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Old 11-07-2007, 09:34 AM   #1
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CanamRV...Attention Weight Police!

Welcome to Can-Am RV Centre:

Above link is to CanamRV in Ontario. They have a "different" view of TVs and towing than most here. Take a peek at their examples of 30"+ ASs w/cadillac sts, Mercedes, Chrysler 300, Jaguar, Ford Freestar, etc.

Others no doubt have reviewed their logic with them????

Maybe my 2004 Land Cruiser could be "equiped" to hadle a 30' AS?...ya I know it is short wheelbase!

Any thoughts?...btw...not sure I got the link to work as a "click"...may need to copy to browser search line...Tom R

P.S. Got this site referance from another poster...TMR
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Old 11-07-2007, 10:06 AM   #2
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Lets see them road test those rigs in the rockies.
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Old 11-07-2007, 10:13 AM   #3
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Out of curiosity I called Canam and spoke with a rep. They are well aware that some do not agree with their TV recommendations and set-ups.

As an example I asked about my 2004 Land Cruiser. They said it owuld be fine...but they would suggest a Hensley hitch, strengthening of the truck's hitch, lower profile tires (the LC has fairly large tires with big sidewalls which they say are an issue), maybe a tranmission cooler...and be good to go.

I asked about stopping...they said with the 6 disc brakes on the 34' there is plenty of stopping power. They did say it would not win any races...but would be just fine.

Don't yell at me...just being a reporter. Tom R
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Old 11-07-2007, 10:26 AM   #4
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are these guys nuts?
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Old 11-07-2007, 10:30 AM   #5
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In One Word......

Quote:
Originally Posted by thecatsandi
are these guys nuts?
YES !!
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Old 11-07-2007, 10:47 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thecatsandi
are these guys nuts?
Seems so...but did you go and look at their web site?

Not only are they a VERY large AS dealer (check out their inventory!), they actually show some of their towing set-ups on their web site...and have a number of combos that you can demo.

I guess we can easily say they are "nuts"...or maybe there is a "grain" of truth to what they are saying???

A curious Tom R
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Old 11-07-2007, 10:52 AM   #7
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Tom -- I don't have the figures for a 2004 (refer to your manual) but the website for the 2008 Land Cruiser says the difference between GVWR & curb weight is 1585#. This difference is the TV's payload or load capacity. You were posting yesterday about 34 footers and slideouts. Let's say charitably that you're looking at a minimum ready-to-camp tongue weight of over 1000#. That leaves 500 pounds or so for anything and everyone who'll go into the tow vehicle. One driver & one adult passenger will about leave a leftover allowance for one child or a large dog. And the 8500# tow capacity? Give it a 15-20% cushion to allow best TV durability & emergency maneuver/braking capacity. The Land Cruiser realistically tops out at a 25' or 27' Airstream.

Save the Land Cruiser for the Mall of America and get a Chrysler Intrepid to pull the Airstream. I'm not being sarcastic -- I don't know if they still link to that but Can-Am used to feature that tow combination on their website. This thread too. This topic is nothing new under the AIR Forum sun.

I give you back to thecatsandi's question & SilverHobby's answer!
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Old 11-07-2007, 11:07 AM   #8
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my 9,000 lb trailer tossed my 8,000 lb truck around like a toy. Your chances of having a mis-hap are much much higher than with a larger TV. Yeah it will work but your safety margin is low.
have a look at my website under 2006 to see what can happen.
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Old 11-07-2007, 11:12 AM   #9
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I looked back at the Toyota website. I don't get much of a view of the hitch area except on the 360 View & Colors link. It doesn't look like it has a Class III hitch standard. All options added to a TV subtract from the payload capacity. If my assumption is correct there truly isn't 1585 pounds of payload available.

Can-Am can't change the manufacturer's specs. An insurance company won't know about a set-up until they're scratching their heads after an accident. Nodoby has ever complained about too much tow vehicle. There's safety in numbers.
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Old 11-07-2007, 11:13 AM   #10
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OK...let's try this...in the "spirit" of intellectual curiosity.

Take my 2004 Toyota Land Cruiser w/ the following modifications...

1) 20" wheels which is done to reduce the sidewall height by 2"+...still appears to be plenty of carry capacity...with less issue of sidewall deflection.

2) Either replace or significantly increase the strength of the LC hitch...seems like a knowledgeable hitch vendor could certainly install/weld a stronger hitch that also distibutes weight across the frame.

3) Hensley hitch...all the advantages available.

4) Increase transmission cooling.

5) Only buy AS w/disc brakes...or have added.

6) "Best" brake controller...whatever that may be.

