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07-25-2015, 03:25 PM
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#1
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1 Rivet Member
1962 26' Overlander
Los Angeles
, California
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 12
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I need an Inverter, help me please!
Hello,
I have two go power 100w panels and a 12 volt deep cycle battery. I need a good inverter that will change my 12v to 110v.
I thought my old converter was capable of that but apparently not. I see the prices range from $150-$3,000+.
I really don't want to spend more than $300 but I need it to be capable to wire up to my entire airstream and not just provide me two 110v outlets on the inverter itself.
Any ideas guys?
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07-25-2015, 03:26 PM
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#2
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1 Rivet Member
1962 26' Overlander
Los Angeles
, California
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 12
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I think I want a pure sine wave in the 1,000w range...?
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07-25-2015, 04:11 PM
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#3
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Rivet Master
1974 Argosy 20
2014 20' Flying Cloud
Kooskia
, Idaho
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 4,591
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What you want is not available in the $300 range. It takes special inverters and transfer switches to power any outlet in the Airstream safely. Some things have to be isolated from the inverter in all cases, such as the water heater, the refrigerator, and the AC unit, as well as the converter charger.
What you really need may be different from what you want, and I am not trying to be snarky or funny.
More information on what you are using it for is necessary. You also probably will need more battery capacity than a single battery you indicate you have now.
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07-25-2015, 04:47 PM
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#4
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Full Time Adventurer
2007 27' International CCD FB
Nomadic
, USA
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 2,748
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I was just about to say, you are not going to get a pure shine wave inverter in the $1000 watt range of good quality for under $300.
I paid close to $425 for my Samlex 600 watt inverter, model PST-60S-12A - almost everything I have I purchased 12v plugs for. I installed 12v USB outlets for our phones, my router is 12v, the LTE booster is 12v and our laptop's have 12v chargers.
I power our TV, Apple TV and my 19 inch ultra-wide screen monitor with the inverter while working during the day.
So far so good. Wife doesn't use a blow dryer or hair straighten, we don't use a microwave (threw it out) and we make french press coffee, so no coffee maker.
__________________
Family of 5 exploring the USA with a Ram Power Wagon & Airstream in tow.
OUR BLOG | INSTAGRAM
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07-25-2015, 05:15 PM
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#5
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Rivet Master
1978 25' Tradewind
Metro Phoenix
, Arizona
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,524
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Observation: You're not going to get too many hours of 1000 watt power out of a single battery. Like 1 hour. Let's say you could draw 100 Amp-hours out of your battery; that's 1200 Watt-hours, right? So, if you had a really high efficiency inverter, you might get an hour out of it.
Solar panels are usually good for 5 equivalent full sun hours a day, so your 1000 Watt-hours would just about equal the typical daily output of your panels.
Question: Do you need pure sine wave power for all your 120V applications? Would it be possible to use a cheaper modified sine wave inverter for some uses and a smaller pure sine wave inverter for others?
__________________
"Between what matters and what seems to matter, how should the world we know judge wisely?" - E.C. Bentley, Trent's Last Case
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07-25-2015, 06:49 PM
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#6
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Rivet Master
2013 27' FB International
El Dorado Hills
, California
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 2,023
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I have this inverter.
http://www.amazon.com/MorningStar-SI.../dp/B002MW6PLW
It's about $300 and it's pure sine. It is 300 watts all day and 600 watts for 15 minutes. Practically speaking, this is about all the two 12 volt batteries on our Airatreams can deal with without damage. With this inverter you'll have to figure out a way to wire into outlets. I did wire into all my outlets in a way that switches between street and the inverter, but it wasn't a trivial project.
For the most part I use the inverter to charge tablets, phones, the TV, vacuum, and small kitchen appliances. Never wished for more power.
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07-25-2015, 06:57 PM
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#7
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Rivet Master
Commercial Member
Vintage Kin Owner
Naples
, Florida
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 7,508
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I'm staying out of this one!
__________________
lewster
Solar Tech Energy Systems, Inc.
Victron Solar Components and Inverters, Zamp Solar Panels, LiFeBlue and Battle Born Lithium Batteries, Lifeline AGM Batteries
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07-25-2015, 07:02 PM
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#8
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Dazed and Confused
Currently Looking...
1983 31' Airstream310
Hillsburgh
, Ontario
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 3,805
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lewster
I'm staying out of this one!
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What Lewster? You're not going to pull a rabbit out of your hat and give him what he wants for the price he wants to pay??
You get what you pay for, and $300 isn't going to get you much.
Cheers
Tony
__________________
Per Mare, Per Terram and may all your campaigns be successful.
“It’s a recession when your neighbor loses his job; it’s a depression when you lose your own.” "Harry S Truman"
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07-25-2015, 07:11 PM
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#9
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Rivet Master
1974 31' Sovereign
1979 23' Safari
Wayland
, New York
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,632
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Don't forget the fridge on auto will try to switch to 120vac by itself, uses several hundred watts so if you're not thinking about it, it will suck the battery down quickly.
You don't want to discharge a battery below 50% on a regular basis, unless you want to buy new ones frequently.
One battery won't get you far on a big inverter lots of draw. Remember for every 1 amp of 120vac you are using a little more than 10 amps 12vdc. It adds up quickly, even with 200w solar.
If you think it all out and make sure you turn off any big loads you could wire an extension cord with 2 male ends, plug one into the inverter, one into an outlet. This would work up to 15 amps. Unless you have reverse power protected circuit breakers, which you won't, the electricity doesn't care where it comes from and flows to.
