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Old 04-09-2015, 07:37 AM   #29
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"I bought a 2014 ML350 Bluetec and now pull a 2015 30' Bunk.The Benz will get warm (max 90C under 200F) on 6% plus grades in the summer. I still turn the interior heat on to assist which will bring it back down to 80C. We have over 30k on the ML with half of that actual towing in and out of CO.
Best mileage around 16 towing cruise at 65 no wind. It goes down to 12 worst case depending on speed and head winds."


2012FB: Did you upgrade the cooling radiator fan on your ML-350BT? This is a fairly expensive option ($1,200) but since I made the change, the 'Beast' has never wavered higher then the middle and I've also noticed slightly better MPG (18-20 @ 63 miles per hour). Obviously our AS are different in size/weight, but you should review with your dealer to ensure that you actually do have the HD cooling fan installed (it goes from 65 to 95 watts and uses up all the available space).
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Old 04-09-2015, 07:38 AM   #30
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I towed my 25 though New Mexico, Arizona in June with 100+ degree days and the AC on. These are not the 14,000 footers but, there was still some long grades. My GC got hot like the prior photo shows. I got concerned, I let off the speed a little, it came down a little, after the peek on the decent it went back to normal. I checked the other temps, oil and trans. They were warmer that normal but within limits.
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Old 04-09-2015, 08:41 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by LongShot View Post
"I bought a 2014 ML350 Bluetec and now pull a 2015 30' Bunk.The Benz will get warm (max 90C under 200F) on 6% plus grades in the summer. I still turn the interior heat on to assist which will bring it back down to 80C. We have over 30k on the ML with half of that actual towing in and out of CO.
Best mileage around 16 towing cruise at 65 no wind. It goes down to 12 worst case depending on speed and head winds."


2012FB: Did you upgrade the cooling radiator fan on your ML-350BT? This is a fairly expensive option ($1,200) but since I made the change, the 'Beast' has never wavered higher then the middle and I've also noticed slightly better MPG (18-20 @ 63 miles per hour). Obviously our AS are different in size/weight, but you should review with your dealer to ensure that you actually do have the HD cooling fan installed (it goes from 65 to 95 watts and uses up all the available space).
LongShot, what year is your ML? I have the factory Tow package but will check to make sure I have the HD fan. I feel the cooling is currently good except on the 6% plus high altitude grades and even then with the AC off and heater on it stays at normal. With that said if there is an upgraded fan I will get it put on.
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Old 04-09-2015, 01:32 PM   #32
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I have just returned from my Easter trip to Fort Lauderdale via Nashville and Saint George Island towing a 30' Signature with a 2014 Jeep GC Diesel. Zero issues. 5500 k. The Jeep is clearly a generational improvement in comfort, handling, and performance (440 lbs ft vs 377) over my previous 2008 Jeep diesel, which I found to be an excellent all around vehicle. I now cruise at 70 instead of the previous 62 mph and obtain the same average towing fuel economy of 14-15 mpg. 44lbs rear and 42 front, 78 in the Airstream. I did use the paddle shifters in the hills, never needed to go below 6th. Oil temps never increased more than 5% but it was cool in them thar hills. Jim



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Old 04-10-2015, 06:36 AM   #33
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Always good to get such information. One question; isn't the 30' trailer heavier than the Jeep GC and shouldn't that be an issue regarding the safety of towing? I reflect here the laws we faced in Europe where the TV had to outweigh the TT by 15%. Different rules here but many folk say you don't want the TV pushed around by the TT especially down steep hills.
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Old 04-10-2015, 06:53 AM   #34
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2012FB: I have a 2012 ML 350 BlueTec; the only upgrades the dealer recommended when I had the brake controller installed (the towing package didn't have that or a 7-pin) was the beefy fan. He did say I probably would never need it as these things are ridiculously overbuilt, but also mentioned that the car would like the extra cooling through mountains so I swallowed the kool-aid and spent the $1,200. My shooting season takes me from Florida to Texas to the Carolinas, Kentucky, Indiana and even into Michigan - With all these miles, I just didn't want to chance anything.
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Old 04-11-2015, 08:07 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by Adam Geuss View Post
Always good to get such information. One question; isn't the 30' trailer heavier than the Jeep GC and shouldn't that be an issue regarding the safety of towing? I reflect here the laws we faced in Europe where the TV had to outweigh the TT by 15%. Different rules here but many folk say you don't want the TV pushed around by the TT especially down steep hills.
The European rules are as arbitrary as the north american ones (banning safety equipment that is standard here for legacy reasons) and such. The trailers are completely different(narrower standard?) with the axle moved for light tongue weights even on giant tow weights. I don't recall the 15% being one of the rules there, and if it is somewhere it's arbitrary based on using such a lightweight towing setup that it's probably meaningless.

