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Old 01-02-2020, 05:17 PM   #1
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2019 Ford Expedition MAX Eco-Boost Towing 28' w/ ProPride

We have a 2012 Flying Cloud 28' which until recently we had been towing with a 2013 Chevrolet Suburban 2500 (rating 9,600lbs).

The Suburban went kaput and the closest thing we could find was the Expedition Max with the Ecoboost (rating 9,300lbs). We've been on two trips with it, and it tows the trailer well. It feels different than a 3/4-ton, but it can accelerate, pass, go uphill, etc., with ease.

I'm not happy with the towing height, though, and am hoping someone can help. Our Pro-Pride hitch was set up for the Suburban. I did all the measurements again for the Expedition, and it seems the "stinger" is still at the proper setting. On the other hand, the trailer is definitely towing much lower than beforehand.

When I tow, the back of the Expedition is squatting several inches and my tow chains are very close to the ground. Sometimes when we're entering drives or parking lots, my hitch will bottom out as it's riding so low.

Again, I think I have the hitch set up at the right offset. I'm wondering if I need to investigate airbags for my rear suspension? I don't even really know what these are and if that's the right answer here or not. Any advice?
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Old 01-02-2020, 05:30 PM   #2
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The 2500 suburban probably had a much stiffer rear end suspension, solid rear end with heavy duty leaf springs. The Expedition has a independent rear end with coil springs. While the independent rear suspension is a superior design for comfort and handling it's probably softer, thus the settling.

I'd try adding more tension to the the weight distribution bars. The effect should be to lift the rear some. You probably didn't need much tension when hitched to the heavy duty suburban.

A simple way to monitor proper weight distribution adjustment is to measure and record the distance between road and top of front tire wheel well when the Expedition is unloaded and flat and level, like when parked in the garage. Then with the trailer attached on a flat and level place add tension to the bars to get that same wheel well distance (front tires).
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Old 01-02-2020, 05:44 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by kscherzi View Post
The 2500 suburban probably had a much stiffer rear end suspension, solid rear end with heavy duty leaf springs. The Expedition has a independent rear end with coil springs. While the independent rear suspension is a superior design for comfort and handling it's probably softer, thus the settling.

I'd try adding more tension to the the weight distribution bars. The effect should be to lift the rear some. You probably didn't need much tension when hitched to the heavy duty suburban.

A simple way to monitor proper weight distribution adjustment is to measure and record the distance between road and top of front tire wheel well when the Expedition is unloaded and flat and level, like when parked in the garage. Then with the trailer attached on a flat and level place add tension to the bars to get that same wheel well distance (front tires).
The 3/4-ton Suburban was definitely stiffer. Rode like an old truck. The Expedition rides more car-like.

Next time I'm hooked up, I'll try what you suggested. I'm pretty sure I've been cranking the jacks up the exact same height I used to use on the old TV, so that may be part of the problem. I'll see if I can solve this without any additional money out of pocket.

On the other hand, I'm thinking about upgrading to a 30' bunkhouse and buying a basic 3/4-ton truck to exclusively be a TV (although my wife thinks that's lunacy).
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Old 01-02-2020, 08:17 PM   #4
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2019 Ford Expedition MAX Eco-Boost Towing 28' w/ ProPride

Heavy tongue on that trailer. You are probably at or exceeding the receiver 950lb rating on the new expedition. Have you run over the CAT scales yet?

Propride adds a quite a bit of additional to tongue weight, albeit some of it is offset by the length of the stinger.

Definitely sounds like you donít have enough weight distribution / suv is squatting, and I agreed that you should try cranking up the WD towers. Make sure you are using 1,400lb propride WD bars.

Keep your eye on those receiver welds as you place additional torque on the receiver with a more aggressive WD setting.

For what it is worth BAB on the forum had a similar setup with a QX56 which has similar tow ratings as the new expedition. (I used to tow with one too)
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Old 01-02-2020, 09:11 PM   #5
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Hitch tongue weight rating. Ever notice that manufactures always rate the tongue weight at 10% of tow rating?
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Old 01-02-2020, 09:38 PM   #6
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I agree with the comments of the soft rear suspension. It sounds like you have not dialed enough in on the jacks.

Are you measuring the front wheel well height and ensuring it is suitably restored?
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Old 01-03-2020, 05:06 AM   #7
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My SUV rates the hitch at 8% of the tow rating.
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Originally Posted by kscherzi View Post
Hitch tongue weight rating. Ever notice that manufactures always rate the tongue weight at 10% of tow rating?
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Old 01-03-2020, 07:33 AM   #8
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Difference Between Air Bags Suspension and Weight Distribution

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeppelin View Post
... I'm wondering if I need to investigate airbags for my rear suspension? I don't even really know what these are and if that's the right answer here or not. Any advice?
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Old 01-03-2020, 08:26 AM   #9
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Excellent video. Unfortunately it didnít address the combination of both technologies in that airbags would stiffen the rear suspension and allow it to better carry the increased load (soft comfortable ride empty vs heavy duty suspension better capable of handling the load). I would have liked to see that addressed but I understand the point that many people may believe bags are enough because they cure squat which is very well debunked as inadequate in that video.
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Old 01-03-2020, 08:40 AM   #10
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If the '19's independent rear is anything like the 15 - 17's rear, good luck with finding anything to make it better for towing.

kscherzi's comment about adding tension to the WD bars is spot-on and the only thing that is available to control squat at this time.

