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Old 06-29-2016, 02:15 PM   #15
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I saw an eight month old AS at the factory that was gutted because of a leak and mould between the walls. It was not a pretty sight! And I doubt the refit would be as well done as the original install. Follow the suggestion to gut your pride and joy and you could end up with other discouraging defects.

I have a new 26U about the same age as yours with a minor defect or two, so I know the angst you are going through. You haven't said if you have any other problems to deal with, so if not and your new AS doesn't LEAK, I'd say you're not too badly off when buying a new AS.

If you're handy....and if not, hire a finishing carpenter to install a beautiful laminate flooring of your choice. Cover that lousy spot and get a great surface that will wear really well. New flooring can go right up to the cabinets, etc, and a bit of trim will finish it off.

Then present the bill to your dealer or move on to AS itself.
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Old 06-29-2016, 02:49 PM   #16
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Lemon laws don't apply to RV's (not that I've ever heard of) and especially trailers (they're not motor vehicles).
But lemon laws almost never work for the consumer anyway.
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Old 06-29-2016, 02:52 PM   #17
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Lemon laws don't apply to RV's (not that I've ever heard of) and especially trailers (they're not motor vehicles).
But lemon laws almost never work for the consumer anyway.
Well, in Florida there is a pet lemon law. If you spend more on a vet bill than the dog cost within a period of time, you get your money back from where you got the pet.

Worked for me. I mean, I got my money back. Ended up spending waaaaaay too much on that dog, but that's a whole other story...
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Old 06-29-2016, 02:55 PM   #18
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Actually the Service/Repair side may very well do a better job than the Assembly Line

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Old 06-29-2016, 03:02 PM   #19
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Stain on your flooring

I would use your new AS while the weather is nice and make notes of all the other things that will need repair, replacement or corrections and send that puppy back to have it all fixed at the same time. Don't be shy about letting Airstream know what needs to be corrected because your warranty is only good for so long and after it's up .... you are out of pocket.
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Old 06-29-2016, 03:06 PM   #20
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Who is the dealer? This is important to other buyers in your area This does not need to concealed.

In any case I would not take the dealers remedy if shipping back as factual or true. Sounds like a cop out to me. There are certainly flooring pros in AZ that AS could retain to remedy.
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Old 06-29-2016, 03:08 PM   #21
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This situation just stinks. There is just no easy resolution for you. It's all a huge problem and they have made it yours. Extremely poor customer service. Sounds like it might even be a deliberate shenanigan. Hope something works out. Can I ask what the flooring is - I'm considering luxury woven vinyl for our 66 Tradewind refurb. Is this your flooring type? If so I might reconsider. Thanks.
It is luxury woven vinyl. It is supposed to be amazing stuff.
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Old 06-29-2016, 04:41 PM   #22
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Although it is terrible, the only way to fix it now is to take it back to the factory and leave it for 2 weeks.
They will remove all the cabinets and furniture, install new flooring, and reinstall the furniture and cabinets.
This would be a grand opportunity to get another flooring type that doesn't get dirty/hold dirt as bad at no extra cost- other than 2 trips to Jackson Center...
They offered me this option, but because I still work I cannot leave the trailer, come home, and go back 2 weeks later to retrieve the trailer.
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Old 06-29-2016, 05:13 PM   #23
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Stain on floor

I would have them haul it to the factory and put in a new floor only to have a loaner for that duration. I would definitely ask for a time frame. They are dependinding on you to say forget it but don't give up. AS last forever.
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Old 06-29-2016, 05:31 PM   #24
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Actually the Service/Repair side may very well do a better job than the Assembly Line



Bob


Yes.
Agreed.
Have experienced this first hand-


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Old 06-29-2016, 08:01 PM   #25
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Sorry, but there ain't NO WAY the service department in Jackson Center would POSSIBLY be able to EVER dismantle that entire interior and put it back without scuffing and banging it up. It's just NOT possible.

The trailers are built utilizing a certain sequence of events to minimize damage to components and to maximize efficiency. In the service department, they aren't going to follow those same procedures. They are going to start unbolting and unscrewing things and carrying them through the door...and they are DEFINITELY only going to remove the minimum amount of stuff they have to in the easiest way possible to maximize efficiency to prevent losses. Time is money. They don't care about that trailer like you do. Nicks and scuffs and scratches are part of the process.

