Help - Winter camping freeze problem

[richarus]

I am winter camping in West Virginia with freezing temps all nite and most of the day. I have a 20 foot FC and all systems are working good - tank heaters, water pump, gas heater, etc. The problem I am having is that the dump valves are frozen shut and I am guessing that the exposed dump plumbing is probably frozen solid. I pulled hard enough on the grey water valve that the handle broke and valve did not budge. Has anyone else experienced this and does anyone have advice as to how I might be able drain my tanks in this freezing weather.

The only other option I can think of is to start driving south to warm weather. Am I wrong to think that Airstreams were designed to be used in winter weather? Was I supposed to put Antifreeze in the tanks before embarking on this adventure?

I am fairly new to RVing and Airstream. Any suggestions will be appreciated.

[Goal15]

Originally Posted by richarus

I am winter camping in West Virginia with freezing temps all nite and most of the day. I have a 20 foot FC and all systems are working good - tank heaters, water pump, gas heater, etc. The problem I am having is that the dump valves are frozen shut and I am guessing that the exposed dump plumbing is probably frozen solid. I pulled hard enough on the grey water valve that the handle broke and valve did not budge. Has anyone else experienced this and does anyone have advice as to how I might be able drain my tanks in this freezing weather.

The only other option I can think of is to start driving south to warm weather. Am I wrong to think that Airstreams were designed to be used in winter weather? Was I supposed to put Antifreeze in the tanks before embarking on this adventure?

I am fairly new to RVing and Airstream. Any suggestions will be appreciated.

Sorry to hear about your predicament.

AS, like most travel trailers, are more of a three season living space, although some folks here have successfully wintered in their AS and I'm sure many more have taken trips during winter months in theirs, but by and large, unless you are dry camping, camping in below freezing temps are going to be a challenge.

Now as to your dump valves, I would search the Forums using the search function to see what solutions have been offered, other than driving South several hundred miles.

I guess it also depends on how long you are going to be in your current location. If it was me, I would look for some type of safe, yet warm heat source that could be placed near the dump valves to see if they could be thawed. Not a scientist so I couldn't tell you how long it would take to thaw if you could create an enclosed space around the dump valves and heat it with a light bulb or portable heater, but I guess if I was in that situation it would be something I might try. I've got a couple of heat guns that I used for stripping paint, but I think those would probably melt the dump valves, so i'd advise against that. Not sure what you are going to do in the short term about the broken valve handle.

Good luck
Dana

[Bill M.]

Is the piping and the drain valve exposed so that you can see them? If so I would try to thaw them with a heat source. If the valves are in the belly area of the trailer then the furnace is supposed to keep them from freezing and might thaw them if it runs enough. There should not be water in the pipes outside of the valves. You might try blowing hot air through the waste opening being careful not to overheat the pipe. I am thinking hair dryer. You will have to determine what is broken on the handle. Usually a cotter key and a slip over piece of tubing.

[paiceman]

No RV dump valve is designed to work in the weather we now have without some prep work to open it on the operators part. I would suggest trying window washer fluid poured over the fittings, one might also try hot water but my concern would be cracking of the plastic and or the refreeze almost at once as its only 9 degrees here where we are in western PA. No we are not camping. The hair dryer idea by Bill M might work as well, but it could be frozen in the tank as well. I always dump a bunch of window washer fluid in both black and gray tanks in cold weather camping. Not sure it works, but we have not frozen either.

Good luck

[scamp]

It all depends how much there frozen I would use a hairdryer , and if it's really cold and windy you will have to make some kind of shelter around the dump valves ,such as insulation But not in contact with the dump valves ,leave a air space around the dump valve and then heat the valves with a hair dryer and of course run the furnace to heat tanks or if you have electric heated tanks you should turn them on.

Don

[tjdonahoe]

I think I would go to a warmer climate, the as is not built for real cold weather, it is 8 degrees here and my as is going to stay under the roof ....good luck

[crisen]

Lots of suggestions already on thawing it out but as to your question on adding RV antifreeze. We deal with cold weather each year when we leave Fairbanks and we always add at least 2 gallons of RV antifreeze to both tanks prior to using them. Then as long as it is cold we continue to add a little of the antifreeze each day as we are adding waste. So far this has worked to keep the valves from freezing.

[Shacksman]

To thaw the valve, hook up your sewer dump hose, hold it up and pour some warm water into it. The water will thaw the valve. Use a small vice grip for a temporary pull handle.

[Goal15]

Originally Posted by Shacksman

To thaw the valve, hook up your sewer dump hose, hold it up and pour some warm water into it. The water will thaw the valve. Use a small vice grip for a temporary pull handle.

Brilliant!


Sent from my iPhone using Airstream Forums

[Tomzstream]

Dougs solution may work if there isn't a frozen mess in the bottom of the tanks and if the warm water doesn't cool off and freeze itself. The suggestion of searching the forums is the best. I recall seeing similar thread with some pretty good ideas on how to avoid this situation to begin with. In particular, folks have come up with pretty ingenious ideas on how to keep sewer lines from freezing up... and of course as a result, this allows you to leave the valves open all the time.

[Tim A.]

