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Old 09-20-2010, 11:38 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by fmrcaptevil View Post
Just checked it with a level, and not only does it angle up slightly (relative to the main frame), but the two sides don't perfectly agree with each other, either. Also, gamana, I think that the little level on top of your hitch jack is adjustable.
How do you get a level on the main frame?

Ken
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Old 09-20-2010, 11:41 AM   #30
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some one ELSE set up the op's hitch...

we've seen NO scale data or weights, loadings or hitch settings.

i suspect the op is just doing whatever the set up guy did in terms of hitching...

so we really don't know a lot here still.
________

but this stuff we DO know...

many of the A frames do appear to angle upward and as ken suggests one can look under/at this area...

the tank covers on many of these units DO position in such a way to exaggerate that curved look.

the A frames also flex/move on heavier units, without towing or ANY movement by the tow vehicle.

placed on the JACK post, then on the cup/BALL and then on a hitch (in FRONT of the ball)...

ALL change the amount of flex as, the distance increases forward.

this flex can be seen and measured at EACH increment of distance further forward.

the jack is BEHIND the cup/mount (shortest lever) and a hitch is further forward (longest lever) ...

the flex is real and progressive.

w/d bars ADD to that flex, no question about it.
_________

but almost everything sean has posted is also true...

except the part about a/s design limits.

they REALLY are at the limits (or beyond) on bigger trailers...

and have NOT spent the funds to solve that problem.

since the majority of trailers sold NEW are used VERY LITTLE, they don't get stressed.

so being BEYOND the frame/sheel/connections limit is not obvious, except for high USE units.

for example,

they spent a boat load of money and time trying to make a TINY TINY slide out work well...

ultimately significant frame reinforcement was needed, it was cheaper to STOP making slide outs.

(many smaller/cheaper trailers have 2 slides AND double entry doors without issues)

the PAN'd am is another example...

the frame is significantly reinforced to alloy for a relatively MINOR payload increase...

again this project was put aside, while almost no other toy hauler has these issues.

they really are AT or beyond the capacity of these units and know it.

they FIX a lot of streams with these issues.

let me repeat what's been said by other KNOWLEDGEABLE streamers...

"it's not your fault or your tv fault or your hitch at fault, it's the trailer"

cheers
2air'
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Old 09-20-2010, 11:51 AM   #31
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I guess to be accurate I should say that every A-frame on every Airstream I have owned has angled slightly up relative to every other area visible and therefore accessible along the longitudinal axis, that one would expect to be parallel to or corresponding with the main frame. Happy now?
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Old 09-20-2010, 11:58 AM   #32
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I guess to be accurate I should say that every A-frame on every Airstream I have owned has angled slightly up relative to every other area visible and therefore accessible along the longitudinal axis, that one would expect to be parallel to or corresponding with the main frame. Happy now?
Not really, I thought you found a way to access the main frame without removing the belly pan.

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Old 09-20-2010, 12:12 PM   #33
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the A frame isn't welded onto the main frame such that there is an UPward angle...

it may look that way packaged but there are 100s of nekked frame pictures here that suggest otherwise.

anyone who has seen the frames NEW/fresh can confirm the 2 sections are parallel.

watching the crew UNLOAD new frames from the flat bed one can SEE them FLOPPING/flexing.
__________

on units WITH excessive flex, the rivets/screws and C channel connecting shell 2 frame...

will show signs of flex ALL AROUND THE FRONT END, under the rub rail...

ovalized holes, broken rivets, loose screws and so on,

in an ARC all around the front end, progressively and along the sides...

cheers
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Old 09-20-2010, 02:42 PM   #34
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I agree (that they don't WELD it at an angle), but as a whole, it is designed to flex a little, and that is apparent when you compare the A-frame with the rest of it.

Now, back to the "overhitching" issue: do most of us agree that a good basic test is to put your body weight on the hitch (everything connected, of course) and see if it moves? (If it stays stiff, you might be overhitched, and if it reacts to the additional weight, you're O.K.?
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Old 09-20-2010, 02:53 PM   #35
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I agree (that they don't WELD it at an angle), but as a whole, it is designed to flex a little, and that is apparent when you compare the A-frame with the rest of it.

Now, back to the "overhitching" issue: do most of us agree that a good basic test is to put your body weight on the hitch (everything connected, of course) and see if it moves? (If it stays stiff, you might be overhitched, and if it reacts to the additional weight, you're O.K.?
I for one don't agree with the premise that there is any such thing as over hitched when the subject is towing.

