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Old 02-08-2010, 08:52 PM   #43
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bwaysteve -

Hang in there -- it's much more fun when you get to the rebuild stage.

Gutter Seal? Check this page:
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I'm having dreams that involve sanding,tung oil,sanding,tung oil,sanding etc.This Honduras Mahogany is going to be beautiful!
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Old 02-19-2010, 11:02 PM   #44
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Today was a good day!I have a blank canvas at last.On the way to bare aluminum pulling out the insulation I found not one mouse trailing or insect home.The PO must have kept this 65 in his livingroom!
The end panels were a breeze and the HW heater and furnace were came out without any trouble.
I did find some rust and a 1 in. rusted hole on one of the wheel wells.
I am now moving on as soon as I make the decision to do or not to do shell off.
After talking with a few guys a the TexasVintage Rally it's not that big a deal.(provided I can get it back on) Someone suggested putting 4 guide pins in the frame before removing to make getting back together easier.
I am stripping my heat panels and will reinstall(thinking of powder coat silver).
Planning to go with a catalytic heater and will not replace furnace,but leave ducts for the next owner down the line or if I decide I need more heat.(whichever comes first).
I still have exterior stripping to do and wondering if it would be better to do before seam sealing interior and exterior.
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Old 02-20-2010, 02:50 PM   #45
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That looks big inside now, doesn't it? You're making some good progress there.
The hole in the wheel well and the rust leads me to think it should be replaced. Unless your sink was over the wheel well that water came from your tires. In any case the wheel well does considerable work when your tire blows out. My curbside wheel well was pushed up about 2" by a blowout, which caused some damage to the cabinet interior and pushed the whole sink and oven cabinet up enough to release the screws that held it to the floor. Weak metal there could have allowed the tire tread to come up into the cabinet itself, which would have been a total loss of the cabinet, oven, and possibly the furnace.
I considered doing mine with the shell removed too, but logistics make it near impossible for me here. I just don't have the room or the "fairly level" area needed. What also played into my decision was the fact that I don't have the tools or compressor to drive a buck riveter. In looking at the exterior rivets I found that the ones that go through the shell and C-channel also go through the belly pan(but not all of them do since the bellypan went on first) This is where the dreaded "hidden rivets" are found. What I'm getting at here is that the shell has to be removed from the C-channel and bellypan to be lifted off, which I really didn't want to do. So with some careful inspecting and a little innovation, I found that it was possible to get to all of the frame for de-rusting and repainting. The thing that made it possible for mine was the way the bellypan was made. It is 3 pieces,one on each side about 24" wide, that creates the curved part of the bellypan that comes up to the walls, and another wide piece that goes down the middle of the frame. I dropped the middle piece, and the side piece rivets into the outriggers were drilled out, but not the ones that go into the C-channel. The side pieces then sagged down away from the outriggers and frame, allowing me to get to the outriggers for repairing them, and I didn't drill out any bucked rivets, just pop rivets.
The floor removal and reinstallation was more difficult then if the shell had been off the frame. Any old fool could tell that would be the case. The difference is that I never had to lift, move, and secure my shell while I worked on the frame and floor. I never had to remove the bucked rivets that hold the shell, C-channel, and bellypan together, I never had to re-align all of these pieces to reassemble the trailer or get a person to help buck rivets. I kept the $350 to $500 I would have spent on a compressor and riveter in my pocket, and I didn't need to enlist help to do any of it..
"After talking with a few guys a the TexasVintage Rally it's not that big a deal.(provided I can get it back on)" The part in parenthesis is the important part, and the subject of many rants and the cause of much cussing and cursing. Of course, if and when it does go back on, there is such relief and happiness that perhaps it makes the stress of it all worthwhile. I just don't know!
Even doing a shell-on floor replacement, you still need to keep things alligned as they were. When the bolts that hold the outrigger ends to the C-channel are cut the walls can bow outwards and you can lose your alignment. I measured the distance between the walls at floor level all the way from front to back to be sure that they went back together the same way. That also helped me to check the sizes of my plywood for the floor, as the C-channel is 1-1/2" wide, I added 3" to the distance between the walls and found that the original plywood was about 1" too narrow. Some of the bolts that went through the C-channel into the outriggers actually missed the edge of the plywood or were half-way into it. I cut my new plywood flooring just 1/4" undersize and was able to hit it with all of the bolts when I put it together.
In the corners I did a similar thing. Before I removed the floor I made a template of the inside of each corner, following the C-channel, with the interior panels removed. When I cut the new floor I used these pieces as templates by tracing a line 1-3/8" beyond the edge of the template, onto the flooring.
To follow the actual wall, rather than the old floor, made mine a much better fit than the original and allowed me to reconstruct the parts that were completely rotted away without resorting to guesswork.
Keep in mind that this is all opinoin-based information from a person with limited experience, and someone who swears by doing it differently may come along and say shell-off is the only way to go, but there is almost always more than one way to go, and knowing what makes one better or worse is in the details.

Good luck with your project.

