Buying tow vehicle before Airstream..

[PharmGeek]

the suburban is indeed top heavy....a big ol boat....likely prone to roll....these are facts not opinion...

However, if your drive is very limited in distance and if you are a cautious person, it can be in this setting a very nice TV and tolerated as a daily....I know folks that LOVE LOVE the big ol suburbans...

the mercedes mentioned or the jeep...they do not have big payload ability...if that is not a hang up, then those are attractive options to consider.

The minivan route in some cases does not have the payload issues - some can really pack on weight...really surprised me...I just did not feel good about pulling my 30' airstream up through the smoky mountains, Appalachia, etc in it...I know folks do it, but I I wanted a more "confident" towing vehicle for such applications...

I would not hate on the mini van folks...if it works for them, then mo' power to them...they are laughing all the way to the bank I suppose

[farmerdave]

For what it's worth, I have the expedition EL. It's a great truck and very comfortable. It is a 2010 and I have 120,000 miles on it of hard farm work. Daily off road fording streams etc. it's only been in for repairs once, for the suspension air compressor at 105,000 miles. My dad drives the Suburban 2500 and has had several problems with it, mostly electrical. Both are good tow vehicles. I will buy another Expedition when the time comes.

[cptkel]

With us this talk about payloads, I am finding it difficult to determine what specific make/models exhibit. I try simple google search and also manufacture's website.

Where can I find payload information?

[andreasduess]

Originally Posted by cptkel

Where can I find payload information?

The manufacturer's website is usually a good starting point for payload and axle ratings. Edmonds, yahoo and even AOL also have good databases.

[ROBERT CROSS]

Read what others have to offer....

HowStuffWorks "Pickup Truck Payload & Towing Capacity"

How Much Load Can Your Pickup Truck Handle?

Bob

[Skater]

There was a time when every Airstream rally I went to could have been a Suburban rally instead - they used to be extremely popular for towing Airstreams. I didn't know they weren't making the 3/4 ton version any more.

I did consider Suburbans when we were buying but there were two reasons I chose against them. First, they seemed more expensive than an equivalent truck. Second, for our purposes, I like our truck anyway - I like having the ability to put dirty/smelly/wet/greasy/etc. things in the back without worrying about damaging carpet or making the interior smell. But it's not going to carry 6 or 8 people, either. Everyone needs to figure out their needs and then go from there.

[cptkel]

Ok, so I got an example for everyone.

I checked 2014 Suburban 1/2 ton figures
curb weight: 5680
max payload: 1520
gvwr: 7200
max conventional trailering?: 8100
gcwr: 14000

then there is 27FB Flying Cloud
hitch weight: 791 (does this factor into your payload?)
gvwr: 7600
net carrying capacity: 1732

Is this all I would need to effectively determine if the tow vehicle would be safe and effective? Could someone walk me through this work up?

[cptkel]

I think the suburban payload is where I would run into trouble, if I am thinking correctly...

Considering the hitch weight, which I am assuming you subtract from payload, that only leaves about 700 lbs for humans and gear. Is this right?

[urnmor]

There are alot on info on the forum buying a TV. I went through it just over a year ago. What I learned was: first do your own research. Do not rely on the sales person for expert advice. I found that they knew little about towing and the definitions of all of various weight capacities shown on the door plate. I also found the forum to be the best in this regards.
I would also recommend that you read the fine print regarding towing when it comes to gasoline. For instance Ford recommends premium in their eco booster when towing. for this reason I looked at diesel as the price was almost similar.

IMO you should also purchase bigger then you think you will need. Why, because at least in my case, I continue to buy additional stuff to take on trips.

I ended up purchasing a new diesel F 250 and have no regrets. I avg about 14 miles towing and between 18 and 19 not towing.

[ROBERT CROSS]

Originally Posted by cptkel

I think the suburban payload is where I would run into trouble, if I am thinking correctly...

Considering the hitch weight, which I am assuming you subtract from payload, that only leaves about 700 lbs for humans and gear. Is this right?