To me over hitched means being married too many times.

However a given hitch can be adjusted incorrectly.

It is possible for a hitch to be under rated for the load it is carrying, but not over rated.

If something handed you a 5 gallon bucket and said "Bring me two gallons of water", would you say, "I'm sorry, but if I carried it in this bucket I would be over bucketed, I need a 2 gallon one."?

Regards,

Ken
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Old 09-20-2010, 03:43 PM   #36
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I keep reading about leaks and trailer structure bending/breaking, yet absolute denial that heavy suspensions combined with heavy weight distribution bars have anything to do with it.

Some have suggested theories, offered accelerometer tests, on and on, or when it all goes to he.., blame the manufacturer. The Airstream should be built to withstand any stiff suspension you can hook it to, is one line of thinking.

Another is a softer ride for the Airstream, as Andy suggests. Take your pick.
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Old 09-21-2010, 04:06 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fmrcaptevil View Post
I agree (that they don't WELD it at an angle), but as a whole, it is designed to flex a little, and that is apparent when you compare the A-frame with the rest of it.

Now, back to the "overhitching" issue: do most of us agree that a good basic test is to put your body weight on the hitch (everything connected, of course) and see if it moves? (If it stays stiff, you might be overhitched, and if it reacts to the additional weight, you're O.K.?
If a 100 to 300 pound person cannot make the coupler area move up and down, by jumping on the coupler, then in my opinion, it's over hitched.

Historically, anything can be challenged, and this subject is one of them.

The bottom line answer, rests with each owner.

Each of us can disagree about anything, even Physics.

The disagreement however, is usually not followed by "what is or would be better", and with adequate reasoning, or data. Just an opinion.

Andy
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Old 09-21-2010, 07:25 AM   #38
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it doesnt take a 200 pound person to move the hitch.all you have to do is take a ride on some of these roads in pennsylvania or on the way through the southern states on i95 and you will be darned glad you have a 3/4 ton with an upscale hitch.i can see how too soft could lead to a major sway problem when you are doing 65 mph and you hit some of the quirks in these roads.just ask any trucker at a truck stop how beat up and broken their trucks get.usually once a year i see a sob and a weak tv fliiped over on the side of the road.i would bet that road bumps and dips were a major contributor to these catastrophes,along with inadequate rigging.
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Old 09-21-2010, 09:00 AM   #39
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I have noticed IF i pull to many links on my chain on the equalizer hitch it will pull the frame enough in the front to bubble the skin in. So you can over tighten your hitch.

Bottom Line here it sounds like their frame isn't bent.

As for going to the scale to figure the exact weights on your trailer? It still isn't worth my time. Most of us are not that anal, but to those who are I hope the trail towed better. For the rest of us we can just live in the bliss of ignorance.
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Old 09-21-2010, 10:51 AM   #40
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I have often wondered what the end outcome of this thread was.
It seems to pertain to the light hitch bar question.

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f464...ure-62703.html
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Old 09-21-2010, 11:37 AM   #41
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It is possible for a hitch to be under rated for the load it is carrying, but not over rated.

Regards,

Ken


As I understand it, here is the problem with over rated weight distribution bars. Although the overrated bars will properly distribute weight, they may not flex enough to allow a truck/trailer going over a dip in the road, such as entering a gas station with a low drainage ditch between road and station. Imagine jacking up the front of your truck, and the resulting stress on receiver, hitch, bars, and trailer tongue.

If the bars cannot flex enough, something must give, the receiver, hitch, bars, or trailer tongue, or a combination.

Similar stresses are exerted when driving down uneven roadways. Can these ongoing stresses, more flex and less stress with lower rated bars and a softer ride, damage an Airstream? Or at the dipped driveway bend or break something?

That would be over hitching, as I understand it.

Doug
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Old 09-21-2010, 11:52 AM   #42
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Hold a pencil in your hand. Hold it with both hands like you're going to break it. Apply a little pressure but not enough to break it.

The left end of the pencil is the WD hitch mount point on the frame, the center up pressure is on the WD hitch, through the bars, and there's another down pressure on the TV mount. it's a 500/1000/500 split with 1000 lb bars, 375/750/375 split with 750 lb bars and 250/500/250 split with 500 lb bars.

Thus, the hitch is applying up to 500 lbs of extra load through the A frame at that point and it will flex locally.

In theory, you should consider the trailer's share of the load as part of the weight it is carrying when working out how much you can load into it.
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