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Old 09-23-2014, 04:24 AM   #1
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What type of insulation ?

Hi,

Perhaps I'm bad to look for topic about the insulation but I haven't found answer for my question on others threads... I hope you can answer me...

I'm looking for a good insulation for my Overlander's restoration.

I wish to use my trailer mainly during the summer but I'm lost about few differents types of insulation : glass wool, rock wool... ? but what is the thickness of original insulation ? 1"1/4 ?

What can you advise me ?

Thank you so much !
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Old 09-23-2014, 06:53 AM   #2
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If you're looking to maximize your insulation, the best on the market is Prodex, a specific brand of foil-faced polyisocyanurate foam, with an R-value of 7.2 per inch of thickness. It comes in 5mm and 10mm thicknesses, and is flexible to fit your curved walls. You should have room inside your walls for multiple layers of Prodex, but that's a very expensive proposition.

Closed-cell spray foam has an R-value of 6.5 per inch of thickness, and thus is the second-most efficient type of insulation. It should be less expensive than Prodex as well.

For comparison, fiberglass batt has an R-value of 3.14 per inch; same with mineral wool. Polystyrene board has an R-value of 4.0 per inch of thickness.

But if you're really looking to insulate, in addion to insulating the walls, add a thermal barrier to the windows, in the form of low-emissivity film. To retain heat, the film should be on the inside of the windows. To repel heat in summer, the film should be on the outside. There's no reason why you couldn't put film on both outside and inside of your windows for all-season minimization of heat transfer.
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Old 09-23-2014, 07:13 AM   #3
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I have used Gila window film in several application. It is my understanding the heat/uv/glare blocking properties are the same no matter which side of the glass the film is mounted.

The only issue for films can occur in thermopane windows where reflecting back into the space between the windows as when the film is on the inside, may create too much heat in the window creating a potential failure problem.

If links are permissibleÖ.some data from Gila
http://www.gilafilms.com/pdf/Residen...wFilmSpecs.pdf
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Old 09-23-2014, 01:51 PM   #4
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I'm at the same place in renovation, let me know what you decide.
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Old 09-23-2014, 03:04 PM   #5
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I just finished insulating my trailer; went through a long time trying to decide on what I was going to use and how I was going to do it, here was my thought process on options:
Spray foam: can't really be used, it would be really nice if it could but it would make it nearly impossible to work with the wiring between the skins and make future repairs to skins very difficult.
Fiberglass: the original stuff, it's tough to find in the 1 1/2" thickness for fitting inside the walls, if you compress thicker insulation to fit in the wall, you significantly reduce it's insulating value, it retains moisture from any leaks and can support mold/mildew growth and mice/pests like it. I'm sure it goes in quickly at the factory though.
Rock/Mineral wool: much better than fiberglass, doesn't retain water and doesn't support mold/mildew growth, pests don't like it. It's too still though, it's not like fiberglass, the bats you can buy are like soft boards and actually get cut with a saw, making it impractical to use inside the walls, also not available in 1.5" thick
Prodex: Doesn't retain water and doesn't support mold/mildew.Most of the heat gain/loss from the trailer is via radiation, sun heats the outer skin, outer skin gets hot and radiates that heat inward where it's cooler, prodex reflects that radiation back out. Some conduction through rib's from outer skin to interior skin, but minor portion of the heat transfer. There's a catch, there needs to be an airspace between the skin and the prodex for it to work effectively. To accomplish this I used a 4'x8' 1/2" thick sheet of rigid foam insulation and then cut it into 1"x1" blocks (used the whole sheet so 4600+ little blocks) and then adhered these to the inside of the exterior skin, then cut sheets of prodex from the spool to fit snugly in the area between the ribs in that area and put the prodex on the inside of the spacers. Then I cut a second layer of prodex and put spacers between the first layer and second layer. So I ended up with exterior skin/foam spacer(and air gap where foam wasn't)/prodex layer/foam spacer/prodex/interior skin. I ran the wiring between the layers of prodex to protect it from the heat and hot exterior skin. Where it needed to come through the prodex to the interior I cut a slit in the interior prodex layer and pulled it through the slit.
I did figure out why they don't do this at the factory though; TIME, it takes a lot of time to cut all the different pieces, put up the foam and let it set before putting prodex over it.... but it's definitely noticeable in the difference in how hot it gets in the sun. Plus I was doing all the cutting from the tailgate of my truck.
This was long. I'll try to get some pictures from my phone.
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Old 09-23-2014, 04:03 PM   #6
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Insulation