Yes....but consider.
Our weight distributing hitch transfers between 160-200lbs to the trailer axles depending on load.

But be advised... the Airstream published tongue weight for our 25' Classic is 760lbs.
The actual TW loaded for two weeks of boondocking is 1200lbs.
Our combined weight for this trip was 15960lbs.



Bob

[PharmGeek]

hypothetical calculation just for fun and consideration - not meant to be complete or accurate, but to consider:

Tongue weight of trailer: 791 lbs
Weight of hitch: 100 lbs (I have no idea, I think my propride is heavier at like 150)
Weight of me: 180, wife 160, 2 kids 60 and 80 lbs, 22 lb dog
Weight of other stuff in truck itself lets say 250 lbs?

Weight distribution hitch gains me back 150 lbs

So all those then minus 150 lbs = 1471 lbs

The 250lb number I am totally guessing...but when I did this calculus I remember thinking:

"I think I could pull off a 1/2 ton if I am careful and pack lean"

You will need to do this math for yourself

If you do not understand the subtraction from "weight distribution hitch", dont be shy to ask or youtube/google it...

Good luck

(PS - question to others on here - when manufacturer lists payload - say 1520 in this example...is that with TV dry or with TV on a full tank of gas?)

[cptkel]

I found this: 2005 Chevrolet Suburban 2500 LS

How could I find the weight details of this older model? Does this look like yours Bob?

[ROBERT CROSS]

Originally Posted by cptkel

I found this: 2005 Chevrolet Suburban 2500 LS

How could I find the weight details of this older model? Does this look like yours Bob?

Scroll down on this link and you will get an overview of how it was equipped when new. It does have the HD tow option. At 8 years I would replace the factory receiver.(hitch) This concern goes beyond the 2002 model year....2008.


You could also call and see if the dealer has a VISS check available for the vehicle. A complete survey would give you all the options, warranty repair history, build sheet, everything highlighted in the heading on this one for our Burb.


There is also an option sticker in the glove box that lists all options in code form. Each number is decoded on the VISS build sheet. They are also available online.


On edit...

It will need clip-on towing mirrors or the factory style upgrade, also you'll have to install the larger wheelhouse flaps, especially rear. It does have LT tires, can't make out the load range though.
It sure looks like a pretty clean vehicle at reasonable mileage.

Bob

[switz]

I made the bad decision to buy the GM diesel version of the 1500 Suburban 4x4 in the mid 90s. I "owned" it for two years and it was in my garage less than six months of that time. The rest of the time it spent in both the local Bloomington dealership and the more qualified dealership in Indianapolis. The fuel injector system was a total failure.

Funny, if the Chevy/GMC guys had just walked down the hallway at GM Corporate there is a door labeled Detroit Diesel and they knew how to build a diesel engine that worked.

Since the Mercedes could not handle the ready for camping 25FB weight of 7,000 pounds of the 7,300 GVW (the Mercedes front axle weight rating was exceeded, the GVW was exceeded and the 5,000 pound rated gear train was unhappy with the 50% weight overload towing even on basically level roads around Phoenix), I was looking for a upgraded tow vehicle and I settled on the Dodge with the Cummins Diesel engine which had the turbocharger based upon what we designed years ago. I was very familiar with the longevity of Cummins engines.

The 2012 Dodge did not need the Urea additive in the fuel, the new Ford designed diesel engine is still too new to know if they got it correct this time and the Chevy/GMC drive train had some issues and I disliked the appearance.

I am very pleased with the performance and smoothness of this rig and it will have no issues towing our 31' Classic with a GVW of 10,000 pounds. It would be entirely possible that fully loaded for camping, the rig combined weight could be at or just over 19,000 pounds.

[m.hony]

switz-
How did you spec your 30?
Which options? Colors?

[F450Harley]

Originally Posted by PharmGeek

hypothetical calculation just for fun and consideration - not meant to be complete or accurate, but to consider:

Tongue weight of trailer: 791 lbs
Weight of hitch: 100 lbs (I have no idea, I think my propride is heavier at like 150)
Weight of me: 180, wife 160, 2 kids 60 and 80 lbs, 22 lb dog
Weight of other stuff in truck itself lets say 250 lbs?

