foreign cars too, first time she ever said that. She is free to buy whatever she likes…she wants something that gets good mileage and has AWD.Got to admit the foreign cars tend to be better in these parameters.

My point is; they are all capable of producing a defective vehicle. They are also all capable of making very dependable vehicles. Any thing you can buy today (even a Hyundai!) is capable of 150k miles. You would be hard pressed to find junk on any dealer’s lot. I happen to like GM trucks, have owned quite a few. The point of my post, in reference to the article, is that in general (There are always exceptions as you have demonstrated) the HD truck owners are a loyal bunch. But this is a niche market, and becoming smaller as the cost of fuel rises. It cost million$ to develop new vehicle platforms, I am not so sure the foreign manufacturers would be wise to chase such a niche market. I think 2air had it right when he said the foreign mfrs will wait and see.

We can assume your truck has done some serious tow duty-have you weighed both axles? Perhaps the front end is being overloaded by your WD setup?Something is not right if you have done front end work every year.
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Old 10-10-2006, 03:05 PM   #21
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Good Points

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillTex
.......
We can assume your truck has done some serious tow duty-have you weighed both axles? Perhaps the front end is being overloaded by your WD setup?Something is not right if you have done front end work every year…
Bill,
Went to a front end guy the other day. He said that for some reason the later American Independent Front Suspension (IFS) all have the same problem with the front end. He said the Japanese: Honda, Toyota, Nissan do not have the same issues. That is one frustrating point. The GM is the best truck for the money. I make my Buffalos (nickles) cry I squeeze them so hard.. The rural roads in Maine are like a third world country. The truck just has so many design and manufacturing flaws I want to scream. A poor analogy is the sweetest, most beautiful woman that drinks, does drugs and runs around. She is great fun but in the long term a big problem.
Thanks for your point of view.
Rob
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Old 10-10-2006, 03:56 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by fastrob
Bill,
Went to a front end guy the other day. He said that for some reason the later American Independent Front Suspension (IFS) all have the same problem with the front end.
I must have bought the only 5 GM trucks with good front ends...guess I got lucky!
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Old 10-12-2006, 05:43 PM   #23
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Hi fastrob--I've had 10 Chevy full size window vans, and 11 1/2 ton Suburbans, one with 146K miles, and never had a problem with front ends, engines, transmissions, or differentials. What kind of "Maine-e-ak" roads do you have up there in the north east???--Frank S
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Old 10-13-2006, 08:43 AM   #24
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Worst Kind

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank S
Hi fastrob--I've had 10 Chevy full size window vans, and 11 1/2 ton Suburbans, one with 146K miles, and never had a problem with front ends, engines, transmissions, or differentials. What kind of "Maine-e-ak" roads do you have up there in the north east???--Frank S
Frank,
Granted I should have a 3/4 or 1 ton for farm work. My driveway is 1/4 mile off a dirt road that periodically washes out. Let me say this; the 4.8l v8 is great and the 4 door extended cab holds the family. Although, the children would rather ride in the wife's Corolla because there is more leg room in her car.
GM used to have drum brakes in the rear then they went to discs, new (06) trucks have drums in the rear. I have used up 2 sets of rear disc pads and the front are still good. Who puts discs in the rear to get dirty and wear out?
It would be great to be a gentleman Airstreamer that did not have to move 6' snow banks, haul stuff or deliver firewood, but that is not us, not yet anyway.
The 4 wheeler magazines say the Independent Front Suspensions (IFS) with 4 wheel drive are junk and I agree. The old solid axle front suspension does not ride as well but is tougher. The manufacturers now make trucks that ride like a car. The Japanese either by design, materials or both are making a product that the American manufacturers used to make, a small, affordable work truck.
The domestic industry seems to have lost the experience, ingenuity or manufacturing expertise to build a quality product. Americans will suffer for it.
I would love to have a Chevy Colorado (tows 4,000) but if you read up on them the unit has a bad repair history. Toyota Tacoma, same size engine will haul 6,000 lbs and does not have a bad repair history. That is one reason Toyota is kicking butt in the US. Toyota cannot hang a big snow plow off them, yet. Soon they will.
Will GM or Ford or Dodge make a small, cheap, tough work truck like they used to make? Or are they going to continue to lose market share and jobs to someone who will?
R
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Old 10-13-2006, 09:08 AM   #25
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I think it's great that Toyota and Nissan are even considering getting into the truck markets. I strongly feel that the iron horses coming off the domestic lines are far better than they were say even 5 years ago. It's the Toyotas and Nissans that are to thank for that. Take a look at the new Suburbans, Tahoes, Avalanches, Silverados and Ford F series. The interiors are no longer plastic and cheap looking. The mechanicals have been improved upon and the fit and finish is second to none.....all a result of competition.

I say let Toyota and Nissan bring it on whenever they can. It would be about time. Their current offerings are lacking and more of a glorified 1/2 ton with 3/4 specs on paper only.

Now that Ford is in the #3 spot, makes me wonder if we'll ever see Ford and GM merge.
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Old 10-13-2006, 10:49 AM   #26
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Hi fastrob--Lost the emergency/parking brake on my 2001 Suburban with disc brakes. Dealer service mgr, who I've known for many years, explained that it is now referred to only as a parking brake. It is a small pad, that as I understand it presses against the rotor, which will hold for parking, but not for an emergency stop. One short drive away by my grandaughter with the brake on, completely distroyed the pad. $200 for dealer repair. I agree with you rear drums are better.

As far as a good, inexpensive, tough, work truck is concerned the big three still make them, but you hardly ever see them. They are "Plain Jane" 1/2 ton, with the smallest engine, smallest bed, and a standard transmission, which I believe is a better value than any of the "toy trucks". You can also get a "Plain Jane" 3/4 ton for a little more money to hang your snow plow on.

The Toyotas and Nissans get a lot of great press, but real life performance is better described by real users. Go to any of their forums, and you will see they are having problems with their trucks too.--Frank S
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Old 10-13-2006, 10:51 AM   #27
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Hi Silvertwinkie--I don't think Ford and GM will ever merge, but Ford could merge with an off shore auto co. There is no advantage to GM to merge with anyone, as they are big enough, and spread out in foreign markets enough to stand alone. What GM needs to do is refocus on making good vehicles people want, which they strayed away from. They are on the right track, and if they can make and implement half as many good decisions, as they made bad decisions in the bast 30 years, they will be OK.

Missed your sage comments over the past few months. Hope you were OK.--Frank S
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Old 10-13-2006, 12:26 PM   #28
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I have been buying GM pickup trucks since High School in 1973. I can honestly say, I have had excellent service out of all of mine. My current 2003 has only been to the dealer for recalls on the tailgate straps and fuel filter. My 2000 and 1998 pickups never saw the dealer after leaving the sales lot. Just front disk brake service at normal intervals. I did have a warranty claim on my 1990 truck, a blown head gasket on the 305 V-8. Other than that, my GM trucks have been a real pleasure to own and drive.
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