They aren't an expert restoration business that will indulge 100's of hours in rebuilding a masterpiece. They are people busting their asses waiting to go home at 5pm, making probably close to minimum wage. They are working on a schedule to minimize loss. If they take too long fixing something they are going to be reprimanded and told to not waste time (this happened on my trailer). They aren't going to take extra time lifting those cabinets out to be sure they don't rub against the aluminum door frame or bang into something. They are being watched and timed. They are going to be hot, sweating, and breaking their backs to "fix" something...not to restore an entire 30 foot trailer's interior to the most perfect exacting detail (especially in areas you can't readily see).

Don't forget...this is WARRANTY work. They are making NO money repairing your trailer. NONE.

The workers are simply not in a position to be able to REALLY care about your trailer like you do...or to take the time and attention needed to not scuff something when doing a HUGE job like rebuilding an entire interior. They aren't just going to be modifying a table or adding some oversize chairs where a sofa used to be. They are undertaking a HUGE job that has to be done in an AMAZINGLY short time. Corners are going to be cut, things are going to be missed. They simply are NOT going to be able to return the trailer to "perfect" condition due to the inarguable fact that it would take an insurmountable amount of time to do it that way. It's just not possible. The trailer has already been sold and THAT is when it had to "look perfect" from a management point-of-view.

Warranty-wise, the service department only has to perform a REASONABLE attempt of repair, and little nicks and bumps is part of what is REASONABLE when an assembly level service department is rebuilding an ENTIRE TRAILER INTERIOR.

They aren't going to take extra care because it's a Classic. Trust me, they couldn't care LESS if your trailer was $20,000 new or $150,000 new. It's just a trailer to them...hell, it's not even that, it's just something they have to fix at WORK.

You can NOT expect perfection from them, no matter how much you spend. I know from experience.

I USED to think that if you pay a large sum of money for something at a very reputable place (let alone the FACTORY THAT BUILT IT), you would receive quality work without hassle. I assumed the FACTORY would provide that; it wasn't even a THOUGHT in my head that they might NOT do work as good as the craftsmanship that the trailer was originally built with. Hell, that's why I WENT TO THE FACTORY when I needed work done!

I had to PAY for most of the work I had done on my trailer. Sure, warranty work was some of it, but I PAID what was (and is to me) a massive sum of money for what I thought was to be expert service, TRUE perfect quality work. Remember, they MAKE MONEY in the service department for custom work. They charge a ****load. The result SHOULD be perfect.

My point is that is WARRANTY work expects a certain REASONABLE amount of lack of attention to detail. But CUSTOM work that is paid at a SUPER HIGH hourly dollar amount should absolutely be done PERFECTLY. The extra time it takes to do a job PERFECTLY is BILLED to the customer, but even in that instance it STILL does NOT occur. The same lack of attention to detail is the norm whether you pay or have the work performed under warranty.

If they couldn't care less when you PAY, what makes ANYONE think they would do a better job when they are LOSING money on warranty work????

Hell...I WITNESSED a certain job taking not even two hours on my trailer. I watched it from start to finish. TWO hours. I was billed for SIXTEEN HOURS OF LABOR on that job alone!!! This was NOT negotiable once I went to pay my bill. They charged me EIGHT TIMES the time it took to do the work.

I had awnings added, solar added, aluminum interior wall sheeting replaced, some window work, some molding and trim replaced, a new power jack installed among other things such as some custom work. It was NOT a good experience.

I pulled my trailer 1000 miles there and left it, giving them plenty of time (months) to work on it and get it right. I drove 1000 miles home, then months later I returned...another 1000 miles. What awaited me was not good. Not only was it not finished after two months, but what WAS done was jawdropping. This was supposed to be the EXPERTS. The freakin' FACTORY.

The awnings had chewed screwheads and terrible Acryl-R application. The main awning wasn't installed with enough tension on the spring so that it wouldn't roll up without balling up on itself. The solar was actually fine but there's a small dent on the rear end cap. The molding and trim was installed completely crooked with incompetent Acryl-R application all over the place, and the replacement aluminum extrusion was dinged and blemished. Their response was that "it was better than before because it was really crooked when it came in." Yeah, using a ruler is REALLY difficult.

The interior wall that was replaced required several cabinets to be removed to replace it. They simply pulled back the parts they had to and tore chunks of wood veneer out of the corners of the cabinetry to get to the wall in the easiest way possible. They left parts of half-removed aluminum walls hanging, their sharp edges allowed to gouge into the cabinetry that was still left there in the trailer. They messed up re-riveting the brackets for the aluminum blinds to the new wall, so they had to re-do them, leaving holes where the first brackets were. One section of the new aluminum wall currently has a crease in it. They didn't remove the bathroom wall, so they scraped the aluminum sheeting up against it to slide it in place. It does NOT look good. Their response was to use lemon oil on the wood. Regarding all the damaged wood, the response was, "Oh we actually forgot to charge you for that piece of aluminum for the wall" with the inference that we were "even."

