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08-29-2013, 03:17 PM
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#121
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Rivet Master
2007 23' Safari SE
Central
, Connecticut
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,652
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Just want to throw this out there. I enjoyed towing with the office's Flex Ecoboost. But a 2011+ Dodge Durango with the V6 gets similar fuel economy and is rated to tow 6200 lbs with the tow package. (7200 with its V8, which I own)
Gives you another car-like tow vehicle but with a higher rating for more flexibility in trailer choice.
__________________
Now: 2007 Safari SE 23' "Anne" towed by 2011 Dodge Durango "Herman"
Before: Argosy Minuet and T@B, towed by various Honda Odysseys
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08-29-2013, 03:22 PM
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#122
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Moderator
2017 26' Flying Cloud
Alamo Heights
, Texas
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 8,500
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mutcth
Just want to throw this out there. I enjoyed towing with the office's Flex Ecoboost. But a 2011+ Dodge Durango with the V6 gets similar fuel economy and is rated to tow 6200 lbs with the tow package. (7200 with its V8, which I own)
Gives you another car-like tow vehicle but with a higher rating for more flexibility in trailer choice.
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Yeah, but it doesn't look like a packing crate with warp drive.
__________________
— David
Zero Gravitas — 2017 Flying Cloud 26U | WBCCI# 15566
He has all of the virtues I dislike and none of the vices I admire. — Sir Winston Churchill
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08-29-2013, 06:12 PM
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#123
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Master of Universe
2008 25' Safari FB SE
Grand Junction
, Colorado
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 12,702
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Airstreams get very hot in the southwest sun. The insulation is only 2" of fiberglass and as said, aluminum transmits heat fast. Go north and uphill in the summer.
If you can't get the trailer first, make sure you know what trailer you want before you buy a town vehicle. As Stef and others say, you'll probably have the trailer a lot longer than the tow vehicle. Some people make mistake and pay for it; try to get it right the first time.
Gene
__________________
Gene
The Airstream is sold; a 2016 Nash 24M replaced it.
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09-29-2013, 12:36 AM
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#124
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2 Rivet Member
1964 26' Overlander
Cedar falls
, Iowa
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 24
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Looking to get a weight distrobution hitch as well as getting my class 3 factory reinforced. I have a 2013 flex with the appearance pkg... Ecoboost... Not bragging just wondering if the 20 inch wheels will be a factor. Need help setting up my flex. I have no worries about its ability. I could tow with another vehicle I have wich is rated for more.... But why? I love driving the flex solo much more. I'm pushing the limits with a 64 overlander but hey... I live in ia! Maybe if I was going to tow it through th Rockies I would give it a second thought. For the 100 mile camp adventure in the woodlands of the Midwest I know I will be fine. Andy at can am rv? I know you can hook me up with a safe setup.
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09-29-2013, 03:31 AM
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#125
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Rivet Master
2015 30' International
2009 27' FB International
2007 25' Safari
Currently Looking...
Greensboro
, North Carolina
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,564
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Just a note about towing...I tried to tow a 25 foot Int with a Porsche Cayenne Turbo. Lots of downshifting which drove me nuts! or more nuts. Sold it, bought a Dodge/Cummins in 2008 and it tows across the Rocky Mountains easily. IMO the diesels with the huge torque will tow best and are more economical fuel wise, once initial purchase is completed. There may be some situations where a gas or flex engine may not have the power, such as the passes in the Rockies over 11,000 feet....
__________________
Happy trails and Good Luck
Ms Tommie Fantine Lauer, Greensboro, NC
AIR #31871 KQ3H
www.fantinesvoice.com
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09-29-2013, 07:15 AM
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#126
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Rivet Master
1977 23' Safari
Niagara on the Lake
, Ontario
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 984
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Msmoto
Just a note about towing...I tried to tow a 25 foot Int with a Porsche Cayenne Turbo. Lots of downshifting which drove me nuts! or more nuts. Sold it, bought a Dodge/Cummins in 2008 and it tows across the Rocky Mountains easily. IMO the diesels with the huge torque will tow best and are more economical fuel wise, once initial purchase is completed. There may be some situations where a gas or flex engine may not have the power, such as the passes in the Rockies over 11,000 feet....
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If the vehicle is shifting constantly you are in the wrong gear. That's why I would only buy a tow vehicle that has the option of manually selecting gears. The Flex Ecoboost has paddle shifters and when in manual mode the transmission will not go in to 6th gear. A non-ecoboost flex only has the option of Low or Drive. The Eco-boost flex will have no trouble towing an Overlander from a power standpoint, 365HP 350TQ is LOTS of power!