maybe if their "caravans" get into trouble they just detach and lets them fall into a nearby mountain pass. There's a "Hitch Hints" article on this same subject with actual information.
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Old 01-02-2016, 04:54 PM   #36
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I have 52,500+ miles on our 2014 JGC Summit Ecodiesel, with over 14,000 miles towing our 23FB (CAT confirmed loaded weight of 5,600 lbs, and 560 lbs TW using an Equalizer hitch). Love the paddle shifters and Diesel engine braking across many mountain passes. I watch both engine and transmission temps closely. Though they both occasionally rise, I have never overheated. Though my typical T ranges well below these levels here are my highest observed T's: engine oil - 242 F / Transmission - 195 F. These were digital readings from the EVIC. The idiot lights have never illuminated for either trams or engine, though the coolant Temp gauge has risen to near top of the analogue scale when driving over the CA I5 Grapevine at 70 mph in ambient temperatures of 75 F.
Highway mileage is typically 29-32 mpg at 65-70 mph w/o trailer and 16.4 mpg with trailer at 60-65 mph.
I hardly know the AS is behind me and easily pass slower vehicles over mountain passes.
I did have MOPAR skid plates installed and also the aftermarket plate offered by Dom in CA. The latter is a must-have no matter where you drive as the DEF injector is otherwise vulnerable.
Overall, the JGC is the most comfortable and versatile vehicle I have owned. And I have had many, including European and American makes.
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Old 01-02-2016, 05:33 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by Adam Geuss View Post
Always good to get such information. One question; isn't the 30' trailer heavier than the Jeep GC and shouldn't that be an issue regarding the safety of towing? I reflect here the laws we faced in Europe where the TV had to outweigh the TT by 15%. Different rules here but many folk say you don't want the TV pushed around by the TT especially down steep hills.
A 30 ' Airstream could also be heavier than a Ram 3500 so I am not sure what weight has to do with the ability of a vehicle to safely tow an Airstream. Jim



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Old 01-03-2016, 09:27 AM   #38
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If I read WestieHouse post above correctly, the axles of his 23FB are carrying 5,600 pounds of their 6,000 pound rating and the tongue weight computed of 560 pounds put the trailer in an exceed the GVW status by 160 pounds. Exceeding the GVW gets some folks a wedgie in the mind.

We crossed the CAT scales with 5,620 pounds on the trailer axles of our 23D with the tongue yet to be determined on a stand alone basis on level ground.

I might suggest storing the unit with only a few gallons of fresh water in the tank to reduce the load on the axles a little while the unit is in storage.

A friend that restores Airstreams suggested the axles service life may not be as long with a nearly capacity load on them all the time.

Our Classic axles are supporting about 8,200 pounds or 82% of their 10,000 pound capacity.
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Old 01-03-2016, 10:59 AM   #39
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Posted Today at 08:55 AM by WestieHouse
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam Geuss View Post
Always good to get such information. One question; isn't the 30' trailer heavier than the Jeep GC and shouldn't that be an issue regarding the safety of towing? I reflect here the laws we faced in Europe where the TV had to outweigh the TT by 15%. Different rules here but many folk say you don't want the TV pushed around by the TT especially down steep hills.
The bigger issue is tongue weight. The JGC Ecodiesel is rated at 720 lbs max tongue weight. All newer AS above 23 feet (and including the 23D) exceed this amount. That was a determining factor for our selection of the 23 FB.
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Old 01-03-2016, 11:08 AM   #40
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One question; isn't the 30' trailer heavier than the Jeep GC and shouldn't that be an issue regarding the safety of towing? I reflect here the laws we faced in Europe where the TV had to outweigh the TT by 15%. Different rules here but many folk say you don't want the TV pushed around by the TT especially down steep hills.
The Euro rules relating to the relative weights of tow vehicle and trailer relate to the use of surge brakes, whereby the braking action of the tow vehicle activates the trailer brakes. That doesn't come into play with electrically activated brakes.

Some like a heavier tow vehicle as they believe it is safer. Thousands of semi trailer drivers with trailers greatly outweighing their tractors would disagree.

Interesting comment on being pushed down hills. All those promoting diesel pick up trucks with exhaust brakes are planning on being pushed down hills, when they reference not needing to use their trailer brakes.
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Old 01-03-2016, 11:10 AM   #41
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[QUOTE=switz;1731113]If I read WestieHouse post above correctly, the axles of his 23FB are carrying 5,600 pounds of their 6,000 pound rating and the tongue weight computed of 560 pounds put the trailer in an exceed the GVW status by 160 pounds. Exceeding the GVW gets some folks a wedgie in the mind.

I am always open to learning, but my understanding is that tongue weight (which I measured using a tongue weight scale) is measured without the tv being connected and this is a separate measure of the actual weight bearing on the hitch and thus contributes to the tow vehicle CGVR, which we never exceed (1050 lbs on our JGC). The total weight of the trailer on the CAT scales (only trailer axles on that pad) is 5,600 lbs. TV weight is obtained on CAT scale (both tv axles placed on a separate pad) and does include the tongue weight.

Clarifications welcome!
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Old 01-03-2016, 12:02 PM   #42
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I am always open to learning, but my understanding is that tongue weight (which I measured using a tongue weight scale) is measured without the tv being connected and this is a separate measure of the actual weight bearing on the hitch and thus contributes to the tow vehicle CGVR, which we never exceed (1050 lbs on our JGC). The total weight of the trailer on the CAT scales (only trailer axles on that pad) is 5,600 lbs. TV weight is obtained on CAT scale (both tv axles placed on a separate pad) and does include the tongue weight.

Clarifications welcome!
That weight you measure with the tongue weight scale is the static tongue weight. It is used when considering the rating of the receiver hitch. It always bears down on the hitch.

WD equipment doesn't reduce the weight bearing down on the hitch, but it can redistribute that load, so that the effective tongue weight that is carried by the TV is reduced, based on how much is left on the tow vehicle and how much is redistributed to the trailer axles. So, with WD equipment, the static tongue weight is not the weight you add to your payload.

What do you mean by CGVR? If you mean Combined Gross Vehicle Weight Rating, it is the combined trailer plus tow vehicle rating, not the hitch rating or payload rating (one of which is presumably 1050).
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