Weight distribution hitch gains me back 150 lbs

So all those then minus 150 lbs = 1471 lbs

The 250lb number I am totally guessing...but when I did this calculus I remember thinking:

"I think I could pull off a 1/2 ton if I am careful and pack lean"

You will need to do this math for yourself

If you do not understand the subtraction from "weight distribution hitch", dont be shy to ask or youtube/google it...

Good luck

(PS - question to others on here - when manufacturer lists payload - say 1520 in this example...is that with TV dry or with TV on a full tank of gas?)

PharmG,
Manufacturer's listed payload # varies (some dry some with fluid) so I always use the cat scale to establish the true curb wt. (empty vehicle with full tank of gas). That way all the customization ( custom rim, tire, bed cap, exhaust mod e.t.c) on the vehicle is accounted for. The true cat scale curb wt. is now subtracted from the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating sticker # to establish my payload. Some tests even encourage to further subtract the average driver's wt. of 200 LB from the payload. See the pickup truck.com link below on one of their tests.

2013 Light-Duty Challenge: Calculated Max Payload and Towing - PickupTrucks.com Special Reports

[dkottum]

Are we

- Relating big payload and trailer size needs to his unknown needs. Some people travel extensively without big loads in the truck bed and the trailer. We do.

- Showing hitch weights inaccurately measured below the trailer tongue jack, rather than where it rests on the truck receiver. Not mentioning whether a 150# Hensley/ProPride is attached to the tongue.

- Disregarding the tongue weight transferred to the trailer axles by a good weight distribution hitch.

Many, many of us tow with 1/2 ton trucks and SUV's without compromises to safety or personal needs. Modern SUV's and vans with fully independent suspension are most probably more stable than the trucks when properly hitched, can stop shorter. And big ol' trucks, as much as we love them, are not the most fun to maneuver as daily drivers, or buy fuel for.

Traveling light is clearly not for everybody, but we strive for it. I feel loaded down these days, miss the many years of VW vans we toured with.

[ROBERT CROSS]

Doug,

Are we?....I'm not.

I haven't commented +or- on anyones personal preferences.

Nothings been overlooked, the weight transferred is mentioned in my post.
"Our weight distributing hitch transfers between 160-200lbs to the trailer axles depending on load."

What IS disregarded is our factory stated TW of 760Lbs...a pipe dream at best.

The tongue weight is accurate, within 4" of the ball center.
The scale is calibrated in 50 lbs increments.
.....the haha head weighs 100lbs.
I'm no Archimedes, but I don't' believe I'm off by much.

I really feel bad if I offended you.

Bob

[Ed Brownfield]

I am in almost the same predicament as CPTKEL. Our homeowner's association does not allow pickup trucks to be parked in the neighborhood. We don't have a garage so we need to find a TV that will tow a 27 or 28 ft. Airstream. I currently own an Infiniti QX 56 with a towing capacity of 8,500 lbs. Can any one suggest a TV with more capacity?

[cptkel]

Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS

Scroll down on this link and you will get an overview of how it was equipped when new. It does have the HD tow option. At 8 years I would replace the factory receiver.(hitch) This concern goes beyond the 2002 model year....2008. You could also call and see if the dealer has a VISS check available for the vehicle. A complete survey would give you all the options, warranty repair history, build sheet, everything highlighted in the heading on this one for our Burb. There is also an option sticker in the glove box that lists all options in code form. Each number is decoded on the VISS build sheet. They are also available online. On edit... It will need clip-on towing mirrors or the factory style upgrade, also you'll have to install the larger wheelhouse flaps, especially rear. It does have LT tires, can't make out the load range though. It sure looks like a pretty clean vehicle at reasonable mileage. Bob

The towing Mirrors I'm sure won't be a problem. What are the larger wheelhouse flaps you talk about?

I'm going to call the dealer today to check on a VISS. Any other good information I should get before driving to see this one?