Hi G,
I purchased rolls of insulation from Lowes for my 76 Safari project. I glued together panels that remind me of ice cream sandwiches. 3/4" Expanded Polystyrene Foam Boards were ripped on the table saw in 1 1/2" widths. Then glued in between sheets of Reflectix radiant barrier. Leftover strips of the Reflectix were cut into strips and glued to the outside of the panel to keep it away from the outside wall. I taped the panels to the ribs, using Tyvek tape so that there was much less air infiltration. I'm sure there's a better tape. I was lazy and in a rush. Seems to work. Heat transferred through the ribs from a little space heater as seen in the "snow" picture. There are threads discussing the use of a ceramic tape on the rib to reduce heat transfer, but I decided to put the interior skins back on, hoping the Tyvek would lower the heat transfer.
I used Prodex on a 1961 AS project. It works well. It's rips more easily. But, once in the walls, I don't think it's an issue. I'm starting a redo on a 1962 AS and may look into the use of ceramic tape on the ribs.
The threads on airforums.com helped me come up with this method. Thanks to all of those who went before me using this method in insulating their AS's!
It works well in the sun, in the summer, with one Fantastic fan working. When the fan is off, it is hotter inside...
Best of luck! Chris
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Old 09-25-2014, 09:20 AM   #7
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Hi,

Thank you for the quickly replies

I've heard that the Prodex must be changed each 10 years, this insulation is very good but it can't work correctly with the humidity.
The great advantage is the thickness of it.

The fiberglass (and not fiberwool, sorry) or the rockwool work very well with the humidity but only 1''1/2 of thickness can insulate correctly the trailer, right ?

When I've removed the original insulation, it was the fiberglass but in 1960, I think to find a better insulation like the rock wool who resist very well to the fire and works very good with the humidity than the 1960...

I'm sure for one thing is it's very important to have a good temperature inside the trailer to avoid condensation.

In France, we can find easily 1''1/2 (45mm) of fiberwool or rockwool.

I'm looking for more informations, as well, I'll let you know what I'll decide to do.
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Old 09-27-2014, 08:34 AM   #8
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10 years

Yikes! GaŽl, I have not heard that it's not good after 10 years. I have read that Prodex gives you a 10 year warranty. I have to do more research! Chris
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Old 10-05-2014, 08:08 AM   #9
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Hey Chris--
NICE insulation--
I'm working on a 1978 23' Safari (my first) that had some jacked-up rework done on the aft end of the steel trailer. I've got the trailer out and getting it ready to go for sandblast and paint but was wondering what it was supposed to look like in the first place? Was hoping since you did one of these maybe you have some pics?

I will post the pics in the floor and frame frame thread.

Tim
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Old 10-05-2014, 10:04 AM   #10
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When I renovated my 64 safari, I used Johns Johns Manville (no formaldehyde) fiber glass and Prodex. I had to split the fiberglass in half to get the 1-1/2" thickness, then a layer of Prodex with foil taped seams, then my wiring and a second layer of Prodex on the top panels. The fiberglass split pretty easy, however it was a pain doing it. Use gloves and baby powder on your arms to keep it out of your pores. We have been very happy with it from Death Valley heat to 7000 foot elevation snow, wind and ice. G, I have not heard of anyone having to replace prodex every 10 years. I think that is the warranty period and in our applications it should last for many more years. I do know it works very well. Good luck to you on your project.
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Old 10-21-2014, 02:39 PM   #11
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Insulation/First Post Ever!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Protagonist View Post
If you're looking to maximize your insulation, the best on the market is Prodex, a specific brand of foil-faced polyisocyanurate foam, with an R-value of 7.2 per inch of thickness. It comes in 5mm and 10mm thicknesses, and is flexible to fit your curved walls. You should have room inside your walls for multiple layers of Prodex, but that's a very expensive proposition.
I found this article Stay Away from Foil-Faced Bubble Wrap | GreenBuildingAdvisor.com

...about the misleading nature of the R values. I found some R-19 unfaced attic insulation on CL for cheap. If I used a foil material on both sides and created the air barrier against the exterior wall, would that be enough? I plan on using it year round.

Thanks!
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Old 10-21-2014, 11:46 PM   #12
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Thank you for your opinions !

I'm reading the article today or tomorrow, it seems be very interesting...

At the moment, it the more difficult question I have in my mind...

I'm interested about the rockwool too because it's a non-flammable.

We keep in touch...!
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Old 10-22-2014, 12:01 AM   #13
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I have seen some of the same comments on 1/4" foil backed insulation (doesn't seem to really have a significant impact on the R value whether the material between the foil is close cell foam, fiberglass, or plastic bubble. It's only 1/4" with an R value of about 1).

Seems to me use the right material for the right purpose: fiberglass for insulation, plastic for vapor barrier, and foil for conductive. Rather that one product for all purposes
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Old 10-22-2014, 06:29 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AleyaJean View Post
You may not have noticed, but I did not include Reflectix (foil-faced bubble wrap) in my list. Every type of insulation I listed an R-value for actually IS insulation. Reflectix is good for a car windshield cover to reflect heat back out of the car, but it's not insulation.
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