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Old 02-18-2007, 04:42 PM   #15
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Malcolm:

PL 300 is made by HENKEL, a very large chemical company out of Ohio.

It's sold at every HOME DEPOT store (and everywhere else) in Canada so it should be available at your big box stores too.

About $4 or $5 a caulking-gun tube.

Contractors use it to glue all types of foam board to pretty wel anything.

I used it while insulating the trailer.

I don't know why I didn't add a layer of bubble foil to the wheel wells. I have lots of it left over from insulating the walls.

Maybe I'll lift the top off and add a layer. It's only a few screws and rivets.


Sergei
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Old 02-19-2007, 07:05 AM   #16
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Hi Malcom; 3M 5200 is available in any boat store. It is a permanent adhesive sealant. It is watertight bonds just about to anything. Fast Cure cures in 24 hours. It is a one part polyurethane but it is not recommended for bonding windows. Try 3M Marine Products. Thanks "Boatdoc".
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Old 02-19-2007, 09:46 AM   #17
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foam

hi all- interesting thread, I have to do something along these lines next summer. Tell me again please, what are the drawbacks to completely covering the underside of the plywood with foam sheets- filling the entire space between the ribs/joists? And then covering that with foil-bubble, both for added r-value, and protection/containment of the foam? Just thinking out loud here, wanting the best durable r-value as a lot of cold seems to come from the floor. Does the foam NOT create the desireable air-space for the foil? Thanks- tim
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Old 02-19-2007, 10:00 AM   #18
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Malcolm, I traced all of the wire in the camper and posted it in my Full Monty thread, in case you need it. I suspect that my 27' and your 31' use the same wiring bundle: http://www.airforums.com/forum...7-post360.html

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Old 02-19-2007, 07:33 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tphan
hi all- interesting thread, I have to do something along these lines next summer. Tell me again please, what are the drawbacks to completely covering the underside of the plywood with foam sheets- filling the entire space between the ribs/joists? And then covering that with foil-bubble, both for added r-value, and protection/containment of the foam? Just thinking out loud here, wanting the best durable r-value as a lot of cold seems to come from the floor. Does the foam NOT create the desireable air-space for the foil? Thanks- tim
I think that an air gap next to the foil is what helps the foil do the best job. Foam right next to the foil might not be as good as air next to the foil as far as blocking the flow of radiant energy. It is also my belief that if you put a layer of foil below the bottom of your floor by an inch or two that you don't really need the foam too. For that matter it seems to me that you could use the foam by itself and not really need the foil. The foam board that I have seem at Home Depot and Lowes has a plastic vapor barrier on it that might be enough protection. I have also seen some polyisocyanurate foam (at Home Depot I think) That has a foil skin on it.

Personally I would put just the foil under the floor and figure out some way to suspend it a bit below the bottom of the floor such as suggested above using something like strips of foam around the edges of each cavity.

Malcolm
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Old 02-19-2007, 07:45 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim & Susan
Malcolm, I traced all of the wire in the camper and posted it in my Full Monty thread, in case you need it. I suspect that my 27' and your 31' use the same wiring bundle: http://www.airforums.com/forum...7-post360.html

Jim
Thanks for the tip. It does look like it might be different than mine, though, at least some. I see in my service manual that the 27 wiring schematic is about the same as a rear bath 31'. Mine is a side bath 31'. Is your 27' indeed a rear bath model?

Thanks,

Malcolm
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Old 02-19-2007, 07:49 PM   #21
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Down the middle of the ceiling...

I see that I did forget to mention that I have not done anything with insulation down the center part of the ceiling. I thought I would wait until I get all of my wires all sorted out and tucked back into place before I add insulation up there. I am also thinking about what I might want to do differently with lighting down the center. It might be nice to install small halogen lights down the middle. I have replaced all 3 of my fan/lights with Fantastic fans which do not have lights on them so I need to do something different. I have also wondered if it might make sense to do something with 12volt rope lighting.

Anyone have thoughts on this?

Thanks,

Malcolm
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Old 02-27-2007, 09:56 PM   #22
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Red felt as a thermal break?

