Foil insulation - observations, tips and tricks

[malconium]

I see that I did forget to mention that I have not done anything with insulation down the center part of the ceiling. I thought I would wait until I get all of my wires all sorted out and tucked back into place before I add insulation up there. I am also thinking about what I might want to do differently with lighting down the center. It might be nice to install small halogen lights down the middle. I have replaced all 3 of my fan/lights with Fantastic fans which do not have lights on them so I need to do something different. I have also wondered if it might make sense to do something with 12volt rope lighting.

Anyone have thoughts on this?

Thanks,

Malcolm

[malconium]

I was able to put in some time working on my AS yesterday. I put part of the streetside inner skins back in place. There are 3 rows high on each side with the bottom part coming up to the bottom of the windows, the middle part basically between the windows and the upper part going from above the windows over to the side of the center channel area. I put in the two rows that end at the top of the window.

One of the things that I decided to try was to find something that I could use as a thermal break between the aluminum of the inner skin and the aluminum of the body ribs. I explored various alternatives and finally settled on using strips of regular craft felt. I was able to buy polyester craft felt at a yardage store. The material comes 72" wide. The regular price was $4.99 per yard but I had a 40% off coupon and ended up- buying two yards for $5.99 (no sales tax here in Oregon). For some reason the red felt looked a little thicker to me - or was it just that I liked the color? It looks like that will be enough to cover all of the body ribs. I cut it into strips about 1" wide using my wifes rotary cutter which really works great for the purpose. I then glued the strips on with a thin bead of the same construction adhesive that I was using to attach the foam strips as mentioned above. My initial concern was that it might be hard to find the attachment holes with them all covered up by the felt. That actually did not turn out to be a problem for the two rows that I installed. Once I had a panel located with a couple of screws at the ends I was easily able to find rivet holes with an awl.

I don't know for sure how good of a job the felt will do as a thermal break but my thought was that something was a lot better than nothing. Also I did not want to use something that was too thick and/or too sqaushy.

One thing I remembered to do before putting the skins back on was to take some photographs of what things looked like under the skin. Actually the red felt helps highlight in the photo where the ribs are. I will attach a representative photo below. I think that I may have take this particular photo before I had all of the felt in place. There is a place that looks like it should have some and doesn't.

I started to try re-installing the third row but had to give up for the time being. I have to think about how best to proceed. This piece is about 22' long and maybe 3' wide. It is also much harder to align with the mounting holes than the others. The bottom row and center row was pretty easy with just a little help from my wife to hold one end in place while I attached the other end. Not so with this third row piece! It has to bend more to fit the curve and needs to be held in place above our heads. When we gave it a try I was having trouble finding alignment holes visually through the felt so that I could get things started. I am contemplating needing to cut the panel into 2 or 3 pieces just so that it is light enough to deal with. I can visualize how to splice them back together in places that will be behind cabinets so maybe that will be worth a try.

Anyone have any tricks on how to re-attach that panel?

Malcolm

[LI Pets]

make a couple of T racks out of scrap 2x4's cut one the height you need and another the width, nail or screw them together.

Thats the way sheet rock is done.


Also insulate that access door, just glue a piece of foil to it.

[SmokelessJoe]

Malcolm,

We had to knock together a kind of scaffold to get the long, wavy 22’ centre panel re-installed in the ceiling. It didn’t take long to make or do.

Like Bob says, they use similar methods to get drywall up.

You will probably need 3 or 4 braces but with this method you and your wife should be able to get the panel up.

It’s better than cutting. If you cut you’ll have to overlap and then be short. It will look better too.


Sergei

[markdoane]

I used a T to put the ceiling panel back in my '59. It's a little awkward working alone but you can do it.

If your ceiling panel is as wide as mine, be sure you lay some 2x4s on the floor to protect your toes in case the sheet slides off. The edge of the sheet could slice right through your foot!

[SmokelessJoe]

Markdoane,

a little bit off the main topic but can you explain the difference between an "attached image" and an "attached thumbnail" please?

Sergei

[markdoane]

Originally Posted by SmokelessJoe

Markdoane,

a little bit off the main topic but can you explain the difference between an "attached image" and an "attached thumbnail" please?

Sergei

Yeah. The forum software is screwy. Beyond that I dj e hssye skmmau owg?

[malconium]

Originally Posted by markdoane

I used a T to put the ceiling panel back in my '59. It's a little awkward working alone but you can do it.

If your ceiling panel is as wide as mine, be sure you lay some 2x4s on the floor to protect your toes in case the sheet slides off. The edge of the sheet could slice right through your foot!

You really do have a large top panel! Your might be easier in some ways though because of the natural droop caused by lifting it in the center.

Malcolm

[malconium]

A T framework sounds like a good idea. Actually I have done that for drywall myself so I know what you folks are talking about. For some silly reason I had not thought about doing that for the Airstream though.

Actually if I did cut the panels I would not need to overlap them making them shorter. What I would do would be to put a splice strip behind the panel joint and rivet the bigger pieces to it on both sides of the cut. What I was thinking about doing actually would be to lay the splice piece in place on the panel, drill rivet holes and then cut the big piece. That way the two cut pieces would still align with each other in exactly the same way as originally. I would rivet the splice piece to one of the panels before putting it up and then rivet the other one to it when it was inplace.

Thanks for the ideas,

Malcolm

[malconium]

Originally Posted by LI Pets

make a couple of T racks out of scrap 2x4's cut one the height you need and another the width, nail or screw them together.

Thats the way sheet rock is done.


Also insulate that access door, just glue a piece of foil to it.

Thats a good point about adding foil to the access hatch. I actually have to think about whether or not to leave the hatch or cover over it entirely, though. The orignal floor plan had the head of the double bed at the side so that the hatch actually accessed area under the bed. I am intending to put the head of a queen size bed under the back window and run the bed lengthwise. That makes this access hatch and its cousin on the other side of the trailer of somewhat questionable value.

