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06-10-2010, 01:01 PM
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#1
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3 Rivet Member
1975 31' Excella 500
undetermined
, Washington
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 125
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Pictures of my lock, need diagnosis!
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06-10-2010, 02:38 PM
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#2
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Rivet Master
1998 31' Excella 1000
1979 23' Safari
Mooresville
, Indiana
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 598
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I know!
I just fixed a lock like this on a 76 Argosy, your missing a ball bearing and a spring and a allen screw, it is what puts pressure on the locking pin and gives it the click when you lock it. Go to Out of Doors Mart's website and they have a breakout of all the parts for this lock, and they sell new ones for over $400!!!
It goes in one of those open holes you see on the end.
Damon
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06-10-2010, 02:47 PM
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#3
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Rivet Master
1991 34' Excella
Princeton
, New Jersey
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 7,070
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Things look pretty good. The return spring for the outer handle is there and holding the cam so as to allow the tongue to extend into the striker plate. Now that said if the handle is not sitting flush with the frame on the outside something may be bent but from your pictures the lock set seams to be sitting flat on the table.
As for the bead bolt. There is still a tongue on the lock cylinder so that should move the dead bolt up and down thus locking the door. However gravity will drop the dead bolt and lock the door since what appears to be missing is any form of spring to hold the dead bolt up in the unlocked position. I would assume that where the copper wire is now that there was a flat spring that added friction to the dead bolt to hold it up in the unlocked position. Can't see any reason for the copper to be there.
Remove the copper wire and study the dead bolt to see just how a spring would have to be there to keep the dead bolt in the unlocked position. I assume that was a flat spring that sat in the grove and touched the bolt at each end. Also the lock when placed in the unlocked position the tongue on the end of the cylinder may have held the bolt up. See if the cylinder when in the unlocked position hold the bolt up when the key is removed.
__________________
WBCCI 12156 AIR 3144 WACHUNG TAC NJ6
2004 Excursion 4x4
1991 34 ft. Excella +220,000 miles, new laminated flooring, new upholstery, new 3200 lbs axles
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06-10-2010, 05:53 PM
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#4
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Rivet Master
1974 Argosy 26
Morrill
, Nebraska
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,014
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Spring?
I don't think there is a spring on the dead bolt. Otherwise it would not stay in the locked position. I just went out to my Argosy (same door Latch). Slid the locking mechanism up and down, doesn't seem to be any spring resistance in either direction. When you try to lock it with the key. What happens? What should happen is the pin that protrudes from the end of the lock cylinder should go into the grove where the copper wire is and move the dead bolt up to prevent the lock from being actuated by the handle.
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06-10-2010, 06:04 PM
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#5
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Rivet Master
1974 Argosy 26
Morrill
, Nebraska
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,014
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In the 4th picture, just above and to the left of the big screw head there is a hole that is in line with the locking mechanism shaft. I'd bet the ball and spring and the screw all fell out. Try sticking something like a shiska bob stick in the hole and see if it puts side pressure on the locking shaft. If so the missing parts are the problem.
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06-10-2010, 06:57 PM
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#6
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Rivet Master
1991 34' Excella
Princeton
, New Jersey
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 7,070
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I'll vote for the ball, spring, screw and detente in the shaft also.
There had to be some means of setting that shaft in each position.
__________________
WBCCI 12156 AIR 3144 WACHUNG TAC NJ6
2004 Excursion 4x4
1991 34 ft. Excella +220,000 miles, new laminated flooring, new upholstery, new 3200 lbs axles
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06-10-2010, 07:07 PM
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#7
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Rivet Master
1982 28' Airstream 280
Port Angeles
, Washington
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,943
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It looks like somebody used some wire to replace a lost C-clip that holds the lock cylinder in place. I agree with Twinkie there should be a ball, spring and set screw in that hole to hold the lock shaft in place either locked or unlocked.
Cheers, Dan
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06-10-2010, 07:13 PM
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#8
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3 Rivet Member
1975 31' Excella 500
undetermined
, Washington
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 125
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When I lock it with the key it just the shaft thing just slips down, so you cant unlock it. I'm going to take it to the locksmith tomorrow, he said he'd look even though he probably couldnt do anything. Do we think the cylinder needs to be replaced because of that copper wire? I'm going to find something to stick in that hole to see what happens.
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06-10-2010, 07:52 PM
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#9
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3 Rivet Member
1975 31' Excella 500
undetermined
, Washington
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 125
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I think I fixed it!!!! There's something in the hole to the left (looks like a hex shape) so I was looking at the hole on the right (both are threaded) and trying to figure out what would fit in there when I decided, hey, a screw! So as I was putting it in I thought wait a minute...you can use a screw for tension! So I screwed it all the way in and it does put enough tension on the dead bolt bar (or whatever it's called) that it would stay in position!!!!! So I'm heading to town tomorrow to find a screw with a small head so it will hopefully fit nicely. I'm a little anxious about getting it back into the door!