Sealant around windows was a COMPLETE joke. Looks like Ray Charles applied it. Trim was installed crooked. The new door seal they applied leaks water at the top.

The toilet had been removed for some work on the bathroom. When it was reinstalled, the seal under the toilet was pinched and come to find out had been pouring fluid into the area around the black tank but not inside the trailer where you could see it. I wouldn't have found it until I saw some fluid dripping out of the outside sewer light one day, years later. Who knows how long it leaked and what damage there is to the floor under the toilet. The seal had been pinched since it was worked on, however. I changed the seal, but the floor (while not soft) DOES creak and flex a LOT in the bathroom. Not good.

There were gouges in my flooring from dropping things on it and stacking cabinetry on it. There is a large (4" or so) long indentation right in the center of my kitchen counter. They replaced a TV mount under warranty but gouged up the wood around it in doing so. When part of the damaged dinged up wood behind the TV could no longer be sourced, they stained another piece of wood the same color but the grain itself is completely different and it doesn't really match. When two of my cabinet doors went missing and were replaced with similar but not matching replacements, I was told the originals weren't available and that they are SUPPOSED to be mismatched because "some cabinets are in the kitchen" while the mismatched ones are "in the bedroom and are supposed to be different." Hmmm...they weren't different when I bought the trailer which my pictures proved. They refused to do anything.

My dealer had tried to re-spray my hitch and did a terrible job; it wasn't even dry and stayed sticky. It was to be repainted supposed "factory original quality" at the factory under warranty. Boy oh boy was it NOT. Overspray everywhere, scratched lines in the aluminum when they tried to remove the overspray with a scouring pad, scratched up LP tank cover from removing it and letting it scrape against the jack...just complete incompetence.

I remember them giving me a hard time about replacing my power jack that stopped working. They finally agreed to do it around the end of the day, and after it was installed I saw some obviously overworked sweating exhausted frowning obese guy coming toward the front of my trailer with some tape and a can of spray paint. He was going to spray paint my newly installed black jack gray to match the hitch. I politely told him to not worry about it...please. I told him I liked it black. Truthfully I just didn't want a horrible cut-corner terrible tape-off 5 minute backwoods peeling and bubbling paintjob on my jack with overspray all over the rest of the front of the trailer. No thanks.

When they installed some wrong parts (even though I myself provided the CORRECT PART NUMBERS) their first resolution was to tell me I was WRONG and that those wrong parts weren't in fact wrong. The service manager got upset with me...REALLY upset...REALLY upset...when I addressed the questionable quality of the work and the problems I was seeing. He told me (really, he yelled) that I "expected too much" and that they could just patch up the holes they put in my trailer with aluminum and leave it at that (they weren't finished at that point). Expecting work to be performed properly without damaging the trailer while being billed SEVERAL MORE HOURS than it actually took is "EXPECTING TOO MUCH"???!?!?!?!!!???

I lost it. Not only had my trailer been there for months, but I myself had been there for about a week waiting for them to finish what they messed up. From the point of first contact, I had been nice and calm and controlled...smiling and helping understand their points of view. But now, I LOST IT. I thought of the TEN THOUSAND DOLLARS I was paying and the obvious indifference to the issues I was addressing with the quality and obvious errors (not to mention damage) that I was pointing out. When I was told that was the "best they can do" and the manager got all pissy and arrogant with me, I starting ripping him a new one in the service department in front of everyone. Usually that doesn't work. I don't advise it. This time, it worked.

I hit my breaking point...but I was driven to it. You can NEVER get things done with being aggressive and rude. I tried that...for DAYS. It wasn't working. When I was basically DEMANDED to take my trailer the way it was and pay up, all gloves were off. I SCREAMED about the amount I was charged, and lit off one by one in quick successive fashion WHY the work was sub-par. The entire service department just kinda stood and stared. The customers were in disbelief...but some of the incompetence was obvious to the naked eye by ANYONE looking at the trailer. I had had enough.

I contacted his superior and the next morning even before I got to the factory they had my trailer taken apart and were trying to correct everything they f'd up. Most of it they fixed, but alot of it they didn't. I ended up having a 200 mile away "local" dealer repair what the factory...THE FACTORY...couldn't or didn't. I paid for THAT, too. Some things, like the scratches, dings, scuffs, and chips, I have to live with.