I was able to put in some time working on my AS yesterday. I put part of the streetside inner skins back in place. There are 3 rows high on each side with the bottom part coming up to the bottom of the windows, the middle part basically between the windows and the upper part going from above the windows over to the side of the center channel area. I put in the two rows that end at the top of the window.

One of the things that I decided to try was to find something that I could use as a thermal break between the aluminum of the inner skin and the aluminum of the body ribs. I explored various alternatives and finally settled on using strips of regular craft felt. I was able to buy polyester craft felt at a yardage store. The material comes 72" wide. The regular price was $4.99 per yard but I had a 40% off coupon and ended up- buying two yards for $5.99 (no sales tax here in Oregon). For some reason the red felt looked a little thicker to me - or was it just that I liked the color? It looks like that will be enough to cover all of the body ribs. I cut it into strips about 1" wide using my wifes rotary cutter which really works great for the purpose. I then glued the strips on with a thin bead of the same construction adhesive that I was using to attach the foam strips as mentioned above. My initial concern was that it might be hard to find the attachment holes with them all covered up by the felt. That actually did not turn out to be a problem for the two rows that I installed. Once I had a panel located with a couple of screws at the ends I was easily able to find rivet holes with an awl.

I don't know for sure how good of a job the felt will do as a thermal break but my thought was that something was a lot better than nothing. Also I did not want to use something that was too thick and/or too sqaushy.

One thing I remembered to do before putting the skins back on was to take some photographs of what things looked like under the skin. Actually the red felt helps highlight in the photo where the ribs are. I will attach a representative photo below. I think that I may have take this particular photo before I had all of the felt in place. There is a place that looks like it should have some and doesn't.

I started to try re-installing the third row but had to give up for the time being. I have to think about how best to proceed. This piece is about 22' long and maybe 3' wide. It is also much harder to align with the mounting holes than the others. The bottom row and center row was pretty easy with just a little help from my wife to hold one end in place while I attached the other end. Not so with this third row piece! It has to bend more to fit the curve and needs to be held in place above our heads. When we gave it a try I was having trouble finding alignment holes visually through the felt so that I could get things started. I am contemplating needing to cut the panel into 2 or 3 pieces just so that it is light enough to deal with. I can visualize how to splice them back together in places that will be behind cabinets so maybe that will be worth a try.

Anyone have any tricks on how to re-attach that panel?

Malcolm
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Old 02-28-2007, 06:18 AM   #23
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make a couple of T racks out of scrap 2x4's cut one the height you need and another the width, nail or screw them together.

Thats the way sheet rock is done.


Also insulate that access door, just glue a piece of foil to it.
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Old 02-28-2007, 10:33 AM   #24
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Malcolm,

We had to knock together a kind of scaffold to get the long, wavy 22í centre panel re-installed in the ceiling. It didnít take long to make or do.

Like Bob says, they use similar methods to get drywall up.

You will probably need 3 or 4 braces but with this method you and your wife should be able to get the panel up.

Itís better than cutting. If you cut youíll have to overlap and then be short. It will look better too.


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Old 02-28-2007, 10:50 AM   #25
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I used a T to put the ceiling panel back in my '59. It's a little awkward working alone but you can do it.

If your ceiling panel is as wide as mine, be sure you lay some 2x4s on the floor to protect your toes in case the sheet slides off. The edge of the sheet could slice right through your foot!
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Old 02-28-2007, 11:12 AM   #26
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bit off the main topic but

Markdoane,

a little bit off the main topic but can you explain the difference between an "attached image" and an "attached thumbnail" please?

Sergei
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Old 02-28-2007, 11:23 AM   #27
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Markdoane,

a little bit off the main topic but can you explain the difference between an "attached image" and an "attached thumbnail" please?

Sergei
Yeah. The forum software is screwy. Beyond that I dj e hssye skmmau owg?
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Old 02-28-2007, 11:49 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markdoane
I used a T to put the ceiling panel back in my '59. It's a little awkward working alone but you can do it.

If your ceiling panel is as wide as mine, be sure you lay some 2x4s on the floor to protect your toes in case the sheet slides off. The edge of the sheet could slice right through your foot!
You really do have a large top panel! Your might be easier in some ways though because of the natural droop caused by lifting it in the center.

Malcolm
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