PD4655 Install with Pictures

[Troutboy]

What PCSkier said. He said it very well. I am a geek engineer that studies things inside out. Plain and simple, ask manufactures. Can't get to full charge unless above 14 V.

Now is full charge important, i think so, but I'm no expert....

If you want the healthiest batteries and do any off grid camper no, invest in a better charger. Money well spent and you don't have to spend thousands to get this right.

[pcskier]

Originally Posted by Troutboy

What PCSkier said. He said it very well. I am a geek engineer that studies things inside out. Plain and simple, ask manufactures. Can't get to full charge unless above 14 V.

Now is full charge important, i think so, but I'm no expert....

If you want the healthiest batteries and do any off grid camper no, invest in a better charger. Money well spent and you don't have to spend thousands to get this right.

I study stuff as well, probably too much for my own good

You said something important though. Is a full charge important? For someone who is plugged in whenever camping, and there are many who only camp in RV Parks or places with hookups...nope, full charge nor battery condition matter. And nobody is the wiser.

For those who go off grid, is a full charge important. Absolutely. A full battery will read 12.7 volts. A 50% discharged battery will read 12.1 volts, and that is the LOWEST the manufacturers of flooded cell batteries say you should go to avoid damage. So if your battery never gets further than 90% charged, which would read 12.6 volts...that's actually 20 percent less stored power to use (based on the total available stored power you can use without going below 50% of total battery storage.)

I looked at Interstate's website, as many AS's are factory equipped with Interstate batteries. Even they say that Bulk Charge Voltage is 14.7V, from 2-4 hours...so even the PD4655 could bump up from 14.4 if they chose to, and do an even better job. But the Parallax rep's statement that the 14.4V from the PD4655 can cause battery damage is not true according to the battery manufacturer.

So yeah...charge matters!

Lastly, when I bring my trailer (which has 'new' batteries that have been on a tender all winter) home to do the converter changeout, I am going to do some testing--measuring the voltage on the batteries, and the Specific Gravity from each battery; install and use some power in the trailer to draw them down, and re-measure everything; then charge using the stock converter, measure again; put back on tender if needed to match initial charge; change converter, hook in batteries and run down with same useage for same time; then charge back up using the PD4655...and measure everything again. I hope to be enlightened by any differences noted, particularly if the new converter actually increases the stored charge. I'll report back with results after I do this.

[Snowy]

When I'm back home I'll test the 8355 that I removed from my 2016 flying cloud. I'll hook it up to the interstate battery which I removed at the same time. I'll monitor both the voltage and current. I'll leave it connected like this for a couple of days and see what the converter does. Then I'll simulate some loads on the setup, some with the converter powered, some just drawing off the battery and monitor the converter post scenario.

I'll post the raw data to allow others to make a fact based decision on if they change out the stock converter rather than one based opinions.

[The Colonel]

How much current does the 4655 draw during normal cycle, blink every 1-2 sec.? I'm trying to track down a lot of juice during WH, AC and other stuff. Popped a 30A breaker yesterday.

[68 Overlander]

Originally Posted by dblee1950

How much current does the 4655 draw during normal cycle, blink every 1-2 sec.? I'm trying to track down a lot of juice during WH, AC and other stuff. Popped a 30A breaker yesterday.

950 watts max so the blinking of what mode it's in isn't going to give you an exact answer.

[Snowy]

So I started my testing. This is not scientific, I'm just playing and while I'm an EE I'm no battery expert.

The converter I'm testing



No load voltage



The battery, no load voltage. Fully charged recently.



Ampere meter hooked up with converter connected.



Time to add a load, the inverter i removed from my Bambi. Connected to that is a fan heater. On medium it draws about 750 watts



Converter powered up, inverter powering fan heater. I'm impressed, the converter is pumping 55 amps!



Turned off inverter, looks like the converter took the full force of the draw.



Turned off converter and ran inverter with fan heater for 5 minutes. Big time draw off the battery.



Turned off inverter and turned on converter. It spiked at around 50 amp charge and rapidly fell.



A couple of minutes in. Amps dropped. Voltage getting back up to 13.8v



After 10 minutes



I'll run the converter overnight and post the final data. So far it looks like the converter keeps the voltage at 13.8/13.9v which seems a little high. My VMax batteries state no more than 13.8v float... not sure what the float for the interstate batteries is.

[Snowy]

And 8 hours later



Other than the constant voltage the 8355 performed well imo.

[68 Overlander]

Originally Posted by Snowy

And 8 hours later

Attachment 282560

Other than the constant voltage the 8355 performed well imo.

This last photo is what causes early battery failure...Good demo.

[68 Overlander]

Originally Posted by Snowy

And 8 hours later

Attachment 282560

Other than the constant voltage the 8355 performed well imo.

Do you mind if we use this photo? I can make the same one but it's been 13 years and I don't have the exact one with the Parallax voltage. Can certainly duplicate if you don't want that. Thanks.
R

[Snowy]

If anyone wants to buy the same amp meter I was using in this demo, it's cheap and available on Amazon

bayite DC 5-120V 100A Mini Digital Current Voltage Amp Meter Gauge with Hall Effect Sensor Transformer https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01DDQM6Z4..._z3N4ybX73PRRF

Nothing to do with me, just a handy dandy little device.

Only reads up to 99.9 amps, 12volts so don't use it on a hot wire to a big inverter. Not as accurate as more expensive options but great for the price imo.

