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Old 02-04-2015, 08:35 AM   #71
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More than five gears used in a gas engined pickup truck are not there for the sake of performance, but to extract tenths of an MPG.




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Old 02-04-2015, 09:22 AM   #72
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More than five gears used in a gas engined pickup truck are not there for the sake of performance, but to extract tenths of an MPG.




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Ummm, It's about both. Volumetric efficiency for the engine, which precludes the need for a narrow RPM band (for street applications) at which fuel efficiency and driveability under a vast number of need sets and loads can be accomplished.

More gears keeps a well designed and tuned engine, to fill those needs, in an RPM band where that volumetric efficiency can result in max power and fuel efficiency for a varied need set.

It's harder in trucks because they are used under a wider range of loads and lifestyles. Some are used as little more than passenger cars with a LARGE trunk....and the same platform may be use by some as a workhorse (most of us here, to some extent)

More gears isn't done as a whim...if all we needed out of a truck was to move a couple of passengers, all we'd need is a 2.5L naturally aspirated 4 cylinder with a powerglide. To heck with driveability, pleasability, and fuel economy.

With all due respect...and I mean that...your comment reflects a very simplistic analysis of the product segment and manufacturer(s) research and offerings. Yes, the Govt. does mandate fuel economy standards, but the mfrs. HAVE TO offer performance, particularly for the truck market.
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Old 02-04-2015, 10:11 AM   #73
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Your view also is simplistic, but in a different way.

The reason the power band on modern gas engines is practically narrowed is not because of the limitations of the technology itself, but because the engineers have taken the path of a narrowed practical powerband to extract every bit of advantage from a narrow range.


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Old 02-04-2015, 10:21 AM   #74
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Oh, ok, have a nice day.
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Old 02-04-2015, 10:34 AM   #75
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Ok now that we've gone deep into transmissions and gearing and given the original poster an education, let's save the discussion on the merits of where the manufactures and government are taking us.

Bottom line will the truck be used primarily for towing or for commuting ? This will make a difference in the selection of the truck specs and the trailer that will be towed.

To the O.P. you now have a wealth of info, use it wisely.
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Old 02-04-2015, 11:01 AM   #76
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Thanks all. The sum of all this appears to be that I can get 1700-1800 lbs cargo capacity in a Ford 1/2 ton right now. . . and nowhere else. If I wait until Chevy accepts orders for the 6.2/max trailer tow combination or I order that with the 5.3 engine, I can get that in a Chevy/GMC too. When Ford starts accepting orders for the max payload package, I can get above 2,000 lbs. cargo.
I'm not happy about waiting another 4+ months and I'm not comfortable about overloading the truck. While I may not exceed GAWR, I have no idea how the truck will handle.
So, I need to have a chat with my wife about 3/4 ton gasoline trucks which don't have these issues. While they don't perform well at their max towing capacity, I would be pulling about 60% of that. So I think the power would be adequate. Certainly they use more fuel empty than 1/2 tons, but fuel consumption towing seems to be about the same.
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Old 02-04-2015, 11:32 AM   #77
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Bruce, are you still looking for a trailer, as your status to the left indicates? It is conventional wisdom to find your trailer, then decide on TV. That prevents you from under or over spec'ing your truck...and being wasteful financially or fuel wise.

If you're looking for a 30'er (or even a 25...relatively heavy tongue weight), you're dealing with the same conundrum as I. Whenever I buy my "retirement" truck in the next 3 - 5 years, it will primarily be a dedicated tow vehicle for the duration. That's why I have tried 2500 (gas and diesel), 1500 (5.3L and now a 6.2L), Suburban, Escalade, Yukon XL (all 6 speeds, some 5.3 and some 6.2 old generations)

I am anxious to pull with the 15 Sierra with new gen 6.2 and 8 speed...even though it's a non-MaxTow. I'm still on the fence. I loved the 2500 Duramax I just got out of, but it was sure nice to have the refined feel of the 1500. It feel like a luxury vehicle compared to old body style 2500. HOWEVER, the new 2015 2500 is much quieter (ala the 1500 body refinements), but has the same running gear as the 2014.