In the end, Airstream apologized and I did to. I paid my 10 THOUSAND DOLLARS and left.

I'll NEVER go back.






















In other words, don't EVER let them rebuild your trailer down to the floor in the service department and expect it to be perfect. It's NOT going to happen.
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Old 06-29-2016, 08:15 PM   #26
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No disrespect intended here, but between your flaming avatar and your flaming approach in these threads, if I were Airstream, I'd honestly pay you not to be my customer.

Just pause for a second and re-read that napalm note you wrote there. This may surprise you but with more of a level head, you might have cut that bill to zero and had any perceived flaws corrected. That approach will cost you not only dollars but the stress on your heart can't possibly be good.

And before you aim the flame thrower at me, you're absolutely right, I'm a jerk, this is none of my business, etc...

But I offer the reflection for your benefit and the benefit of others who might be tempted to follow your lead. Do with it what you like.

Good luck and happy camping.
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Old 06-29-2016, 08:24 PM   #27
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So about 3 weeks ago I purchased a 2016 Classic form a local dealer. While looking over the unit at the dealership I saw a stain about the size of a softball below the sink on the flooring in the walkway. I told the salesperson about it and they assured me it would come out during the pre delivery detail.

At delivery I was told it would not come out but they needed me to bring it in the next week or so and they would get it out then. Apparently they didn't have enough time to get out the stain.

Today I went to pick up at dealer and was told it wouldn't come out. I believe it is glue. It's yellow as well. Anyway, now they are saying "if it really bothers you we will have to have Airstream haul it to the factory and remove all the furniture and cabinets and replace the entire floor". It angers me to hear someone minimize the issue. As if I should accept a flaw as big as this and move on.

It seems I bought the dealers problem here. Instead of them dealing with this nightmare, I bought it and now have to wait to get it fixed. Sucks.

Any advice here?

Sorry to hear about this. I would offer the following advice based on my experience.

I would let the dealer know you want to know from him or Airstream directly what they will do to address the problem. I would follow up in writing with AS so they are officially on notice that you have a warranty claim. Even if you can't get the trailer to AS until much later, having the warranty item noted during the warranty period gives you some protection. I say this because on the door I just had installed at the factory, actual road driving in heavy rain identified a leak they did not identify under shower simulators at the factory. When I called the service manager he was very apologetic and asked if I could get it back to him. I told him I probably couldn't for at least another year. His response - no problem, we've got it tracked so it's a warranty item - come in when you can - and, he added, I want you to get what you paid for.

Mistakes happen. In my experience (clearly different than some) I think AS genuinely wants to make it right.

Do you have pics of the floor?

Good luck.
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Old 06-29-2016, 08:25 PM   #28
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No disrespect intended here, but between your flaming avatar and your flaming approach in these threads, if I were Airstream, I'd honestly pay you not to be my customer.

Just pause for a second and re-read that napalm note you wrote there. This may surprise you but with more of a level head, you might have cut that bill to zero and had any perceived flaws corrected. That approach will cost you not only dollars but the stress on your heart can't possibly be good.

And before you aim the flame thrower at me, you're absolutely right, I'm a jerk, this is none of my business, etc...

But I offer the reflection for your benefit and the benefit of others who might be tempted to follow your lead. Do with it what you like.

Good luck and happy camping.
You're not a jerk, and I agree with you regarding staying level-headed. I indicated that in my post.

I was level-headed for months. After a week, I wasn't getting anywhere. Excuses were given, mistakes were being made, and poor workmanship was being performed on this trailer that I saved up for for decades and was going to have to live with for the rest of my life.

But...you're leaving out the most important aspect: it was the service manager who blew up at ME when I pointed out they installed the WRONG items that I paid for on my trailer (and gave them the correct part numbers for). That's what caused me to lose it.

And, the point of the story is that my losing it IN RESPONSE to the service manager BLOWING UP AT ME is what GOT the factory to take notice and fix the trailer properly (to the best of their ability, which is ultimately what this discussion is about).

The service manager was reprimanded, Dave Schumann contacted me and set those working on my trailer straight.

While I agree that keeping your cool IS the proper way to do ANYTHING...in THIS instance, losing it is WHAT GOT THE JOB DONE in the end.

Bending over and taking it wasn't accomplishing anything. In the end (no pun intended), the ONLY thing that accomplished anything was standing my ground.

Of course...that probably wouldn't have happened if the service manager hadn't gotten aggressive with me. Last I heard, he no longer has that position...for the exact reason I described above. Turns out it wasn't his first instance of disrespecting a customer.
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