Take a look at this thread: http://www.airforums.com/forums/f44/...ns-128364.html .

Tim

[Protagonist]

Originally Posted by Tomzstream

Dougs solution may work if there isn't a frozen mess in the bottom of the tanks and if the warm water doesn't cool off and freeze itself.

If the tank is full enough to need dumping, and tank heaters were working as the OP stated, then the valve will be frozen but the tank will not, and Doug's solution will work just fine.

Even if you don't have tank heaters working, ice floats, and you won't have a frozen mess in the bottom of the tank unless the entire tank is frozen top to bottom. In which case you'll have a cracked tank due to ice expansion and therefore a bigger problem than just a stuck dump valve.

[richarus]

It warmed up a bit today and the sun seemed to warm the the AS a bit. I poured some hot water on the grey dump valve and was able to get it to open. A small chunk of ice came out and it looks like it will drain ok. Since I am not currently hooked to sewer, I closed it. I think I will not mess with the black water tank until we have a full hookups or find a proper dump station . Thanks to everyone for the feedback. This has been a good learning experience to help me understand my AS capabilities for future travel. We will be heading south again in the next couple of days. I really liked Shacksman's idea of pouring water back thru the dump tube. Makes perfect sense.

[handn]

Originally Posted by richarus

I am winter camping in West Virginia with freezing temps all nite and most of the day. I have a 20 foot FC and all systems are working good - tank heaters, water pump, gas heater, etc. The problem I am having is that the dump valves are frozen shut and I am guessing that the exposed dump plumbing is probably frozen solid. I pulled hard enough on the grey water valve that the handle broke and valve did not budge. Has anyone else experienced this and does anyone have advice as to how I might be able drain my tanks in this freezing weather.

The only other option I can think of is to start driving south to warm weather. Am I wrong to think that Airstreams were designed to be used in winter weather? Was I supposed to put Antifreeze in the tanks before embarking on this adventure?

I am fairly new to RVing and Airstream. Any suggestions will be appreciated.

No easy answers here. One could say you are SOL.
My idea is to park the trailer in the sun as soon as it comes up with the dump valves facing the sun. Wrap one or more tarps around the bottom of the AS, duct tape the tarp to the AS and rock the bottom of the tarps. Put two space heaters under the AS near the holding tanks (each must be on a separate circuit.) Turn the furnace on and up to 70 and wait for at least 5 hours before trying the valves and hope that the tanks and or valves have not cracked.
If that does not work all you can do is put the trailer in a heated space, drive south or wait until it warms up.
I'll bet this is the last time this ever happens to you.

[tjdonahoe]

Antifreeze in the tanks before leaving the next time,it sure is fun...one time my tank froze up while hooked up.I let the water run in the kitchen all night,in the morning the tank was full.i had a case of heet that I used in the truck, 5 cans of it went into the tank, it gurgled and boiled then it drained, not recommended ...

[Tomzstream]

The reason I questioned the warm water in the slinky solution is that obviously warm water on the other side of the valve did no good (tank heaters on). Attacking the frozen valve from both sides is worth a try I suppose. But if its that cold that tank heaters are useless, then I dunno.

Just a side note, Dumping gray water is prohibited in many parks and not advised. Having hookups, leaving the valves open, and configuring a heated drain hose is still probably the best solution... search the archives for how to's on this method. Sunshine is great too, if you happen to be so lucky as to have it. In Winter, its not always available! If you have a portable generator, you can also position it so the exhaust warms the valves, just don't trust the underbelly sealing to protect you from CO poisoning, esp at night!

[Protagonist]

Originally Posted by Tomzstream

The reason I questioned the warm water in the slinky solution is that obviously warm water on the other side of the valve did no good (tank heaters on). Attacking the frozen valve from both sides is worth a try I suppose. But if its that cold that tank heaters are useless, then I dunno.

Just a reminder, your tank heaters will probably only keep the tanks at about 45°F. Adding water to the slinky straight from your water heater, over 100°F, will definitely melt ice a lot faster than tank heaters!

Tank heaters are not useless. Your tanks didn't rupture from ice expansion, did they? That means the heaters did their job.

[NevadaGeo]

On the farm we used hot water and rags. Poke a small hole in the lid of a two liter bottle, fill with hot water and go to work squirting with hot water and rags. Then keep the tank and lines empty or warm or something. Water hoses will freeze running with a full stream if it's cold enough, I've seen live steam lines freeze too, but don't recommend everyone to see that. Cold wind will get into places you don't believe and freeze lines too.

[Tomzstream]

Originally Posted by Protagonist

Just a reminder, your tank heaters will probably only keep the tanks at about 45°F. Adding water to the slinky straight from your water heater, over 100°F, will definitely melt ice a lot faster than tank heaters!

Tank heaters are not useless. Your tanks didn't rupture from ice expansion, did they? That means the heaters did their job.

OK GUY, quote me on everything I say and then dispute it. Why do you have it in for me? Useless in keeping valves unfrozen... OK?

[Protagonist]

Originally Posted by Tomzstream

Why do you have it in for me? Useless in keeping valves unfrozen... OK?

Yeah. But I don't have it in for you. I'm a (former) engineer, and I'm analytical by nature. I mean no offense by it.