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Old 05-22-2016, 03:58 PM   #1
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1968 20' Globetrotter
Rumford , Rhode Island
Join Date: Jul 2015
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Need Help Options 1968 Sink Vent Pipe

Hi Folks:

This weekend's surprise.....

While replacing the stove vent cover we discovered that the factory had apparently drilled through the sink vent pipe when making the hole. Well that would account for some water. This is the flatten pipe the was made to fit into the walls. What are my options for replacement? I am not too sure that the pipe is readily available. The walls are partly off anyway so not an issue there.

Thanks,
Steve and Deb
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Old 05-22-2016, 08:25 PM   #2
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1986 34' Limited
1966 24' Tradewind
Conifer , Colorado
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Greetings layback, welcome to Air Forums. It sounds like you folks are doing some major renovations to your vintage Globetrotter. I personally like the 1968 model year.

My 66 has three vent pipes through the roof. My 86 has just two. I'm no professional plumber, but it seems to me the vent has a simple job to do. It just ensures no vacuum forms between the trap and the tank. All of my vent pipes are 1 1/2" diameter black ABS. I have never heard of a special shaped vent pipe. So you have my curiosity up.

When I replumbed my 66, I moved the bath sink from its original location. That sink had a rather long run to the new gray water tank. The vent served the shower and the bath sink. So I installed an "air emitter" device in the drain line. It is sealed unless vacuum is formed, then the valve is "sucked" open and air is let in the drain line. I really don't know if it has ever opened, but I installed it "just in case". You might be able to do the same thing for your galley sink drain line.

Any chance you can post a picture of the special flattened vent pipe that apparently has damage due to the stove vent opening?

I'll bet owners of 68s know exactly what you are referring to.

David
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Old 05-23-2016, 06:27 PM   #3
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1968 20' Globetrotter
Rumford , Rhode Island
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Thanks!!

Here is picture of the stove vent hole and the pipe that was cut. What you also see on the top is the infamous 1968 spray installation. How it got up there who knows. The hole in the pipe had cloth duck tape over it. Real nice fix.
So now we know why the back streetside frame needs to be repaired.

We have a cap over the pipe for now, but don't want to replace the floor until this is taken care of. I have read that some people have flatten an ABS pipe with a heat gun to get the desired pipe. After thinking about it a while I thought some kind of ABS patch might work. We want to maintain the original outside as much as possible. It is not so much the vent but the prevention of not getting water where it shouldn't be.

The stove fan has been removed by a PO and the backing you see is a aluminum sheet which is inside the cabinet. Taking off the cabinets right now is on the bottom of our list.

Yup we are doing the full monte on this. This is my retirement project which since I retired in February we are finally making slow but sure progress. We hate rusty screws and staples.

Steve and Deb
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Old 05-23-2016, 07:17 PM   #4
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1986 34' Limited
1966 24' Tradewind
Conifer , Colorado
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Well, learn something new everyday about these old trailers. My 66 vent pipes are located pretty much between the frame rails going up. In this photo you can see the galley sink vent pipe located at the foot of one of the twin beds. The sun is shinning on the square box Airstream built around the vent pipe. It looks like by 1968 Airstream did not want the vent pipes to encroach on valuable interior space like they do in my trailer. So why not make a special vent pipe that fits between the outer skin and the interior skin.

The vent pipe just removes vacuum between the sink trap and the tank should any form. It also allows tank odors to escape up high. As you continue in your teardown, put repairing this vent pipe on your list of scores of things to do. It needs sealed so it won't leak air, and I should think there are several ways to patch it. You will want to put a rain water tight vent pipe cap on top of your Airstream. Here is a photo of one of the three I did. Seems to work. It is a simple plastic pieces I purchased from Vintage Trailer Supply.

I'm recently retired too and enjoy spending hours in the shop on these old Airstreams. And we enjoy traveling in them. We just returned from a two week, 2500 mile trip to the southwest. Fun.

David
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Old 05-24-2016, 01:01 PM   #5
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1968 20' Globetrotter
Rumford , Rhode Island
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Hi David,
Believe it or not the pipe vent cover was next until our discovery. We have 3 already painted and ready to go. We were going to place just the sink vent because it was stationary. It seems that VTS gets an order a week. The other 2 would have to wait until we put the bathroom back together. Just too much movement of the pipes and afraid that the seal would break.

Not too sure if the pipe in the wall was a good thing. Can you imagine a PO trying to find and fix that leak. Probably thought it was the awning rail. Tons of silicone up their. The PO loved silicone.

That's great about your trip. We will be lucky if we ever make it out of New England. But that's okay. As one of our friends asked what are you going to do with it. My reply was if we get away a few days to the beach here and there that would be great.
Steve and Deb
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Old 05-24-2016, 02:40 PM   #6
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I would just fiberglass over the hole making sure you have enough room to replace the stove vent.

You are not dealing with the National Plumbing code here so size and inspection are not an issue. The reason the code states 1 1/2 is so there is no chance of ice from the vapor leaving the vent closing over the hole above the roof of a house and possible build up of sewer gas. Not a problem here.
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Old 05-24-2016, 02:42 PM   #7
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1968 20' Globetrotter
ANN ARBOR , THE GREAT LAKES
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Great retirement project

Must've been the same jackass that drilled my stove vent hole. My production number is 537, Fall 1967, so let's assume all 68GT builds between yours and mine have cut out sink vent pipes. Some folks defend and excuse Airstream's poor fabrication, noting that it is a handmade product and these mistakes should be tolerated. I see it as a work ethic issue. This is not caring if your work is good. I cannot imagine doing this unknowingly.