I have much weighing and analysis to do.....if you're interested in waiting for that.
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Old 02-04-2015, 12:24 PM   #78
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Rich,

You seem to be the only voice closing in on an optimal TV, one that tows well and rides/drives well when not towing. Everyone else just seems to proclaim their favorite because it is their favorite. Keep us posted...maybe start another thread when you reach a conclusion.
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Old 02-04-2015, 12:35 PM   #79
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No Larry. I have the optimal TV, for me anyway. Don't we all?
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Old 02-04-2015, 12:39 PM   #80
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Thanks, Larry,
I will post about it when the time comes. I'll wait until after the snow is gone (over a foot on the ground and still snowing), I get weighings, and probably after I tow to Key West and back in June (with a week's detour throughout the Smokies).

Optimal is different for varying equipment and lifestyles. All we can do is gather from others' lessons and derive our own needs based on that.
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Old 02-04-2015, 12:44 PM   #81
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Quote:
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Optimal is different for varying equipment and lifestyles. All we can do is gather from others' lessons and derive our own needs based on that.

THAT is what I meant to write. Thanks Rich
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Old 02-04-2015, 12:46 PM   #82
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THAT is what I meant to write. Thanks Rich
I knew that, TOP!
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Old 02-05-2015, 11:55 AM   #83
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I don't know whether the question was directed at me or not, but I do own a new FC 27 front bed twin, which I bought last August. Even though I'm planning to retire this spring and wouldn't be using the trailer until this May. The RV "queen" is two inches shorter than I am tall, but the twin in an Airstream is 2" longer than I am tall. Airstream is discontinuing the twin beds in the longer trailers, and we thought a 25 was too small for two tall people and a big dog for the kind of extended travel we have in mind. So we pounced on this one.
In the half ton world, their are two crew cab trucks that appear to work: the Silverado/GMC with the max trailer tow package and the '15 F-150 with the 7000 GVWR rating (or a '14 with a max trailer tow and max payload package, which requires the Ecoboost engine). Right now Chevy is not building that package except with the 5.3 liter engine and the 6-speed. I've driven that and don't like it. It feels weak. I've driven the '14 F-150 and couldn't stand the seats, unfortunately. I can order a new '15 F-150 for $48,000, a modest discount.
Or, I could get a CPO '14 Ram 2500 Lariat with the 6.4 gas engine for $40,000. New diesels pretty much step you into the $50,000 territory with the leather trim packages, and my wife's brief ride in a new Duramax was highly unsuccessful. I realize the gas engines in these 3/4 tons are pretty "busy" when you ask them to pull full rated capacity. But since I would be loading the truck (cargo and trailer) at about half capacity maybe that wouldn't be so bad. Oddly, reported gas mileage towing doesn't seem much different between 3/4 and 1/2 ton gas trucks, even though the big trucks use more fuel empty than the small ones.
So, that's where I am at the moment. I'm not excited about overloading a 1/2 ton by several hundred pounds, just to buy a truck off the lot. I don't think that's the way a newbie who contemplates long trips should start off.
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Old 02-11-2015, 05:38 PM   #84
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Possibly, I just am not familiar with Canadian distribution. However, I would be REALLY surprised if there were physical suspension (et.al.) differences, resulting in GVWR rating differences in Canada vs. US.

I am wondering if the website isn't clear and the 7200 "max GVWR" on the spec page is for non-MaxTow trucks and the Maxtow axle brings it to 7600". I really need to see a MaxTow truck and My demo door placards to get an answer. You are correct, in that the Dealer order guide is (most of the time) more correct and more detailed than marketing materials, like simplistic web page spec sheets.
Ok, finally got hold of Brian at the dealership ( away on holiday).
The 7600 lb code is C6G and is available on crew and extended, and as he is the fleet manager, he ordered it through fleet so no constraint, but he says there is for regular orders.


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