It's raining INSIDE! GRRRRR!!!

[Catman6]

I'm living in my Argosy full time with my cats. I'm really getting frustrated! I've done everything I can think of including; opening the hatch & running the fan in the bathroom while showering and 30 minutes after, opening the hatch & running the fan in the kitchen when doing dishes, and running the rangehood fan when cooking. I've even left a hatch open all night last night while sleeping, and the heater ran almost constantly, but the ceiling was still full of drips. It's in the low 40'sF here at night, and I don't know what to do. I tried running a dehumidifier, but all it does is trip the circuit breaker (in the trailer). I really don't know what to do ...I'm not comfortable with burning a candle when I'm not here (I work nights & usually put in 12 - 14 hour nights). Are there any other ideas? Please help!

[Airslide]

It would be nice to figure out whats up with the circuit breaker. We run our dehumidifer on low clear up in the front of the trailer and when we awake in the morning.. even after showers that night.. the windows are dry and no signs of moisture anywhere. The bucket is always half full when I check. It surprises me how much moisture is trapped inside there during the winter and how much condensation we humans make..

Vin

[2airishuman]

hey catman

frustrated?

this is a common issue and there are several proven ways to reduce (not eliminate) the moisture inside.

we've already covered some in your OTHER thread...

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f314...ity-58496.html

although i like the title for THIS thread more!

you might want to read these too...

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f427...wet-22770.html

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f462...ion-20638.html

the candle idea is JUST PLAIN NONSENSE.

beside the fire risk 1 candle will do ZIP to raise interior temps OR remove moisture.

it's such a RIDICULOUS idea that countering it is giving the fable TOO MUCH time.
__________

a dehumidifier shouldn't trip a breaker IF it's on the correct circuit and UNDER 15 amps.

the devices i listed in your OTHER thread are UL approved, designed to RUN CONTINUOUSLY without risk...

have u talked with any BOATERs for tricks/tips nearby?

IF the cats are home/inside 24/7 there a little more constant insensible water loss 2 deal with.

and the challenge in YOUR location is that relative humidity OUTSIDE is pretty high right now...

so the differential is small and LOWERING interior humidity takes MORE effort.

don't give up yet!

cheers
2air'

[Foiled Again]

Circuit breakers normally don't go "part way bad" so I'd look at what else is on the circuit. If you're at a campground, try running a heavy duty extension cord outside (normally the door gasket can handle it on the bottom side) and running the dehumidifier directly off of the 15 amp circuit.

I'm not comfortable working on electricity, so I'd take my trailer to a competent service facility and have them run the load, looking for a short or draw on the circuit.

Paula

[2dabeach]

Catman6...We get a buildup of moisture on the aluminum walls of our trailer when we boil water for cooking when its cold outside. We never get it to the extreme that you are getting it. There has to be a source of the moisure that is building up in your unit. Do you get the moisture buildup while your at work and not occupying the trailer or only when you are active in the trailer? Are you only getting the buildup of moisture when your propane heater is running. If you are you may want to check the combustion chamber of your heater as one of the byproducts of gas combustion is water vapor. Good luck.

[Catman6]

I had issues with the circuit breaker popping before. They wired in new grounds and the issue subsided, but I wasn't really running anything bigger than a blender. The outlets are hooked to a GFI breaker. I wonder if it's starting to fail? I'm hooked up on a 15 amp circuit with a 12/2 Yellow Jacket extension cord. I wonder if that's what's stressing out the GFI breaker - thoughts? (I might post this on a new thread later) In response to when; It's worse when I'm here all the time versus when I'm at work. But even when I'm at work it's still a lot of moisture on the metal trim parts on the ceiling. Saturday night I could see where all the ceiling ribs were by the moisture trails (I was here). I usually keep the temp at 65'F. Should I try keeping it warmer in here? There's been a number of references to increasing air temps. Thoughts? *wanders off to read the above thread links*

[2airishuman]

catman

are there 6 cats in this space?

moisture could be tripping the gfi...

it's supposed to happen on a gfi when wet.

