Another 4runner question

[mffjm8509]

My wife and I are looking for a 2nd vehicle capable of towing our 20' Safari. My primary TV is my 2007 Tundra which I've had absolututely no problems with. I'm not looking to replace this TV, but add another vehicle to the motorpool that is capable of taking the AS along when added seating capacity is desired. I've read as much of the 4runner questions on here already, but they primarily pertain to older models.

Here are my conditions:

Must be an SUV

Must be a V8 capable of towing the AS (possibly a larger model up to 6000lb)

Seating capacity of at least 4

She would like to maintain a smaller vehicle for her daily use.

We have been considering the 2008 4.7L 4runner, 2008 Sequoia, and 2008 Chevy Tahoe. A longshot is the 2008 Porsche Cayenne but because of $$ limitations we'd opt for the base model.

What do you all think?

[Silvertwinkie]

For towing a 20', most all would be ok. Larger and you start to get into an area where some of these might not be as good as others. For example, the Toyota 4Runner, though it has a 7k tow rating, it only has a 109" wheelbase.

I'll leave the research up to you, but if you go larger, you'll start to want around 130" wheelbase depending on how large of a trailer you might go to in the future.

[hshovic]

I used a 2007 forerunner w/v8 and the air suspension for a 21' SOB trailer, and worked fine, but when upgraded to 25' Safari, it was too much for it, and
out of weight limits. So you might be fine! The workmanship and performance
was better than that on my current rig, but no Tundra is out of its weight limits to pull the 25'.

[Road Ruler]

I am one who believes that a "stable TV towing a stable TT= a stable combination".

If money were no object the Porsche would be the top performer.

MySpaceTV Videos: Airstream performance by Airstream Southwest Coaches

[mffjm8509]

We looked at several yesterday...still not decided on which one.

If money werent an issue, the porsche would have been our choice, however when all the options were added up it quickly reached out of our price range.

Road Ruler, the video you linked is impressive, but shot with the upper end 490HP Porsche. I wonder how the lower end 290HP model would perform under the same conditions?

I'm still leaning toward the 4runner, but still waiting to see how much Chevy will work with us on a Tahoe.

Thanks for the replies...

Mike

[Road Ruler]

Originally Posted by mffjm8509

Road Ruler, the video you linked is impressive, but shot with the upper end 490HP Porsche. I wonder how the lower end 290HP model would perform under the same conditions?

I'm still leaning toward the 4runner, but still waiting to see how much Chevy will work with us on a Tahoe.

Thanks for the replies...

Mike

Mike... For years my buddy towed a smallish 19'SOB TT with an 05 Nissan Quest Mini Van. It worked well but he wanted something with a bit more power. This year he upgraded to a new 4 Runner. He reported it did have more get up and go but for sure he now feels the 18 wheelers going by and the crosswinds giving him some sway issues. He is working on solutions to those concerns now.

The 290HP version of the Porsche or T-reg is more than enough for an Airstream. A couple years ago one of the Canadian RV mags had a detailed test report on the V8 T-reg and a 30' Airstream. To sum up Garth Cane reported it was the most stable combination he had ever tested. Here is the info on post #26, #27, and #28. http://www.airforums.com/forums/f463...r-17371-2.html

[osolow]

have you thought about the V8 powered nissan pathfinder?

32k pluse or minus a couple grand

[ckeysor]

It is great seeing the test footage because we used to have the 22' International and towed it with a 4runner. I thought the 4runner towed it just fine, even without sway control (the dealer said the 22 didn't need it). But when we went up to the 25' Soveriegn I thought it best to move up a bit.

I think for a 20' you will be fine as long as you are rigged correctly with weight distribution and sway control.

[tdpond]

I use a 2007 toyota 4runner with a v8 engine. I pulled the 20 airstream from floride to kentucky and did not have any problems. The 4.7 liter engine has plenty of power to pull the size of airstream that you are talking about. My 4 runner got about 18 mpg on the trip

[Journalist]

I used to be the service manager for the local Porsche dealership. The Cayenne is nothing more than a dressed up VW Touareg. (We used to get parts from the local VW dealership in a pinch) The base model even has the Volkswagen VR6 engine. You can get a V8 Touareg for less than the 6cyl Cayenne and it looks better to boot. Not to mention the fact that the V10 TDI Touareg cost about the same as a V8 Cayenne S and will outperform it while getting better mileage. The Porsche is a lot like the Cadillac Escalade, Lincoln Navigator or Lexus LX450. Same as a cheap vehicle, but dressed up for the poser who wants a flashy nameplate on a truck.

[Road Ruler]

Originally Posted by Journalist

The Porsche is a lot like the Cadillac Escalade, Lincoln Navigator or Lexus LX450. Same as a cheap vehicle, but dressed up for the poser who wants a flashy nameplate on a truck.