On mine, the water damage to the interior kitchen overhead lockers and rangehood necessitated their remove and scrap. There wasn't much floor damage, but it was traced to the leaking vent. You can patch the pipe with ABS cement or cut, and glue in a sleeve. ABS is plentiful, yes, you can warm and bend and crush etc… 1 ½ pipe fits in the wall. I made a patch.

I like the size and weight of the 68GT. I've changed the floorplan to suit two. Taking my time, keeping it fun…

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f7/a...od-129180.html

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f427...ew-126474.html

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f454...nt-111812.html
]
http://www.airforums.com/forums/f7/p...ce-128019.html

Globetrotters Rule!
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Old 05-24-2016, 07:41 PM   #8
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1966 24' Tradewind
Conifer , Colorado
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Hi layback, you garnered a response from aluminuminum. Those folks are mid sixties Airstream experts. Read over their renovation thread. The quality of the work done is amazing. One of my favorites. And aluminuminum is an excellent source for understanding the goofy windows we have in our trailers. He has had them all apart and has posted repair instructions.

It appears others agree you can figure out a good repair method for your vent pipe. It is interesting to me aluminuminum had the same issue with this manufacturing defect. And getting a good roof vent cap that doesn't leak rain water is important. Rain water leaks are the bane of Airstreams.

New England is so pretty. We traveled through New York, New Hampshire, Vermont and Maine for the first time two years ago. We loved it. Colorado is rugged scenic, but New England has a certain charm. So get your Globetrotter fixed up to your liking and venture into the White Mountains.

David
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Old 05-25-2016, 07:07 AM   #9
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1968 20' Globetrotter
Rumford , Rhode Island
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Thanks everyone!!
It is official probably the same Jackass. My production number is 533, so more than likely at least 3 more were/are out there. To be honest bad design...there is not that much room between the window frame and stove vent hole. Maybe it is just specific to Globetrotters because of their size.

So just so we get the process straight. Heat up the ABS with a heat gun/blow dryer. Shape it to the pipe where the hole is. Will the heat transfer effect the existing pipe much? Solvent weld (ABS cement) the patch to the existing pipe. Right? Wow I see our headache level going down!!!!

The next question is for Aluminuminum, how is the space for installing the stove fan? Not sure if that is going to be done right away.

We are not sure how much damage was done to the overhead lockers. PO had done some modifications to the kitchen. The bottom panels were white aluminum sheets. We will definitely post the repair when done.

Thanks so much!!
Steve and Deb
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Old 05-25-2016, 04:09 PM   #10
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Our vent pipe (same as yours) in Little Girl was used as a rib to attach the inner skin to. 8 or 9 rivets directly into the vent pipe. Not as bad as your hole, but still makes you wonder how stuff like that happens. I patched the holes with a mix of MEK and scrap ABS from building my black and gray tanks. Makes a wonderful slurry that sticks really well to ABS.

Another thing you could do is go to an RV store and buy a black tank repair kit. Basically black epoxy with a fiberglass patch. Rough up the surface of the pipe a bit with sandpaper before putting the patch on. I've repaired tanks that had rock holes bigger than your drilled hole, and they never leaked. Key seems to be putting two or three layers of epoxy on.

Good luck however you decide to fix it.

Chris
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Old 05-27-2016, 12:11 PM   #11
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Welcome to the world of forensic airstream archeology.

The vent hole was drilled from the inside. The telling is the direction of the tear-out along the saw kerf. I discovered the black ABS swarf swept under the bathtub along with other interior construction debris. Hiding construction debris in unfrequented areas instead of sweeping it out the door was/is common practice at jackson center, If it doesn't show, they'll never know.


Stick-build house framers are held to 1/4” in 4' square/plumb.. It seems Airstream interior installers are allowed 1" in 4'. My bulkhead that is common to the bath closet and kitchen, floor to ceiling was 1 ½” out of plumb/square.. Perhaps the stove vent hole was measured from the misplaced bulkhead instead of a more accurate measure from the entry door jamb.


The original steel vent pipe is something like 5” ID stovepipe. A coffee can should work, or make one from aluminum or stainless sheet. The range-hood fan motor is smaller and quieter than the very nearby roof vent fan. What I've read, in 1967/68 they were still using fan motors AC/DC 12-17V non-reversible, vestiges from an earlier electrical system design. The original fan might not keep up with all burners and oven going. Tons of 12V fans out there with just enough CFMs to evacuate odors, heat, and moisture that suits your indoor cooking style.


http://www.airforums.com/forums/f455...ari-86348.html
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Old 05-27-2016, 02:56 PM   #12
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Funny you mention Airstream archeology digs. I replaced the belly pan on the son's 69 Globetrotter last winter. I found 1/8" steel mandrel pop rivets amongst the other "droppings" that fell out with the old insulation. Fell out on me I might add. I was surprised to see them and kept some of them on the corner of the workbench as evidence.

David
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Old 06-06-2016, 12:43 PM   #13
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1968 20' Globetrotter
Rumford , Rhode Island
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As promised..... we went with the abs pipe option. We got it to bend a bit by heating it up. Not quite sure how good of a seal there is on the bottom side. We will use gasket maker to seal it up once the interior wall is out. Path of least resistance. It took a while because we are polishing.
You make me laugh with the archeological dig. We couldn't deal to see what's there. Shop vac all that stuff up including one dead mouse. We had another float out of the black tank.
Thanks everyone for your help.
Steve and Deb
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