How cold before winterizing?

[Hans627]

I live in south central PA and we are expecting the first frost this weekend. It is expected to be 30 degrees at night and in the 50's during the day. Is it necessary to winterize with these temperatures? BTW it is sitting outside.

Thanks!

[OTRA15]

With no wind, you should be fine if you leave the heat on low (50 or so) for insurance. Even without the heat prob OK. Any wind at all, or a lower temperature, would change the equation. Like the weakest link in a chain defining its strength, you might start to think about where your coach's water might freeze first. Outdoor shower? Drain for potable water tank?

Do you have heaters for your holding tanks, and how full are the tanks? A full tank of waste at 50 degrees is a powerful source of radiant heat, if we can shift our thinking a bit, at least for one night. Ditto for a full tank of fresh water.

For peace of mind you might consider buying some remote temp. sensors which send their readings to a master base unit. One in an exterior storage area, one in the coach under the sink, and maybe one under the bath sink? I got some last winter to monitor my house's water pump room and crawl space, and the peace of mind was great! Amazon price was about $30 as I recall -- will post a link later today if you wish.

Good luck!

PS leave the hot water heater on also for insurance, and make sure you have a decent supply of propane.

[paiceman]

I live in Western PA. Once the forecast is in mid - to low 30's I winterize. I blow lines and then add two gallons of anti-freeze. A pain, but much less of one than having a line freeze. If we use the AS after this procedure I de-winterize and then winterize again after use. Wind has nothing to do with ambient temperature, wind chill is only on human skin. However, if there are areas where wind can get to a line, ie outside shower then that will allow cold temps to freeze the lines. I don't know how to winterize the outside shower by itself so I do the whole trailer.

[68 TWind]

In Mississippi we face this decision about a month later than you folks up north. If I know I am not going camping for a while and the weather is getting into the 30's I go ahead and blow out my lines. Why, because sometimes the weather will turn very cold vey fast and it is always when I am gone or don't have time to work on the trailer. Also, it is much nicer to do it on a 50 degree day than a windy, cold and wet 30 degree day.

[Kevin245]

I don't worry much about winterizing until we start seeing overnight lows forecast in the upper 20's.

[KYAirstream]

Originally Posted by OTRA15

For peace of mind you might consider buying some remote temp. sensors which send their readings to a master base unit. One in an exterior storage area, one in the coach under the sink, and maybe one under the bath sink? I got some last winter to monitor my house's water pump room and crawl space, and the peace of mind was great! Amazon price was about $30 as I recall -- will post a link later today if you wish.

Good luck!

PS leave the hot water heater on also for insurance, and make sure you have a decent supply of propane.

If you have a chance to post that link that'd be great.

[Floatingair]

Here in OK, SOB and AS owners are advised to winterize by Oct. 1. Farmer's Almanac is pretty good in predicting weather too.
I was also told, even if your Airstream is stored in a heated storage, still winterize it.

[OTRA15]

Originally Posted by KYAirstream

If you have a chance to post that link that'd be great.

Here is the base unit, for which you order as many sensors as you want (max. 3):

http://www.amazon.com/Crosse-Technol...FT6KXYJNVFVW90

Pretty reasonable price for the peace of mind. Sync'ing the remotes has to be done all at one sitting, and the instructions are not perfect, but it is pretty simple. They have online instructions too, as I lost my original instructions and had to set up the system at a new house recently.

Good luck.

[KYAirstream]

Thanks for the link!

[KJRitchie]

I'm going to winterize November 1. I will be attending the rally in Branson that weekend. I'll have access to full hookups. I'll take my air compressor and a few gallons of antifreeze. I'll leave the water tank valve open and the remaining water can drain out of the tank on the tow home. Doubt I'll use it again until spring .

Kelvin

[Larry C]

If you live in a climate where you know it's going to have to be done, more than likely, it would be better to do it some warm day, before you have a very cold night..

It sorta takes the worry out of it.

For whatever it's worth.

Larry

[Debbstr]

Thanks for the information, I just ordered one.