YES raising interior temps helps.

the WARMER the air, the MORE WATER it can hold.

so the relative humidity will appear to drop as the temp rises.

this won't stop condensation from forming on cooler surfaces however.

FANS help with that, but ultimately in COLD weather water will condense on cooler surfaces, and behind furnishings.

also warmer air doesn't REMOVE the water, so as soon as the temps drop again the water will reform and rain down...


keep at it!

cheers
2air'

[Catman6]

Yes, there are 6 cats in a 33'. I have no doubt they are exacerbating the problem. I keep reading run the A/C & heater together. For how long, how often? The A/C runs fin fine on the 15 amp circuit BTW

[2airishuman]

running the furnace and a/s together isn't an option for MOST of us with newer units.

the thermostat isn't set up to run both simultaneously, except on older units or aftermarket systems.

IF your tralya has dual/separate controls that allow both to operate...

-it's expensive, since lp gas and AC juice will be used together and OFTEN.

-it's impractical to use the AC in COLD weather (45 or lower)

-how long to run both will depend on HOW MUCH moisture is in the air, get a gizmo that reports humidity level.

-the moisture isn't JUST in the air, it's in everything, like clothes, furnishings, bedding and so on.

-imo u need a low point fresh air vent and a partially open high vent with fan...

-this provides outside air that will rise and carry some excess moisture OUT.

-but again with cool damp air outside, the issue isn't solved in one day or step.

-you will be dealing with 1-2 QUARTs of excess water EVERY DAY...

-it's useful to get the dehumidifier issue solved and USE it.

man that's a LOT of cats!

i doubt we'll see any MICE questions from U....

cheers
2air'

[Catman6]

You know, other than all of them trying to sleep with me at the same time, they seem to be content. We're used to a King Size bed, and the queen is a tad smaller ... LOLI have an older unit with dual controls. I ran the A/C for about 30 minutes, left the heat at 70'F, and I'm going to leave the fan run to circulate the air. I guess we'll see if that helps. I figure it's worth a shot - I'm getting desperate

[kennethowens]

Rid yourself of the GFCI problem.

Open a roof vent(s) about 1/8 of an inch
to let the moisture out - heat rising will
carry the moisture out - dry heat from the
floor level will rise

[Wingeezer]

Do you use the propane range for cooking? If so, burning propane generates water vapour as a byproduct, which would of course condense on cold surfaces. Might try using electric hotplates?

Brian

[rluhr]

You need to look for the source of the moisture. What you are describing is more condensation than typical.

1) Cats ... I'm not sure how much moisture evaporates from a cat, but I can't believe that even six of them can cause this problem by themselves, if you allow regular venting.

2) Rainwater leak. You've got a vintage trailer. I guarantee you, unless you've leak-tested and sealed it in the previous six months, it leaks. Have you noticed the problem is worse following rains? A light rain can cause heavy condensation for days afterward, because it takes a while for that hidden moisture inside the walls (and possibly in the floor) to dry out.

Check the trailer carefully or bring it to someone who can do it for you. Even a tiny leak in the roof can cause big moisture problems in the winter.

3) Groundwater evaporation. Are you parked over a very damp spot? Moisture can rise from below and rot your trailer from the bottom up. Parking on grass for long periods can cause this. I've seen this before in trailers salvaged from Florida.

4) Excess propane use in unvented appliances. Do you use a catalytic heater? If so, you need to open a roof vent AND a window per the heater's instructions, at all times during use. Cat heaters produce a tremendous amount of water vapor in normal operation.

You already stated that you ventilate well during cooking, which is good. Boiling water (for rice or pasta, for example) will greatly exacerbate your moisture buildup, so running a fan is usually necessary. Make sure you open a window for make-up air as well.

5) Check your furnace and water heater, or have them checked professionally. If the furnace is defective, it may be allowing exhaust fumes back into the trailer. This would be a serious issue because it would also allow deadly carbon monoxide into the trailer

Also check the water heater. Do you run it constantly, or shut it off when not in use? If it runs constantly, can you smell the exhaust inside the trailer? You should not be able to smell it -- also a serious concern.

