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Old 06-10-2010, 02:01 PM   #1
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Pictures of my lock, need diagnosis!

Ok, so in reference to my other post, my lock doesnt lock..or it does lock, the previous owner said they got locked in (not sure how but anyway..)
So I got it off but I don't see anything obviously broken. The dead bolt doesnt stay up (there's a rubber band around it so it stays up and unlocked) so I'm thinking maybe there's a spring in there broken? You can turn the key so the little knobby lock part fits into the thing that's attached to the deadbolt but it just doesnt stay put and slides back down (or up) so it doesnt hold. I don't know how to take anything apart any more than I have, and I'm afraid I'll break it. There's what appears to be copper wire around the...cylinder (where the key goes). I'm going to need any info in newbie terms since I don't know what parts are what! Also, what's the best way to clean it and reseal it? I hesitate to put some kind of caulking around the outside in case it needs to come off again, but it definitely needs to be sealed. Also the handle isnt flush with the door, I read the other post about that and it says that is caused by trying to force the lock (makes sense) so there's probably something bent in there. Help!









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Old 06-10-2010, 03:38 PM   #2
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I know!

I just fixed a lock like this on a 76 Argosy, your missing a ball bearing and a spring and a allen screw, it is what puts pressure on the locking pin and gives it the click when you lock it. Go to Out of Doors Mart's website and they have a breakout of all the parts for this lock, and they sell new ones for over $400!!!

It goes in one of those open holes you see on the end.

Damon
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Old 06-10-2010, 03:47 PM   #3
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Things look pretty good. The return spring for the outer handle is there and holding the cam so as to allow the tongue to extend into the striker plate. Now that said if the handle is not sitting flush with the frame on the outside something may be bent but from your pictures the lock set seams to be sitting flat on the table.

As for the bead bolt. There is still a tongue on the lock cylinder so that should move the dead bolt up and down thus locking the door. However gravity will drop the dead bolt and lock the door since what appears to be missing is any form of spring to hold the dead bolt up in the unlocked position. I would assume that where the copper wire is now that there was a flat spring that added friction to the dead bolt to hold it up in the unlocked position. Can't see any reason for the copper to be there.

Remove the copper wire and study the dead bolt to see just how a spring would have to be there to keep the dead bolt in the unlocked position. I assume that was a flat spring that sat in the grove and touched the bolt at each end. Also the lock when placed in the unlocked position the tongue on the end of the cylinder may have held the bolt up. See if the cylinder when in the unlocked position hold the bolt up when the key is removed.
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Old 06-10-2010, 06:53 PM   #4
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Spring?

I don't think there is a spring on the dead bolt. Otherwise it would not stay in the locked position. I just went out to my Argosy (same door Latch). Slid the locking mechanism up and down, doesn't seem to be any spring resistance in either direction. When you try to lock it with the key. What happens? What should happen is the pin that protrudes from the end of the lock cylinder should go into the grove where the copper wire is and move the dead bolt up to prevent the lock from being actuated by the handle.
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Old 06-10-2010, 07:04 PM   #5
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In the 4th picture, just above and to the left of the big screw head there is a hole that is in line with the locking mechanism shaft. I'd bet the ball and spring and the screw all fell out. Try sticking something like a shiska bob stick in the hole and see if it puts side pressure on the locking shaft. If so the missing parts are the problem.
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Old 06-10-2010, 07:57 PM   #6
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I'll vote for the ball, spring, screw and detente in the shaft also.

There had to be some means of setting that shaft in each position.
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Old 06-10-2010, 08:07 PM   #7
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It looks like somebody used some wire to replace a lost C-clip that holds the lock cylinder in place. I agree with Twinkie there should be a ball, spring and set screw in that hole to hold the lock shaft in place either locked or unlocked.