Cheers

[Spinonedad]

So, what's the final verdict ?
My new FC has the 8355 installed

Is it going to kill my batteries if plugged in over summer?
I'm ready to order the 4655 converter

[GenXair]

Great post! Following for near future reference.

Thanks.

[The Colonel]

Have the 4655 installed but have yet heard fans running. I hear an electrical noise occasionally but not sure if all is well

[68 Overlander]

Originally Posted by dblee1950

Have the 4655 installed but have yet heard fans running. I hear an electrical noise occasionally but not sure if all is well

Anticipating fan run will drive you crazy. It runs when it needs to and temp controlled. It has it's own hot flashes but takes care of itself.

[Wconley]

I want to thank Snowy and all those that asked questions so that today when I upgraded to the PD4655 it was a piece of cake. Something I've wanted to do since last winter to protect my almost four year old batteries.

[pcskier]

Installed my PD4655 in my 2014 FC 23 FB today, replacing the stock Parallax 7355. Pretty straight forward but were a few differences that I encountered from the provided instructions and updates to Snowy's install pics and instructions (since I chose the remote pendant) as well as some further comments on this thread.

1. You can leave the old 12v distribution board in place if you wish. Changing out the board is the toughest part of the job. It just won't have the blinking light to indicate charge mode status, nor the override button that allows you to change the charge mode manually.

2. If you choose to leave the old 12v board in place, but want the functionality of being able to see the blinking light and have the override button, you can order the remote pendant along with your new unit. It's only $15 if you choose to order one along with your new converter. You can then plug it in to the 120v board in your new unit, and mount it outside the louvered cover. Or just leave it inside if you want to have access to it but don't want to see it at a glance.

3. If you want to have the charge status light and the override button, but don't care about the remote pendant, you will replace the existing 12v board with the new one. Then there is a provided cable that plugs into the new 12v board on one end, and into the 120v board on the new converter. No splicing required. You then need to open the cover whenever you want to see the charge status or override it.

4. I wanted to have the remote pendant to mount outside the cover, but ALSO have the ability to revert to the indicator light and override button that is on the 12v board. This was in case the pendant ever failed, or for whatever reason I decided not to use it. So in my case, I installed the new 12v board. Then I plugged the provided cable into it, but left the other end disconnected and just left it tucked in behind the cover. It's a dead connection so no harm done. This was so I would not lose the cable should I need it later. Then, you plug the pendant into the unused plug on the 120v board that normally would have the cable plugged in. I then mounted the pendant just outside the cover, on the left. Very neat and out of the way, and I can see the charge status at a glance.

5. To use the new 12v board, the heavy red and white battery wires would not reach the lugs on the board, no way were they long enough. I had to remove the four screws securing the entire power center to the wall, and pull it out a few inches...there is enough slack to do so. Then, I loosened the screws on the strain relief on the back of the power center that is holding those wires, so that I could pull a few more inches of both of them into the power center chassis. Then retightened the strain relief and pushed the power center back in. This allowed enough slack of those two fat wires to run up behind the new board as required, and bend over the top for installation in the lugs.

6. The last thing, I installed my 8 or 9 DC distribution wires from the old board to the new board in the exact same fuse positions. After, I realized that the first two positions on the left had the fuses offset a bit higher than the original, and the board had writing on it saying "recommended for low current circuits." I don't think it makes any difference, I believe that is just a place to put low current circuits that might be required in other applications/rv's, and have them be obvious by the offset fuse positions. In my case, all the fuses were 15A, so I have 15A fuses in those first two positions. I emailed Randy to ask if it actually matters--and if so, will just have to move my DC distribution wires 2 places to the right and leave the "low current" fuse places empty.

That's about it. Oh yeah...make sure you remember that there are four new screws provided to put the cover back on...they are smaller than the stock ones, which are too big to fit the holes in the new unit. Took me about a half hour of cussing before I figured out I had put them aside earlier and forgotten about them.

Overall, pretty easy. I'd recommend taking some photos before you take stuff apart though just to be sure of what wires go where. Mine's in the driveway on shore power so hopefully there won't be a heap of melted aluminum in the morning.

Sorry for the sideways pic, it uploaded straight but posted this way.

[ATownTX]

I'm installing mine today with the board but my pendent arrives next week. For those interested, the converter is shipped and sold by Amazon and is part of the Prime program. The pendent is from a 3rd party on Amazon but I think Amazon offers them too as part of their Prime program.

I have the same 2016 FC 19' as the OP so I should be able to install it exactly as in the OP's photos.

[Wconley]

Pcskier, your installation description is identical to my experience with our 23D, down to cussing about the cover screws. I too left the original control cable plugged into the 12v board so I wouldn't lose it. However, I didn't use the low current positions for the circuits.

[pcskier]

Originally Posted by Wconley

Pcskier, your installation description is identical to my experience with our 23D, down to cussing about the cover screws. I too left the original control cable plugged into the 12v board so I wouldn't lose it. However, I didn't use the low current positions for the circuits.

While I don't think it matters, I'm bothered enough having used the low current positions that I'm going to go back in and move all the DC wires over two positions. Probably being a bit OCD but....

[Snowy]

Originally Posted by pcskier

While I don't think it matters, I'm bothered enough having used the low current positions that I'm going to go back in and move all the DC wires over two positions. Probably being a bit OCD but....

That's not OCD, thats the right thing to do IMO. I can't confirm but I bet that the PCB tracks are thinner for those fused connection, hence the warning to use them only for low current circuits.

I'm pretty sure I mentioned this in the original write up. Well at least a note saying I didn't use them.



I'm happy that the thread and pictures are helpful.