Interesting comparision. I believe performance vehicle enthusiasts know the differences and true value of the engineering that goes into various vehicles.

[Journalist]

Originally Posted by Road Ruler

Interesting comparision. I believe performance vehicle enthusiasts know the differences and true value of the engineering that goes into various vehicles.

Performance vehicle enthusiasts don't buy SUVs.

[Andrew T]

HI

Don't buy a 4Runner to tow with. It is a great off road vehicle but I use it as an example of how not to build a tow vehicle. Every spec on it is bad for towing. The factory hitch receiver is extreamly weak and will not transfer weight properly and the only way to strengthen it means removing the spare tire. As well the receiver tube is so short it soon strethes so the ball mount wobbles all over.

If you want an SUV to tow with there are many that will perform very well. What you want to look for are;

1) As low a center of gravity as you can get

2) independent rear suspension is very important.

3)A short wheelbase is fine as long as the rear overhang is also short.

I would not focus so much on needing a V8. The engine is only part of the performance equation. If the vehicle needs less power to pull itself then there is additional power left for towing so a smaller engine can give you the same performance but much better fuel economy.

The 290 HP handles the same as the 400 HP Cayanne but it is still expensive.

First choice for me in an SUV. Mercedes ML320 CDI. Great bang for the buck massive torque and great fuel mileage. Second the Mercedes ML350. Mated to the 7 speed transmission the 3.7 Litre V6 will perform similar to your tundra but handle better. Both will tow a 34' anywhere on the continent.

We have several customers with V6 Touareg's that tow 25-30's and they are pleased with the performance, some previously towed with v8 trucks and find them similar performing but for about the same money the ML is a much better tow vehicle.

The Buick Enclave GMC Acadia work quite well if you change the tires. They handle much better than the Tahoe as the wheelbase is longer the CofG is lower and they have independent rear suspension. Again performance is similar to the V8.

If you don't need the SUV ground clearance then a Chrysler 300C with all wheel drive performs fantastic and gets good fuel economy even though it is a V8.

Sorry I don't have time this morning for longer explanations.

Andy

[Silvertwinkie]

I was with Andy's comments all the way up to towing a 34 footer with any of the discussed vehicles, including the Tahoe.

The remaining post south of the 34' comments, I'm pretty much in sharp disagreement.

[Journalist]

Andy, you can't be serious. A 34-footer behind an ML class Mercedes? I'm sure it will pull it, but safely? That's a little more trailer than I want behind a vehicle with a wheelbase that short.

[mffjm8509]

Thanks to everyone for the info....

We drove a Touareg today and my wife loves it.

Here's my qustion now......will the V6 Touareg at 280HP be sufficient for my 20' Safari or the new 23' FB model I'm considering?

Sorry to keep draggin this on........

Mike

[Silvertwinkie]

Fine for a 19' and most likely be ok up to 23'.

[CanoeStream]

Given: Some (fortunately only some) RV dealers and quite a few auto/truck dealers don't understand tow setups very well. If I had to deal with the push and pull of daily driving/towing needs and found myself with a midsize vehicle, I'd go out of my way to pay a call on Andy (Andrew T) in London, Ontario. Low side-flex tires and a Hensley later, I'd be in better shape than some surprised folks with muscled up TV-trailer combos. But I'd apply everything he says and certainly wish that he oversee it personally. Lewster and others report talking to many Canadian travelers in Florida with such setups -- Lew is not surprised to see that they've made many trips trouble free (including mountain interstates). 34 footers? I have a hard time on every point. But I keep trying to follow Andy and will say that he has my strong respect.

Touaregs? Devoman and Westfalia are good advocates. I think Devoman had a Bambi (19') when he said a V6 wasn't great in this thread. On your own, use Search - Advanced. Use only one keyword - Touareg. Place either Westfalia or Devoman under User Name. Click 'Search Now' and start reading.

[mffjm8509]

I've read a lot on here about the air suspension and generally lower horsepower of the models before this year.

Would you think the air suspension is a neccessary addition on this model? I havent found any v6 models between Denver and Pueblo with the air suspension.

Honestly, we're down to comparison of this V6 280HP Touareg and the V8 4runner. This will NOT be my primary TV, as my Tundra will remain primary.

Thanks again,
Mike

[hshovic]

Here's a slightly different take. When deciding on my present TV, I went to the numbers, for better or worse, as well as others' experiences. The numbers come from factory specs, so may not be totally accurate (they arealways fudged between optimism and liability), but are probably fairly precise (done the same way across brands).

For those interested in the numbers, here is a thread (with spreadsheets) and
an application.

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f463...tml#post456088

Hank