__________________
1977 Safari Land Yacht
2005 Toyota Tundra SR5
2022 Toyota 4Runner SR5
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09-29-2013, 12:20 PM
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#127
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Master of Universe
2008 25' Safari FB SE
Grand Junction
, Colorado
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 12,702
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Msmoto
There may be some situations where a gas or flex engine may not have the power, such as the passes in the Rockies over 11,000 feet....
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Modern gas engines can do it easily. Our '07 Tundra has easily climbed the 11,000' passes many times. Diesel is no longer the only option for towing a heavy trailer.
Gene
__________________
Gene
The Airstream is sold; a 2016 Nash 24M replaced it.
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09-29-2013, 12:43 PM
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#128
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Rivet Master
2015 30' International
2009 27' FB International
2007 25' Safari
Currently Looking...
Greensboro
, North Carolina
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,564
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For sure, some of the newer gas engines may do well in towing....but, the diesel with the torque is my preference.
As to the Cayenne Turbo downshifting, I probably did not know what I was doing and indeed should have just left it in fifth gear instead of fully automatic.
One advantage of the diesel is the use of an exhaust brake, which IMO, is better than the compression of a gas engine. However, if one is looking at the best bang for the buck, I have considered the new Dodge with a big Hemi gas engine.
And, while I am at it...what is the fuel mileage when towing with a gas engine...at say 65 mph? I would like to know if the day comes I purchase a new Dodge, should i spend the extra for the Cummins or is the Big Hemi the way to go...?
Another question is whether one can get a mega cab 4 x 4 with a gas engine?
__________________
Happy trails and Good Luck
Ms Tommie Fantine Lauer, Greensboro, NC
AIR #31871 KQ3H
www.fantinesvoice.com
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09-29-2013, 12:52 PM
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#129
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Rivet Master
2012 25' Flying Cloud
Battle Lake
, Minnesota
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 7,714
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We use a 2012 Ram Hemi and have no power problems. Yes, drop down a gear if shifting to much, the new Hemi's have eight gears to pick from, you'll always have one just right. They're not bad on gas either; comparing diesel to gas mpg you must consider the higher cost of diesel fuel to be meaningful.
__________________
Doug and Cheryl
2012 FC RB, Michelin 16, ProPride 1400
2016 Ram 1500 Laramie Crew Cab 4X4 Ecodiesel 3.92 axles
The Truth is More Important Than the Facts
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09-29-2013, 01:36 PM
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#130
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Master of Universe
2008 25' Safari FB SE
Grand Junction
, Colorado
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 12,702
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Our towing mileage ranges from 10.5 to 11.5, but varies with terrain and wind—a good 40 mph tailwind can get it close to 14 mpg, but you just can't count on that. It seems to make little or no difference what the altitude is. As for torque, 401 lbs. is plenty.
If you consider a diesel, the original cost plus maintenance vs gas engine cost + maintenance has to be figured in. Both are higher for diesel and if you want to keep it for a very long time, eventually fuel costs will even out and diesel will be better overall after more time. But the truck will need other things fixed after a few hundred thousand miles and I will be driving a new truck before then.
I do get tired of looking at the same truck after 8 or 10 years, and find any vehicle tends to start looking shabby from ordinary wear and tear after 6 or 7 years and 100,000+ miles. I could get it fixed up, but that is another cost unless I get it painted with spray cans and a broom. And in 8 or 10 years gas engines should be much more efficient and fuel costs will be much lower than now for gas engines (unless fuel goes way up in price, but diesel will go up too). An electric hybrid truck would have lots and lots of torque, no transmission thus less cost, but so far no one is really focusing on that. Turbos and superchargers boost mileage for gas engines, but don't help enough yet.
Gene
__________________
Gene
The Airstream is sold; a 2016 Nash 24M replaced it.
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10-01-2013, 05:49 PM
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#131
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1 Rivet Member
Coastal
, California
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 15
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I've narrowed my selection down to two different Flexes.
Flex A: Used 2012 Limited Ecoboost, AWD, 11,000 miles, 17 months left on factory warranty, requires 800 miles travel to buy because of the price
Flex B: New 2012 Limited, NO EB, FWD, 3/36 factory warranty - no travel. Costs $2k more than the used one.
Is EB/AWD worth traveling to get and losing half the factory warranty, or would you go for new with full warranty and skip the EB?
If the EB model is $2k less, is the answer obvious?
Three out of four trips, we will be towing in the mountains.
Many thanks!
Dia
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10-01-2013, 06:22 PM
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#132
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Rivet Master
2015 30' International
2009 27' FB International
2007 25' Safari
Currently Looking...
Greensboro
, North Carolina
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,564
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Is the AWD an advantage over simply FWD? For me, having towed in a blizzard, AWD is an essential aspect of a tow vehicle.