Anyone have any ideas for covering over unused openings in the inner skin? I have given some casual thought to installing a thin wood overaly (perhaps 1/8" plywood) as a sort of wainscoting up to the bottom of the windows.

Malcolm

[malconium]

Originally Posted by SmokelessJoe

Malcolm,

We had to knock together a kind of scaffold to get the long, wavy 22’ centre panel re-installed in the ceiling. It didn’t take long to make or do.

Like Bob says, they use similar methods to get drywall up.

You will probably need 3 or 4 braces but with this method you and your wife should be able to get the panel up.

It’s better than cutting. If you cut you’ll have to overlap and then be short. It will look better too.


Sergei

What kind of lights are those in your center panel?

Malcolm

[sfixx]

Originally Posted by SmokelessJoe

Markdoane,

a little bit off the main topic but can you explain the difference between an "attached image" and an "attached thumbnail" please?

Sergei

Apparently the "thumbnail image" is a link to a larger picture. Your "attached image" simply is what it is

Steve

[LI Pets]

Originally Posted by malconium

What kind of lights are those in your center panel?

Malcolm

Yes what are those?

I'm hoping Led's.

[SmokelessJoe]

Malcolm, Bob:


The down lights are Alico Zee-Puk 18w XENON. The trim rings are not mounted yet. I don’t like the cold white of LED.

They are on two cool looking 12v dimmers from FriLight in Sweden.

Steve, when I try to attach directly from iPhoto, the files are always too big for this forum. The only way I can figure to do it is send myself an email of the smallest size, than drag those out for sending to the forum.

Any ideas?

Sergei

[sfixx]

I

Originally Posted by SmokelessJoe

Steve, when I try to attach directly from iPhoto, the files are always too big for this forum. The only way I can figure to do it is send myself an email of the smallest size, than drag those out for sending to the forum.

Any ideas?

Sergei

I'm a mac user too and used to do just what you do, mail it to myself.

I see that the forum now allows up to 1MB (1600 x 1600) for photos. A better way to resize photos in iPhoto is to use the <File> <Export> function. You'll be able to resize without cropping. Just name the maximum dimensions and your're good to go. Simply "export" to your desktop. Resize it in this screen:



Just to see how big we can get here's a 1600 x 1200 photo too(720 KB)...



Once you have uploaded and have the message attached simply locate where you want it in the posting with your cursor, click the paperclip at the top menu and select the photo you want to place, the photos ID number will have "attach" brackets around it in the message...and you could probably move it again manually if needed. I do not know why the software chooses to place some photos directly and some as thumnails....it probably has to do with size. Sooner or later you will run out of forum upload space and you might want to think about a free photo host site like Flickr or photobucket, etc. That's how I've been posting pics here and on my blog. I hope to see more photos of your excellent restoration!

Best wishes,

Steve

[SmokelessJoe]

Steve,

Thanks for teaching me how to use the <file> <export> function in iPhoto. I used it today in my latest post to my main thread.

Sergei

[sfixx]

Originally Posted by SmokelessJoe

Steve,

Thanks for teaching me how to use the <file> <export> function in iPhoto. I used it today in my latest post to my main thread.

Sergei

Good job. The Mods could probably remove this brief Mac tutorial, eh, since it's a little out of place here

Steve

[malconium]

I have been thinking a bit more about installing my upper side inner skin panel. One of the things that I think would help would be to force the whole panel into a curve that is perhaps slightly smaller in radius than it will be when fully installed. I noticed that one problem I was having when I did try it before was that the flat panel was hard to position against the curve to try to find rivet holes that aligned. My thought is to take some heavy duty strapping tape (the kind with fibers in it) and tape the panel into an arc at several places along its length. This would accomplish two things:

1.) The panel would now be easier to lift and keep straight. I suspect that it would also be a bit easier to keep it on top of t-bars too.

2.) As mentioned the panel should now fit the actual curve of the body ribs making it a lot easier to look for an alignment of holes.

My thought is to try to find matching holes along the bottom edge first and then look for ones along the top edge - or even some in the middle. I am thinking that the tape could easily be cut even with the edge of the panel if I can not actually get it out from behind - which might be pretty hard. I did think about using small luggage straps but that would be really hard to get out from behind. They might be OK though if it could get enough holes aligned and fastened at the ends of the panel leaving some gap still in the middle to take out the straps.

On another note I went looking for a type of product that I thought I had seen before for lifting cabinets and such into place. I found the two following products:

Amazon.com: FastCap 3HAND5 3rd Hand Support System 5 to 12 feet: Tools & Hardware

Amazon.com: Reviews for T-Jak TJ-104D Drywall Kit Includes a 2' Extension and Two Drywall Extension Tabs: Tools & Hardware

The first one is cheaper and might work beter because of the fact that the ends articulate and have rubber pads on them. I could not tell if the other one did have articulating ends or rubber pads. There is a difference in lifting capacity too. 70lbs for the first vs. 400 pounds for the second.

I am wondering if I could use step ladders as a stand. I have to take a closer look at mine. I have a couple of folding aluminum ones. I used to have two that were identical but I am not sure that is still the case.

I am going to have to wait until next Monday to give all this more of a try. I will report back on what I find out. Maybe I can even take some photos to post.

I would appreciate any thoughts on the ideas above.

Malcolm

[robandzoe]

Check out the 58 Sovereign fo the Road... it is coming along:

Sweet Sovereign of the Road


Rob

[SmokelessJoe]

Malcolm,

Just get three or four strong guys to help you. It will be faster, cheaper, easier than building, buying or renting any of these devices.

Sergei