At the moment I have ~8K of trailer with maybe 1/2" squat on an ecoboost Ex. I did lower the ball which helped offset the Ex's higher receiver. Adding tension to the bars is what is keeping the squat near nil.

If you do pull the trigger on the 30' bunkhouse, ignore your wife as you will NOT like the Ex's reduced stability at the top end of its tow rating and wish that you had overhauled the Sub. Also, the Ex does not have a huge cargo capacity and tongue weight eats into that number.
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Old 01-03-2020, 09:11 AM   #11
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I think I would either talk to Sean at Propride and/or Andy at CanAm. I know that people pull a 28' with an Expedition. I put the 1400lb bars up quite a ways even on my F150 to level it out. So it is probably the case you need to raise the bars up. I'd go close to 9 inches on the towers and see how that works. Can't really go much beyond that. The other option would be to check if the Roadmaster suspension system would work for an Expedition. I have it on my F150 and it is far better than airbags, far cheaper, and increases stability significantly without affecting the ride. This was recommended to me by a person who works on suspensions and tows trailers. It naturally raises the rear about 1 inch.
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Old 01-03-2020, 10:21 AM   #12
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150's have a solid rear. Completely different animal than the Ex's IRS.

Roadmaster will not work with coils
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Old 01-03-2020, 10:27 AM   #13
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2019 Expedition Max

I also have a 2019 Expedition Max and tow a 2019 FSFBT. I found that the tow bar needed more tension to lift the rear end and better equalize the measurements from the ground to the top of the front and rear wheel wells. I use an Equal-I-Zer hitch but the same logic applies to the ProPride. Good luck - and enjoy the Expedition.
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Old 01-03-2020, 10:42 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeppelin View Post
... 30' bunkhouse and buying a basic 3/4-ton truck to exclusively be a TV (although my wife thinks that's lunacy).
Sounds like a perfectly thought out plan! Sometimes the DFís just donít understand our great ideas
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Old 01-03-2020, 01:24 PM   #15
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Zeppelin - if you decide to move up to a 30' bunkhouse and want to sell your 28' Airstream I am interested.
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Old 01-03-2020, 04:49 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by wulfraat View Post
Heavy tongue on that trailer. You are probably at or exceeding the receiver 950lb rating on the new expedition. Have you run over the CAT scales yet?

Propride adds a quite a bit of additional to tongue weight, albeit some of it is offset by the length of the stinger.

Definitely sounds like you donít have enough weight distribution / suv is squatting, and I agreed that you should try cranking up the WD towers. Make sure you are using 1,400lb propride WD bars.

Keep your eye on those receiver welds as you place additional torque on the receiver with a more aggressive WD setting.

For what it is worth BAB on the forum had a similar setup with a QX56 which has similar tow ratings as the new expedition. (I used to tow with one too)
Wulfraat is right; get your rig weighed...what is your tongue weight and most importantly, what is the "Payload" rating on the sticker in your doorjamb on that Expedition?? Airbags don't do anything for handling, which is what I would be more concerned with...distributing the weight back to front wheels, but your "Payload" may be way too low for this AS tongue weight your loading...only scales will tell you if your within limits.
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Old 01-03-2020, 05:30 PM   #17
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Couple of good suggestions already offered. Best would be to call Sean at ProPride. Sounds as though you need more weight moved forward where a CAT scale will help decide exactly how much. Not sure how many washers you currently have in your setup. May need to add more to throw the stinger end downward which will help allow more to be displaced to front of vehicle. Good luck. Couple of pictures and a few minutes on the phone with Sean, you will be good to go with confirmation with some scale numbers. Good luck.

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Old 01-08-2020, 11:09 AM   #18
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Going backwards from a 3/4 ton to 1/2 ton is difficult as evidenced from these comments and my own experience.
You mentioned you are considering a 3/4 ton pick up especially if you get a 30' AS. Personally I have found a 3/4 ton works best for trailers 25' and up. Sure you can make a 1/2 work but you are always on the edge. The tongue weight of my 25' is over 1000 lbs and throw in a months worth of camping equipment in your TV and camper and you are at or above limits very quickly.
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Old 01-08-2020, 11:16 AM   #19
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I am a CAT scale fan. I was towing with an LX570 that automatically leveled the vehicle when adding the trailer. It was very difficult to determine that proper setting for the tow bars. With the trailer disconnected, I measured the tongue weight. I made my best guess on chain settings. I then went to the CAT truck scales to measure the vehicle axels and the trailer. (They have an app that charges ~$12 to weight and ~$2 to re-weight.) I pulled off the scale, adjusted my chains and repeated the weight check. After three tries I had the correct settings to use going forward. I now have a different tow vehicle, but I use the CAT scales periodically to check the weight distribution. The control and ride are noticeably better when I am better balanced - and safer.
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Old 01-08-2020, 12:38 PM   #20
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I don't know if this is helpful at all, or not, but I tow a 23' FC with my 2019 Ford Expedition Max Platinum and don't have any of these problems. I don't notice any sag or worry about scraping bottom. My safety chains do hang low, but that's not a big deal. I've never felt close to scraping ground and I've been off road with it. The new Expy tows like a beast.
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