__________________
Happy trails and Good Luck
Ms Tommie Fantine Lauer, Greensboro, NC
AIR #31871 KQ3H
www.fantinesvoice.com
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10-01-2013, 06:31 PM
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#133
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Rivet Master
1966 22' Safari
1954 22' Flying Cloud
Saline
, Michigan
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 854
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I'd go with the AWD. We have a 2012 natural aspirated AWD Flex, and it pulls our 66 Safari just fine. That said we are not mountain bound and I do have my own thoughts as to it's capability to pull there. Some dAY WE'LL FIND OUT!
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10-01-2013, 06:38 PM
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#134
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Rivet Master
1984 34' International
Toronto
, Ontario
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,499
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I'd go with the AWD as well, especially if you're planning on using State Parks.
The one thing I am sometimes worried about with our TV is grip on slippery surfaces and sand - not on the highway, at the campground. The Provincial Parks can be tricky at times.
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10-01-2013, 07:31 PM
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#135
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1 Rivet Member
Coastal
, California
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 15
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Alrighty, then, sounds like Ecoboost with AWD.
Thanks, everyone!
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10-02-2013, 02:16 AM
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#136
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Rivet Master
Commercial Member
2019 27' Tommy Bahama
London
, Ontario
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,343
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Hi Dia
I think you could use either one but the AWD EB is a really nice package and those are pretty low miles. For the $2000.00 you could likely put an exteneded warranty on it. I would make sure you get a Ford Extended Warranty as opposed to an aftermarket one. You can buy the warranty from your local Ford dealer which is a good idea as they will be the ones to service it.
Andrew T
__________________
Andrew Thomson London, Ontario
"One test is worth a thousand expert opinions." Tex Johnston, Boeing 707 test pilot
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10-02-2013, 04:14 AM
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#137
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Rivet Master
1984 34' International
Toronto
, Ontario
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,499
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That's a really good idea. We bought a three year nose to tail everything coverered warrantee from Honda when we bought our Odyssey. It cost $1500.
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10-03-2013, 03:30 PM
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#138
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Master of Universe
2008 25' Safari FB SE
Grand Junction
, Colorado
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 12,702
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The two options are not apples and apples.
It is generally thought rear or 4wd is better for towing because the drive wheels are closer to the trailer. I can't explain it, but it seems to make sense. AWD is different than 4wd. Usually AWD is fulltime and either the front or rear wheels get more power than the other axle. Something that may be worth finding out. Another factor is that used cars are selling closer to new prices—this is because of the drop in sales of new cars from 2008 on and that means fewer used cars are available and demand for them has driven up prices. The third factor of difference is EB vs. I'm not sure what. the EB will have more torque which is good for towing.
You didn't mention whether you are trading your present vehicle—that could affect final putcomes depending which dealing will give you more for your trade in—that will probably affect sales tax and could mean difference in final price of $500 or more, maybe much more depending on the trade in vehicle.
I wouldn't let the 800 mile round trip matter—it is a small matter unless the difference between choices is negligible.
If I had to choose between the 2, I'd choose #1, but I'd have looked further first.
Never worry about a deal you may lose if you have to make a selection before you are sure it is the right thing for you. This is very hard to do because you can't predict the future, but it can be hard to live with a decision you weren't sure of from the outset. You are smart to ask here so you can consider all options.
Gene
__________________
Gene
The Airstream is sold; a 2016 Nash 24M replaced it.
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10-03-2013, 04:25 PM
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#139
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Rivet Master
Currently Looking...
St. Catharines
, South Western Ontario
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 2,367
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gene
It is generally thought rear or 4wd is better for towing because the drive wheels are closer to the trailer. I can't explain it, but it seems to make sense.
Gene
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I always thought FWD was better for towing because the "pull" was from the front of the train. The weight (resistance) behind acts in a way to keep the lot in a straight line.
Note: My personal theory and I could be wrong....LOL
__________________
Airstreams..... The best towing trailers on the planet!
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10-03-2013, 04:55 PM
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#140
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Moderator
2017 26' Flying Cloud
Alamo Heights
, Texas
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 8,500
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Road Ruler
I always thought FWD was better for towing because the "pull" was from the front of the train. The weight (resistance) behind acts in a way to keep the lot in a straight line.
Note: My personal theory and I could be wrong....LOL
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On a level road, it shouldn't matter. However, in slippery conditions or at weird angles, the tongue weight at the rear may tend to unweight the drive axle on a FWD vehicle.
__________________
— David
Zero Gravitas — 2017 Flying Cloud 26U | WBCCI# 15566
He has all of the virtues I dislike and none of the vices I admire. — Sir Winston Churchill
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