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Old 09-11-2011, 10:37 AM   #1
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Yay! 50 amp Service upgrade - Done

It was a challenge but we successfully upgraded to a 50 amp service with 8 breakers. Took us about 4 hours but we are ready for the 2nd AC; just in time for the temp to drop soon. If anyone needs an airstream 30 amp cable it's available.
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Old 09-12-2011, 05:17 AM   #2
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It was a challenge but we successfully upgraded to a 50 amp service with 8 breakers. Took us about 4 hours but we are ready for the 2nd AC; just in time for the temp to drop soon. If anyone needs an airstream 30 amp cable it's available.
I'd add another end and make it an extension cord for those times when I need an extension cord but don't need 50 amp service.

Congratulations on the conversion!
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Old 09-12-2011, 09:15 AM   #3
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No clue what your talking about but I will pass the suggestion on to the husband and see what he thinks.

Thanks for the reply!
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Old 10-25-2012, 09:32 AM   #4
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Diagram for 50 amp conversion.
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Old 10-25-2012, 09:37 AM   #5
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You need to break apart the ground and neutral. As shown in your diagram it is unsafe.
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Old 10-25-2012, 09:40 AM   #6
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I noticed that you tied neutral to ground inside the breaker box. On a 30amp system these two are isolated from each other on separate buses. I think it should be the same on 50amp service also, but I am not an electrical.
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Old 10-25-2012, 10:34 AM   #7
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I noticed that you tied neutral to ground inside the breaker box. On a 30amp system these two are isolated from each other on separate buses. I think it should be the same on 50amp service also, but I am not an electrical.
ABSOLUTELY!!!!

The ground and neutral should be on separate bus bars, NOT tied together for any RV installation. Your installation as posted is a recipe for disaster or worse.

I WOULD CORRECT THIS IMMEDIATELY AND NOT PLUG IN THE TRAILER TO YOUR POWER SOURCE UNTIL IT IS FIXED PROPERLY
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Old 10-25-2012, 10:59 AM   #8
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Also, the plug or receptacle you show is for 30amp 120/240vac, not 50amp service. And if it was the correct recptacle you have the ground and neutral reversed. Please hire an electrician before something bad happens.
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Old 10-25-2012, 11:13 AM   #9
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I haven't used a 50 amp service at a campground, but I think you will find that only half of your panel will be hot. Since I believe it is wired thru a single breaker and not a double pole breaker, which is typically how the 240 volt wiring is done in your home.
The neutral and ground should not be connected together. The neutral should not be bonded to the trailer body. Only the ground should be bonded to the trailer body.
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Old 10-25-2012, 11:33 AM   #10
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TG,
Not true. Both legs are hot and feed through a 2 pole breaker.
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Old 10-25-2012, 11:38 AM   #11
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If that scares you I guess you shouldn't look ten feet away at your service where the ground and neutral are always tied together. In small electrical boxes they generally are not available with a separate ground and neutral bar. FYI, you're no safer with the ground and neutral (aka a grounded conductor) separated. All your signal lights are using your trailer frame as the ground.
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Old 10-25-2012, 11:40 AM   #12
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You don't understand the basics of electrical safety. Please stop before you burn down your trailer.
Also, you should have bought a box with mains breakers, not a mains lug box. You are in way over your head.
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Old 10-25-2012, 11:46 AM   #13
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Why would I need two breakers? There is a 50 amp breaker right outside. The original box that I replaced did not have a main breaker either.
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Old 10-25-2012, 11:51 AM   #14
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The original box probably had a main breaker, you just didn't notice that it was backfed from the inlet.
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Old 10-25-2012, 12:15 PM   #15
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Every electrical box I have seen has both the neutral and ground hooked to the same bus inside the breaker box. There is no other way to do it if you use a standard box. You do need separate neutral and ground wires leading away from the box to the various circuits in the trailer. There should also be a ground between the box and the trailer. It is not a bad idea to have a separate ground stake outside the trailer as well.

I think AS turned a standard box on my trailer into a 120V box by backfeeding through a 30 AMP breaker and then jumpering the two hot rails together so both sets of breakers work.

Perry
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Old 10-25-2012, 12:39 PM   #16
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Every electrical box I have seen has both the neutral and ground hooked to the same bus inside the breaker box.
Perry
This is untrue. The only electrical box where the gound and neutral are bonded is the MAIN SERVICE PANEL, not a subpanel. Subpanels always have separate ground and neutral. Most of the panels you buy at Home Depot or Lowes have a removable bonding connection between the ground and neutral bus.

You're supposed to read the directions and understand whether you are installing a main panel or a subpanel. If it's a subpanel, you need to buy a grounding bus and install it in the panel. There are always holes and a location for the ground bar.

The main panel in a trailer is really a subpanel, and via the power cord plugs into an outlet. The box where you plug in the power cord is the main panel and that is where the ground and neutral are bonded.

Any other method is incorrect and unsafe. Please if you don't understand the rules, call a professional.
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Old 10-25-2012, 12:50 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by markdoane View Post
This is untrue. The only electrical box where the gound and neutral are bonded is the MAIN SERVICE PANEL, not a subpanel. Subpanels always have separate ground and neutral. Most of the panels you buy at Home Depot or Lowes have a removable bonding connection between the ground and neutral bus.

You're supposed to read the directions and understand whether you are installing a main panel or a subpanel. If it's a subpanel, you need to buy a grounding bus and install it in the panel. There are always holes and a location for the ground bar.

The main panel in a trailer is really a subpanel, and via the power cord plugs into an outlet. The box where you plug in the power cord is the main panel and that is where the ground and neutral are bonded.

Any other method is incorrect and unsafe. Please if you don't understand the rules, call a professional.
X2 X2... Well said!

This is an easy fix, just get the neutral busbar that can be isolated from the metal panel and you will be done.
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Old 10-25-2012, 12:50 PM   #18
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Typically a box you get a places like Home Depot is set up to use as a Main Distribution Box. Not as a Sub Panel.
The panel in your trailer is considered a Sub Panel.
Depending on the use there is a long green screw called a Bonding Screw that is used to BOND the neutral buss to the cabinet. In the case of a Main Panel, this screw would be inserted thru a hole in the neutral buss and screwed into the chassis or metal box. These panels have provisions for a ground buss as well, which by the method of mounting bonds the ground buss to the cabinet or metal box.
In the case if a Sub panel, the neutral is not bonded.
There are a number if sights on the web that give specifics on RV wiring. Both the 120 volt side as well as the 12 volt side.
Don't confuse the AC ground circuit with the DC ground circuit. They are 2 different animals.
The AC ground is for SAFETY.
The DC ground is a method used to save wire. Where the chassis of the trailer is used for the return path on most DC circuits. It was mislabeled years ago in the Auto industry and has carried over to the RV industry. It should have been labeled "Common", since it is the negative side of the DC circuits and is "Common" to all DC components in the RV. There are typically no switching devices on the Common side of the circuit.
I would strongly recommend that you do your homework on this subject. If not totally competent about what you are doing. Hire someone who is. Your LIFE could depend on it.
There is a web site: dasplace.net/RVWiring/wiring.hotmail
Check it out.
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Old 10-25-2012, 12:57 PM   #19
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Here is another web site. With better info: www.myrv.us/electric/
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Old 10-25-2012, 01:22 PM   #20
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Ok so why is it unsafe for the neutral and ground to be connected in a sub panel?

Here is a link I found on what the problem is.

http://inspectapedia.com/electric/El...utral_Lost.htm

I need to look at my shop wiring. Looks like I need to separate the blocks and also put in a ground stake.

Perry
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