[CRH]

Originally Posted by OTRA15

With no wind, you should be fine if you leave the heat on low (50 or so) for insurance. Even without the heat prob OK. Any wind at all, or a lower temperature, would change the equation. Like the weakest link in a chain defining its strength, you might start to think about where your coach's water might freeze first.

How does wind come into play?

[Rokitman]

Peace of mind? Temp sensors? Seems to me, temp sensors would be like a radar detector in your car (or TV): All they tell you is how fast (cold) you were when you got caught!

This guy in Alaska says "it got down to 25° last night"; time to wintertize the Airstream.

https://youtu.be/2BNbEAGFPt4

[OTRA15]

Originally Posted by CRH

How does wind come into play?

Please forgive the inexact science to come --

As paiceman said earlier, wind is normally associated with the Wind Chill Factor. The reason wind is relevant is that, for both human skin and trailers, wind causes heat to leave the warmer object (human skin, trailer pipes) at a faster rate than in still air. In 30 degree air all objects will eventually get to 30, no matter what temp they started out at. With a wind blowing on them, they will get to 30 more quickly, that's all. Change the air temp to 10 Fahrenheit , and the accelerated cooling can be profound in a strong wind, to which our facial skin can attest! [apologies to Winston Churchill . . . ]

I forget the physics of it, but the differential between the air temp and object temp also affects the rate at which heat leaves the object.

Then there is the other affect of wind, also mentioned earlier, that it can force cold air through gaps and holes, and drive the cold into the coach's innards and pipes, which are no longer protected in an airtight cocoon. In a strong wind, the blast of air leaving a pinhole air leak actually is cooler than the air that entered the pinhole, if only by a small amount. [like the air leaving a tire valve as it drops in pressure]

The net conclusion is that wind can escalate the affect of cold air in unexpected ways.

Thus endeth this imprecise windy matter . . .

[Protagonist]

Originally Posted by OTRA15

Please forgive the inexact science to come

Inexact, but certainly close enough for Government work. I used to work for the Government, so I should know. Building on what you said…

Wind chill only affects things with a warm-blooded metabolism, meaning they generate their own heat. That includes a trailer while you're camping in it and have the furnace on. It does not include a winterized trailer that is stored with the furnace off.

Here's an example that I think clearly illustrates the effect of wind chill. Looking at the National Weather Service's wind chill chart, if the outside temperature is 35°F— above freezing— and there was a 20mph wind, the wind chill is 24°F, below freezing. So would your plumbing freeze? No. Regardless of the wind chill, 35°F is still above freezing and your pipes will not freeze.

So where does wind chill make a difference? If you were going camping instead of winterizing, the amount of propane you would use to keep the trailer warm with an outside temperature of 35°F with a 20mph wind would be the same as if the temperature was 24°F with no wind.

Living along the Gulf Coast as I do, the case where the temperature is above freezing but the wind chill is below freezing happens on a semi-regular basis in most winters, which is why I use it as my example.

[Wingeezer]

I prefer not to take any chances! We don't normally do any camping after mid September until we head south early in the new year, so as soon as we take that last September trip, I winterize - then I don't have to watch the weather and worry - as I otherwise would!

Likewise, when we return from our winter trip, I generally winterize it again as we could still get a cold snap in April where we live. Probably not cold enough and long enough to do harm, but I worry a lot!

Probably no need for me to do that really, but for a couple of gallons of antifreeze and half an hours work, it is worth it for me just for peace of mind - especially since our trailer is stored about a half hour further north from where we live!

Brian.


Having said that I would be pretty sure that if the temp dips to 30F just for a couple f hours overnight, you "Should" have no worries!

Brian.

[OTRA15]

Thanks for the nice illustration, Protagonist . . . well said.

[LivLoveLaugh]

Personnally if there is any concern on the temp dropping below freezing why take the chance. $20 for a few gallons of RV Antifreeze pumped throughout the plumbing system seems like cheap insurance to me. Or better yet just blow out the lines with compressed air. Like paiceman, I did both this past weekend.

[tjdonahoe]

I like to winterized my trailer while it is nice outside,like 50 degrees, I have done it at 20 degrees and snowing with a wind , didn't like that very much...