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Old 10-22-2008, 09:51 AM   #15
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Is the soon to be VW diesel the same as in the Sprinter? I think VW vans in Germany are made by MB? zz
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Old 10-22-2008, 10:06 AM   #16
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Perhaps what we're seeing here is a belief in bio-diesel for the future? Seems reasonable. What doesn't make any sense is "why are the Japanese and Germans leading the way on this while GM, Ford, and Chrysler seem to be ignoring the medium size diesel engine markets!" On a similar thought, Chrysler has had a great engine in the Sprinter Vans, but why didn't that engine make it's way into some Rams or even a Sprinter extended cab pickup?
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Old 10-22-2008, 10:08 AM   #17
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Mine's better than yours, yeah but mine's bigger.

Rag-on gang....it makes for entertaining reading.
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Old 10-22-2008, 10:17 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by zigzagguzzi View Post
Is the soon to be VW diesel the same as in the Sprinter? I think VW vans in Germany are made by MB? zz
No.
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Old 10-22-2008, 10:28 AM   #19
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Perhaps what we're seeing here is a belief in bio-diesel for the future? Seems reasonable. What doesn't make any sense is "why are the Japanese and Germans leading the way on this while GM, Ford, and Chrysler seem to be ignoring the medium size diesel engine markets!" On a similar thought, Chrysler has had a great engine in the Sprinter Vans, but why didn't that engine make it's way into some Rams or even a Sprinter extended cab pickup?
Right on BOB. In Europe they have Chrysler 300's with powerful 3.0L Diesels. When will we get the option???

Chrysler 300 CRD - Features - Diesel Power Magazine
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Old 10-22-2008, 11:03 AM   #20
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Nice link! A Chrysler 300 with a combined fuel economy of 29mpg! About the same as a Chevy Cobalt!
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Old 10-22-2008, 01:33 PM   #21
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Airstream vans are made in europe and imported...

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Perhaps what we're seeing here is a belief in bio-diesel for the future? Seems reasonable. What doesn't make any sense is "why are the Japanese and Germans leading the way on this while GM, Ford, and Chrysler seem to be ignoring the medium size diesel engine markets!" On a similar thought, Chrysler has had a great engine in the Sprinter Vans, but why didn't that engine make it's way into some Rams or even a Sprinter extended cab pickup?

The title line says it all....

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Old 10-22-2008, 01:35 PM   #22
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Perhaps what we're seeing here is a belief in bio-diesel for the future? Seems reasonable. What doesn't make any sense is "why are the Japanese and Germans leading the way on this while GM, Ford, and Chrysler seem to be ignoring the medium size diesel engine markets!"
This is not necessarily true. GM does have in development 1 or 2 smaller block diesels on the drawing boards. As with any product, there is about a 1 to 2 year turnaround making the dream a reality. The announcement was made about a year ago IIRC. Though what I read clearly was not designed for say a Cobalt or an Aveo, these engines could be installed into the Impala instead of the 5.3L gasser and a number of other vehicles, raising the fleet MPG averages. I think the next real money GM is placing it's bets on is cars like the Volt. Diesel is great, don't get me wrong, but to go 40 miles on zero gas, diesel, etc is really where it's at given that diesel and gas is still a pretty penny.
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Old 10-27-2008, 10:30 PM   #23
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Its Ok U guys go drive your short wheelbase BEAMERS and whatever,that are 1/2 the weight of what U are pullin and When I see U tied up in a knot in the median strip I will not even slow up, Cause then I'd have to tell ya "I TOLD YA SO"
Funny thing thing is that I've only seen the big old American pick-up trucks are twisted up on the side of the road. I've never caught a glimpse of these German vehicles in the situation you described. I suppose it could happen, but of course companies like Airtream (you've heard of them I hope) use Porsche TV for their demos.

Look this is a simple thing. These German vehicles have superior engines, superior transmissions, superior suspensions and superior technology to American vehicles. Yes American 3/4 ton TV have bigger engines, are longer and heavier. Those are flaws, not benefits. Weight decreases handling, big engines eat gas and longer just means less space in the lot. I'd rather do more with less.

And cutting to the chase - How in the heck could anyone argue that a solid rear axle could in anyway compete with independent rear suspension? Do you still use a coal furnace to heat your house? That's just a starting point. If you want to get into a little bit of engineering you'd realize that those heavy steel frames are inferior to modern unibody construction which is significantly stronger and lighter.