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Old 02-20-2010, 05:20 PM   #46
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It looks gigantic!Maybe I could weld two 65's together!
Thanks Viking for your imput.I gather when the pan was unrivited, the perimeter hung like a skirt.
So when you jacked the shell up the only rivets loose were on the bottom perimeter of the pan? The next pics show how my pan is riveted Seam down center and full piece past axles.
Were you able to use elevator bolts throughout?I will replace the wheelwell as it has a 1"rusted hole.
Did you leave a bit of ply under the channel so it did not sag when removing floor?
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Old 02-20-2010, 05:53 PM   #47
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Good work Steve. We are on the edge of our seats awaiting your renovation!

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Old 02-20-2010, 06:44 PM   #48
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Great looking work. Before you toss the old water heater, save the outer shroud. I tossed mine from my 68 TW. Later discovered the hole in the trailer was somewhat larger than the new 10 Gal. Atwood. Not sure if I could have made it work but now I have no choice but to make and rivet a new panel in place to fill the hole before I can install my new water heater.
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Old 02-20-2010, 09:28 PM   #49
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Thanks TWind,
Saved all pieces but having trouble with the 2 in. piece on the tank. I will probably take to a machine shop to remove as they have such marvelous tools there!
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Old 02-20-2010, 10:18 PM   #50
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The pan does hang from the shell when you remove all of the lower fasteners.
I did use elevator bolts everywhere. some were hard to get to but all were possible.
When I removed the old floor I cut some little pieces from it to slip under the C-channel to maintain the spacing there. When I went to wire-brush the ends of the outriggers I found that these were in the way, so I put a jack inside the middle of the trailer with some blocking going up to the ceiling and a horizontal 2x4 at the top to distribute the weight, and lifted the shell up, slipped the plywood pieces out and did the work on the outriggers with it supported this way. I kept it this way until I put the new flooring in.
With the floor out I was able to see how I could add a tank into the frame, just aft of the axle, for a grey tank, which we didn't have originally. There's room for a 35 gallon tank and no frame modifications are necessary. Just some added rails to hold the tank up. I found a perfect tank on www.incaplastics.com Your frame may be different than mine, but with careful measuring you can find one that fits.
Keep up the good work. It won't be long before you find yourself switching from disassembly to reassembly. A good time for a celebration, like Spring coming after Winter. Enjoy the process.

Rich the Viking


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Originally Posted by bwaysteve View Post
It looks gigantic!Maybe I could weld two 65's together!
Thanks Viking for your imput.I gather when the pan was unrivited, the perimeter hung like a skirt.
So when you jacked the shell up the only rivets loose were on the bottom perimeter of the pan? The next pics show how my pan is riveted Seam down center and full piece past axles.
Were you able to use elevator bolts throughout?I will replace the wheelwell as it has a 1"rusted hole.
Did you leave a bit of ply under the channel so it did not sag when removing floor?
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Old 02-21-2010, 10:27 PM   #51
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Wow! Awesome progress! Very nice :-)
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Old 02-22-2010, 08:27 PM   #52
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I am loving this project..... Can not wait too see what happens next.. Thanks for sharing...
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Old 02-22-2010, 09:51 PM   #53
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Thanks Everyone for the encouragement!
This is a long process that is so much easier knowing others have experienced a light at the end of the tunnel.Snow tomorrow AGAIN! When it hits 45 floor is coming out!
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Old 02-22-2010, 10:04 PM   #54
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This is a long process that is so much easier knowing others have experienced a light at the end of the tunnel..
Watch out for trains
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Old 02-23-2010, 08:45 PM   #55
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Staying vintage

Steve,
Making great progress, if my interior looked 1/2 as nice as yours I probably would have stayed vintage. I do like the look of the dark wood.

You have me on the birds, no bird skeletons. I did have some mice and plenty of droppings and was happy to remove the insulation.
Regards,
Russ
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Old 02-26-2010, 04:37 PM   #56
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Watching paint dry

Worked on the bellypan yesterday but got cold so I started on the floor.1.5 in. hole bit with pilot removed.
Looks like prairie dog town.I was able to pry the center sheet up for a looksee.It appears a butt joint and they used 1/4 in ply underneath the joints with staples.I will probably rout a lap joint and glue or get fancy and do a couple of 8 in dove tail joints laid in glued and sanded from the top.(woodworker skills)
I know this must be like watching paint dry but maybe someone will get something out of the pics.
The insulation so far looks good however a lot of dry rot not apparent in a few places.
This would be a hint to those who have a few bad spot they just want to patch.There is usually more you can't see.
I removed the International script, International Flags, and the Ambassador marque and took to the plating guy Melody Ranch suggested(6wk. backlog) but he's good!
I filled the holes temporarily with Parbond.
I also for where my window leak is coming from.A screw hole near the air conditioner 7 ft. away.These things travel don't they.It's nice to be able to find all leaks with bare aluminum inside.
To be continued......

Thanks to Rich Viking,Siverleeper,and Ambie64, for helping me get this far.
Nice weather tomorrow and attack the pan.
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