6) Water line leaks. Take a really good look at every inch of pressurized water line in your trailer. This will require a flashlight, some paper towel, and possibly some light disassembly of cabinets. You're checking for leaks, possibly quite tiny little spritzes of water. It only takes a pinhole leak somewhere to cause the problem you are experiencing.

If you're venting the trailer adequately -- and it sounds like you are -- and still have condensation problems, the issue is excess moisture being produced in the trailer. Don't blame the cats. I'll bet it's a leak.

[garry]

I agree the amount of moisture you describe is excessive and not normal.

rluhr hit just about anything I could think of. Our sons AS filled up with mildew from the ground under the AS being damp and not drying out really made a mess.

I think you need to look under the AS for ground moisture or the insulation in the walls or ceiling has become waterlogged.

Propane does give off a LOT of moisture but the furnace should vent it to the outside.

Marine stores sell small dehumidifiers that work pretty good but not sure in your situation the problem will have to identified and corrected for one to work.

[Catman6]

rluhr, thanks for your multi-facited reply. You got me to thinking (usually a dangerous past time for me). The camper sits on a concrete pad with a slight angle so the water drains away. When it's not raining the pad stays dry. I have carbon monoxide detectors installed in the trailer. I assume that since they aren't sounding off the heater is fine. I know the water system is sealed. I found two small leaks about a month ago, and just went over it again after I had a drain line cut loose under the kitchen sink - soaking the carpet under the sink and cabinets across the front (WTH was AS thinking?!). Friday night I opened up the cabinets & cranked up the heat a littld to dry it out. That may have been the source of the extreme moisture - I never really gave that a thought. I had everything sealed on the roof about 6 weeks ago by an SOB dealer, but I'm wondering if they missed something. It's been raining really hard all day, and I had some dripping in the bathroom by the ceiling vent. I pulled the trim cover and found; A) I have sprayed on foam insulation in the ceiling, B) there's no directly visible leak, C) there was moisture droplets all over the roof ribs (How the he$$ do I dry all that out?) It's going to be raining all week, so I'm sorta stuck for a quick fix. I guess Sunday when it finally quits raining I'll crawl up and reseal it all myself (ya figure you pay someone to do the job ... ) Anyhow, Thanks again everyone. I guess I have multiple issues causing this. Any more advice, particularily on drying out the ceiling with removing it - would be greatly appreciated!

[Catman6]

Any more advice, particularily on drying out the ceiling WITHOUT removing it - would be greatly appreciated! (apparently I can't edit a post from my cell phone)

[Ganglin]

Just my personal opinion but the first thing I'd do is get a dehumidifier to work in the trailer. To paraphrase 2air - that amount of moisture is not just where you can see it - it's going to be everwhere and sooner than later your going to end up with a mold problem.

I have a 2.5 gallon Whirlpool portable dehumidifier in the basement that I just checked - it draws 5 amps. I'm not recommending this just telling you what I might do. I'd pull that GFI breaker and replace it with a standard breaker then go with GFI outlets at the galley and bath. Plug the dehumidifier in on a non GFI outlet and get the moisture under control.

Sealing the roof again is obvious but until then.....

[slowmover]

I was amazed at how much water was collected by the dehumidifier I bought in it's first three days of use. I can't imagine another way of adequately getting the trailer interior dried out. Ours was a 34' and the $150 machine from Lowes did a great job set up on the counter to run constantly while in storage, draining into the kitchen sink.

[Catman6]

Well, I got home early this morning, and found the leak. I need to reseal the bath vent. I've left the trim cover off so it drips on a rubber backed mat. The GFI plugs & standard breaker sound like a good idea. Where do I get a new breaker from? It doesn't look like a house style breaker

[Catman6]

It'ds a 20 Bryant GFI breaker in there now. Who carries them?