Cheers, Dan
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Old 06-10-2010, 08:13 PM   #8
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When I lock it with the key it just the shaft thing just slips down, so you cant unlock it. I'm going to take it to the locksmith tomorrow, he said he'd look even though he probably couldnt do anything. Do we think the cylinder needs to be replaced because of that copper wire? I'm going to find something to stick in that hole to see what happens.
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Old 06-10-2010, 08:52 PM   #9
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I think I fixed it!!!! There's something in the hole to the left (looks like a hex shape) so I was looking at the hole on the right (both are threaded) and trying to figure out what would fit in there when I decided, hey, a screw! So as I was putting it in I thought wait a minute...you can use a screw for tension! So I screwed it all the way in and it does put enough tension on the dead bolt bar (or whatever it's called) that it would stay in position!!!!! So I'm heading to town tomorrow to find a screw with a small head so it will hopefully fit nicely. I'm a little anxious about getting it back into the door!
Now, should I clean all the grime off of the whole thing before I put it back in? Should I grease it with anything? I want to put a new gasket on, I think I'll probably just use weather stripping (looks like that was what was on there previously). When I put it back into the door can I just use a regular sealer to seal around it on the outside (the same stuff that I'm going to use to seal the rest of the seams?)
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Old 06-10-2010, 09:03 PM   #10
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You should not use a screw just to add pressure on the shaft of the bolt. That will ware in no time and you will be taking the lock apart again.

As mentioned above there was most likely a ball and spring in front of the screw(bolt) in that hole.

There are screws made that have the ball and spring built into one piece. The only way to tell what size ball was mated to the shaft is to remove the shaft and check the size of the detente holes on the shaft.
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Old 06-10-2010, 09:08 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MonaxLisa View Post
I think I fixed it!!!! There's something in the hole to the left (looks like a hex shape) so I was looking at the hole on the right (both are threaded) and trying to figure out what would fit in there when I decided, hey, a screw! So as I was putting it in I thought wait a minute...you can use a screw for tension! So I screwed it all the way in and it does put enough tension on the dead bolt bar (or whatever it's called) that it would stay in position!!!!! So I'm heading to town tomorrow to find a screw with a small head so it will hopefully fit nicely. I'm a little anxious about getting it back into the door!
Now, should I clean all the grime off of the whole thing before I put it back in? Should I grease it with anything? I want to put a new gasket on, I think I'll probably just use weather stripping (looks like that was what was on there previously). When I put it back into the door can I just use a regular sealer to seal around it on the outside (the same stuff that I'm going to use to seal the rest of the seams?)
You have the right idea but do not use a screw. It will wear a grove in the shaft and ruin it. You need a small ball with a spring and screw. The spring allows the ball to hold the shaft yet allow the shaft to move without harm. A locksmith or good hardware store should have what you need.

Yes clean it and lubricate what moves, I use white Lubriplate. Butyl rubber tape make a good gasket.

Cheers, Dan

HowieE seems to type just a bit faster than I do.
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Old 06-10-2010, 09:49 PM   #12
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Ok, well then I'll still go to the locksmith tomorrow and see if he has the stuff. So the ball, spring, screw (in that order from inside to out) should go in the hole where I put the screw, right? There isnt any sign of wear, indents etc at the base of that shaft so I'm pretty sure that's in good working order so long as I don't ruin it.
What should I use to clean it with?
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Old 06-10-2010, 10:30 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by MonaxLisa View Post
Ok, well then I'll still go to the locksmith tomorrow and see if he has the stuff. So the ball, spring, screw (in that order from inside to out) should go in the hole where I put the screw, right? There isnt any sign of wear, indents etc at the base of that shaft so I'm pretty sure that's in good working order so long as I don't ruin it.
What should I use to clean it with?
Ask your locksmith to clean and lube it while you are there. He should have some good stuff. I use mineral spirits, paint thinner, myself and blow dry with compressed air. Yes the ball, spring and screw in that order. You want a screw with a head so you can tighten it so it won't fall out or lose it's adjustment. The length of screw and spring tension will determine how hard it is to move the shaft up and down. You may have to try a few to get the right set up.

Good luck, Dan
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Old 06-10-2010, 11:33 PM   #14
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You'll probably need some thread locking compound on the screw to keep it in place after assembly...Lock-Tight like stuff...

Get a spray can of automotive brake cleaner to thoroughly clean all the parts of the old grease and grime - then you can lube the moving parts accordingly - I like to use Moly Wheel Bearing Grease for stuff like this - a little goes a long way...

Ray
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