Now, should I clean all the grime off of the whole thing before I put it back in? Should I grease it with anything? I want to put a new gasket on, I think I'll probably just use weather stripping (looks like that was what was on there previously). When I put it back into the door can I just use a regular sealer to seal around it on the outside (the same stuff that I'm going to use to seal the rest of the seams?)
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06-10-2010, 08:03 PM
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#10
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Rivet Master
1991 34' Excella
Princeton
, New Jersey
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 7,070
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You should not use a screw just to add pressure on the shaft of the bolt. That will ware in no time and you will be taking the lock apart again.
As mentioned above there was most likely a ball and spring in front of the screw(bolt) in that hole.
There are screws made that have the ball and spring built into one piece. The only way to tell what size ball was mated to the shaft is to remove the shaft and check the size of the detente holes on the shaft.
__________________
WBCCI 12156 AIR 3144 WACHUNG TAC NJ6
2004 Excursion 4x4
1991 34 ft. Excella +220,000 miles, new laminated flooring, new upholstery, new 3200 lbs axles
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06-10-2010, 08:08 PM
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#11
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Rivet Master
1982 28' Airstream 280
Port Angeles
, Washington
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,943
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MonaxLisa
I think I fixed it!!!! There's something in the hole to the left (looks like a hex shape) so I was looking at the hole on the right (both are threaded) and trying to figure out what would fit in there when I decided, hey, a screw! So as I was putting it in I thought wait a minute...you can use a screw for tension! So I screwed it all the way in and it does put enough tension on the dead bolt bar (or whatever it's called) that it would stay in position!!!!! So I'm heading to town tomorrow to find a screw with a small head so it will hopefully fit nicely. I'm a little anxious about getting it back into the door!
Now, should I clean all the grime off of the whole thing before I put it back in? Should I grease it with anything? I want to put a new gasket on, I think I'll probably just use weather stripping (looks like that was what was on there previously). When I put it back into the door can I just use a regular sealer to seal around it on the outside (the same stuff that I'm going to use to seal the rest of the seams?)
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You have the right idea but do not use a screw. It will wear a grove in the shaft and ruin it. You need a small ball with a spring and screw. The spring allows the ball to hold the shaft yet allow the shaft to move without harm. A locksmith or good hardware store should have what you need.
Yes clean it and lubricate what moves, I use white Lubriplate. Butyl rubber tape make a good gasket.
Cheers, Dan
HowieE seems to type just a bit faster than I do.
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06-10-2010, 08:49 PM
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#12
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3 Rivet Member
1975 31' Excella 500
undetermined
, Washington
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 125
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Ok, well then I'll still go to the locksmith tomorrow and see if he has the stuff. So the ball, spring, screw (in that order from inside to out) should go in the hole where I put the screw, right? There isnt any sign of wear, indents etc at the base of that shaft so I'm pretty sure that's in good working order so long as I don't ruin it.
What should I use to clean it with?
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06-10-2010, 09:30 PM
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#13
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Rivet Master
1982 28' Airstream 280
Port Angeles
, Washington
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,943
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MonaxLisa
Ok, well then I'll still go to the locksmith tomorrow and see if he has the stuff. So the ball, spring, screw (in that order from inside to out) should go in the hole where I put the screw, right? There isnt any sign of wear, indents etc at the base of that shaft so I'm pretty sure that's in good working order so long as I don't ruin it.
What should I use to clean it with?
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Ask your locksmith to clean and lube it while you are there. He should have some good stuff. I use mineral spirits, paint thinner, myself and blow dry with compressed air. Yes the ball, spring and screw in that order. You want a screw with a head so you can tighten it so it won't fall out or lose it's adjustment. The length of screw and spring tension will determine how hard it is to move the shaft up and down. You may have to try a few to get the right set up.
Good luck, Dan
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06-10-2010, 10:33 PM
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#14
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Rivet Master
1978 28' Ambassador
Morada
, California
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,584
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You'll probably need some thread locking compound on the screw to keep it in place after assembly...Lock-Tight like stuff...
Get a spray can of automotive brake cleaner to thoroughly clean all the parts of the old grease and grime - then you can lube the moving parts accordingly - I like to use Moly Wheel Bearing Grease for stuff like this - a little goes a long way...
Ray
__________________
Ray & Pat; Morada, CA
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06-13-2010, 12:42 AM
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#15
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3 Rivet Member
1975 31' Excella 500
undetermined
, Washington
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 125
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My lock is fixed! Only $15 in labor (it took the locksmith a while). He told me that the copper wire is a home made fix and that the cylinder will eventually fall out, so I'll replace that soon, but for now at least my door locks! Thank you everyone for the help!
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