Any other modifications?

Remeber, this is a discussion of "possibilities"...and please reflect on the fact that this IS a large and I believe reputable (and experienced) AS dealer...not just a foolish newbie (like me!).

Maybe something like this MIGHT makes transitional sense as a newbie decides if AS RV'ing is a long-term interest...and then purchase a stronger TV...(for the mountains!)?

Just for your (thoughtful) thoughts ...Tom R
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Old 11-07-2007, 11:19 AM   #11
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Can-Am is my dealer. They sold me my new-to-me Airstream and set up my Yukon for towing with my former SOB. They are well known in the industry as towing experts. Yes, some of their setups are contraversial, but be careful about making knee-jerk assumptions here - the owner and President of Can-Am, Andy Thomson, probably has more experience and knows more about towing than anyone on this forum. You will never appreciate his depth of knowledge and understanding of the engineering/physics of towing until you have a personal one-on-one session with him. Been there, done that.

And that's all I have to say about that.
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Old 11-07-2007, 11:27 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Garfield
Can-Am is my dealer. They sold me my new-to-me Airstream and set up my Yukon for towing with my former SOB. They are well known in the industry as towing experts. Yes, some of their setups are contraversial, but be careful about making knee-jerk assumptions here - the owner and President of Can-Am, Andy Thomson, probably has more experience and knows more about towing than anyone on this forum. You will never appreciate his depth of knowledge and understanding of the engineering/physics of towing until you have a personal one-on-one session with him. Been there, done that.

And that's all I have to say about that.
Thanks Garfield ...my point exactly.

Remember, I am not saying this is the BEST choice...only questioning wether "the Forum" is just a bit conservative?

BTW...would LT tires be "better" for improving the "set-up" on my LC?...as opposed to the 20" lower profile? Do LT rated tires have stiffer sidewalls?

Yas, Canoe...I would lean toward the longer AS's. Tom R

P.S. FYI...I nearly always buy more than I "need"...be it power or GVWR...but am curious about the short-term (say one year) tradeoffs and risks of the LC...with full modifications...and maybe limit the year to more "local"...ie...Minnesota/Wisconsin type travel...vs...freeways and mountains!...TMR
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Old 11-07-2007, 11:30 AM   #13
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say tom, let's go there and take a few for test rides ;-)

Quote:
Originally Posted by TomR
Seems so...but did you go and look at their web site?

Not only are they a VERY large AS dealer (check out their inventory!), they actually show some of their towing set-ups on their web site...and have a number of combos that you can demo.

I guess we can easily say they are "nuts"...or maybe there is a "grain" of truth to what they are saying???

A curious Tom R
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Old 11-07-2007, 12:52 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomR
Thanks Garfield ...my point exactly.

Remember, I am not saying this is the BEST choice...only questioning wether "the Forum" is just a bit conservative?

BTW...would LT tires be "better" for improving the "set-up" on my LC?...as opposed to the 20" lower profile? Do LT rated tires have stiffer sidewalls?

Yas, Canoe...I would lean toward the longer AS's. Tom R

P.S. FYI...I nearly always buy more than I "need"...be it power or GVWR...but am curious about the short-term (say one year) tradeoffs and risks of the LC...with full modifications...and maybe limit the year to more "local"...ie...Minnesota/Wisconsin type travel...vs...freeways and mountains!...TMR
Tire choice may be a matter of preference. High performance low profile tires will have stiff sidewalls, but there are low profile tires with softer sidewalls designed for a smooth ride. LT tires may be stiffer; high performance low profile tires will offer better dry pavement traction.

Can Am set up my tow vehicle. After 7,000 miles of towing in every kind of weather except snow, I am still a happy customer. I have seen what they do, and talked to Andy on a number of occasions. He (or his brother Kirk) do their best to test drive everything they set up, and they hold themselves to high standards. The test drives include relatively abrupt lane changes (to simulate an emergency maneuver) at 65 to 70 mph.

The offered test drives would surprise a lot of people. Stability, handling, and comfort are not compromised with these setups.

I think that the weight of the tow vehicle is not nearly as important as stability and lateral traction. Independent rear suspension, a short rear overhang, and a low centre of gravity along with precise WDH setup work wonders.

Lots of their customers tow in the mountains. One customer traded his Lexus SC400 for an RX300 for more ground clearance when he towed his 25' Safari to Mexico. And many have had multiple tow cars and have no interest in towing with a truck because their cars work so well. Durability seems fine as long as the cars are driven sensibly and maintained properly.

As far as I have been able to determine, legality is basically a non-issue in Canada and the US.
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