I really laugh when I hear people supporting these anequated technologies. Antiques are nice for collecting but not for daily use.
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Old 10-28-2008, 08:17 AM   #24
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Funny thing thing is that I've only seen the big old American pick-up trucks are twisted up on the side of the road. I've never caught a glimpse of these German vehicles in the situation you described. I suppose it could happen, but of course companies like Airtream (you've heard of them I hope) use Porsche TV for their demos.

Look this is a simple thing. These German vehicles have superior engines, superior transmissions, superior suspensions and superior technology to American vehicles. Yes American 3/4 ton TV have bigger engines, are longer and heavier. Those are flaws, not benefits. Weight decreases handling, big engines eat gas and longer just means less space in the lot. I'd rather do more with less.

And cutting to the chase - How in the heck could anyone argue that a solid rear axle could in anyway compete with independent rear suspension? Do you still use a coal furnace to heat your house? That's just a starting point. If you want to get into a little bit of engineering you'd realize that those heavy steel frames are inferior to modern unibody construction which is significantly stronger and lighter.

I really laugh when I hear people supporting these anequated technologies. Antiques are nice for collecting but not for daily use.
In YOUR opinion....

To each their own, If you want to spend your money on Jerman, Orental, Swedash, Frensh or Corein: go for it. Laff away.

We've all made our own choices and THATS what important.

I'm done now.
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Old 10-28-2008, 05:18 PM   #25
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Funny thing thing is that I've only seen the big old American pick-up trucks are twisted up on the side of the road. I've never caught a glimpse of these German vehicles in the situation you described. I suppose it could happen, but of course companies like Airtream (you've heard of them I hope) use Porsche TV for their demos.

Look this is a simple thing. These German vehicles have superior engines, superior transmissions, superior suspensions and superior technology to American vehicles. Yes American 3/4 ton TV have bigger engines, are longer and heavier. Those are flaws, not benefits. Weight decreases handling, big engines eat gas and longer just means less space in the lot. I'd rather do more with less.

And cutting to the chase - How in the heck could anyone argue that a solid rear axle could in anyway compete with independent rear suspension? Do you still use a coal furnace to heat your house? That's just a starting point. If you want to get into a little bit of engineering you'd realize that those heavy steel frames are inferior to modern unibody construction which is significantly stronger and lighter.

I really laugh when I hear people supporting these anequated technologies. Antiques are nice for collecting but not for daily use.
Looks like a solid axle here..
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Old 10-29-2008, 07:08 AM   #26
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That's a tractor. Have you ridden a semi/tractor before? It does it's job, barring ice, where it earned the term "jack-knife". But it's not a pleasant ride by any means. It's a rough job driving a tractor trailer. I have allot of respect for folks that can manage to stay in that business. It keeps America going.
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Old 10-29-2008, 08:25 AM   #27
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German Diesels and Tier 2 Bin 5

I've been reading a great deal recently on the new German diesels coming from BMW, Mercedes, VW, and Audi. So far there are two variations, but they all share the same Nox treatment system using Urea. Keep in mind, VW Audi and Porsche will all use the same power plant and BMW and MB collaborated on the design of the "bluetec" solution, although BMW calls it something completely different now.

I went so far as to go down to our local Mercedes dealer and try out a GL CDI and an ML CDI. Both were very nice, but for most of the modern 25' trailers I think I would only feel comfortable with the GL. But that begs the question, would you tow a trailer with a $65K luxury suv???

The BlueTecs and the VW variants are very interesting, but they are compromises over the CDI in order to meet the Tier 2 Bin 5 requirements to be sold in 50 states. I cannot say for certain for the BMW and VW solutions, but the Mercedes ML and GL do not have a Spare Tire.... no kidding. The area for the spare is used for the Urea tank and they come with run-flat tires. So adding to my question, would you want to tow with a $65k luxury suv without a spare tire

When I spoke to the BMW dealer about the X5 diesel coming out he seemed to indicate that a spare tire was included, albeit a donut versus a full size spare and that the urea tanks are located in two separate tanks, one heated on the inside and a second further in so it doesn't freeze. Overall I thought the BMW solution for urea treatment was nicer than Mercedes, plus fit and finish of an X5 is IMHO better than an ML or GL.

The one point I have not heard about the X5 is will it start if the urea tank is empty? Apparently the MB solution will not.

Looking forward to hearing about the first tow with one of these X5 diesels!!

Doug
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Old 10-29-2008, 09:22 AM   #28
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As I understand it, Volvo is also making diesels that will hopefully be available here soon.
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