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07-25-2015, 07:14 PM
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#10
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Rivet Master
2006 25' Safari
St. Augustine
, Florida
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 2,670
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Ha, Lewster. LOL. I will share that I just replaced my inverter that BURNED UP and was rarely used. Nothing overloaded, not even being used at the time. I went with a GoPower Pure Sine this time. The previous was Xantrex. Lewster says, Chinese junk, I hear him but here is a question. Who makes a pure sine unit with outlets on the unit and not hardwired into the trailer requiring a wiring job? I found no one even Magnum. I called them. So, those of us who just want a bit of power with smaller needs have Shanghai door #1 or Peking door #2 to choose from. BTW a 1000 watt Xantrex Pure Sine is about $300. A Go Power 1000 watt is $423. Check out their websites.
I purchased a 1500watt model just to be able to add my coffee maker to the fray when needed for short bursts. Everything else is much less power. It still provides a 600 watt ceiling when it is used so I am good to go. Note the continuous wattage rating when you shop and the high voltage cutoff. I understand it is better the higher the voltage with solar.
__________________
WBCCI 8653/AIR 60240
2022 Ford F150 PowerBoost Platinum w/7.2KW
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07-25-2015, 07:22 PM
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#11
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Rivet Master
1972 31' Sovereign
1975 31' Excella 500
Currently Looking...
Benton
, Arkansas
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 5,868
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I need an Inverter, help me please!
I have used a modified sine wave inverter to power my entire trailer for over two years now, I haven't blown anything up any appliances, electronics, or fixtures yet...
Of course my trailer is kind of rudimentary, but my furnace and water heater do use computers.
__________________
The fact that I am opinionated does not presuppose that I am wrong......
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07-25-2015, 07:40 PM
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#13
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Rivet Master
1974 31' Sovereign
1979 23' Safari
Wayland
, New York
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,632
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Good write ups on
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07-25-2015, 08:39 PM
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#14
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Rivet Master
Commercial Member
Vintage Kin Owner
Naples
, Florida
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 7,508
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HiJoeSilver
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Made in USA I might add!!! An excellent unit if you can get by with 300 watts.
__________________
lewster
Solar Tech Energy Systems, Inc.
Victron Solar Components and Inverters, Zamp Solar Panels, LiFeBlue and Battle Born Lithium Batteries, Lifeline AGM Batteries
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07-25-2015, 09:29 PM
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#15
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Rivet Master
2013 27' FB International
El Dorado Hills
, California
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 2,023
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[QUOte=An excellent unit if you can get by with 300 watts.[/QUOTE]
As a user of this unit I have to wonder (1) what would you do with more power and (2) how long would the two standard Airstream batteries last?
Because we so rarely hook up when camping when we do the only things different are use of air conditioner and microwave. The inverter powers the TV and all small appliances fine.
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07-25-2015, 09:49 PM
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#16
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Rivet Master
1974 Argosy 20
2014 20' Flying Cloud
Kooskia
, Idaho
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 4,591
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HiJoeSilver
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The Morningstar 300 watt pure sine wave is an excellent unit and I have one myself plus 3 others in service at Forest Service Campgrounds that I do volunteer solar work at. They seem to be bulletproof, and have very low idle current draw compared to virtually all other sine wave inverters I have found. They also have a great search function which turns them on automatically when a 120 volt load of over 10 watts is turned on. When the load is removed, they go back to search, taking almost no power.
All in the campgrounds are turned on in the spring, and off in the fall. They simply work. In my FC 20 I leave mine on most of the time from spring to fall, but occasionally use the big clunky original 1000 watt WFCO to run the microwave or toaster. I have a switch which allows me to run the dedicated inverter outlets on either inverter.
The 300 watt Morningstar Pure Sine is a great unit.
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07-26-2015, 10:10 AM
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#17
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1 Rivet Member
1962 26' Overlander
Los Angeles
, California
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 12
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Thank you guys so much for all of your replies! It has definitely helped me get a better understanding of what is going on.
Let me be more specific about my needs and current equipment and hopefully that will better guide the advice.
During the day I would like to be able to charge laptop and cellphones, have the ability to run the fridge 24hrs and power two 12v fantastic vents 24hrs.
The fridge is a Haier mini fridge that pulls 2 Amps.
I won't have a major need for power in the evening mainly during day light hours.
I do not have a furnace, stove or other major appliance to power.
My current equipment:
2- 100w go electric flex panels mounted parallel
Full River G-31 12volt Battery 128@100hrs and 91@5hrs
WFCO 55 Amp Power Converter
As I mentioned ideally I would love to spend $300 but could do up to $500 or $600 if necessary. I just want to get it to the power level that will meet my needs.
Realistically what do I need?
Inverter size?
Should I get another panel and battery?
For my needs, can my current panels and battery handle the constant energy flow without draining my battery down below 50% during sunlight hours? Can my panels and battery keep up with the energy demand of laptop, cell phones, fridge and fans?
And will the fridge be able to stay on 24/7 without causing a battery drain problem.
I probably sound mentally challenged. This is just a new arena for us and want to do it right.
Thanks again for all of your help!!!
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07-26-2015, 10:12 AM
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#18
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1 Rivet Member
1962 26' Overlander
Los Angeles
, California
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 12
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Over $600 (for the inverter) will be tough for me to convince my wife...I'm sure you know how that goes.
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07-26-2015, 12:05 PM
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#19
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Rivet Master
1974 Argosy 20
2014 20' Flying Cloud
Kooskia
, Idaho
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 4,591
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jandna:
I am going to try to esmate your loads from the information you have provided.
I will do it in amp hours at 12 volts, that is 1 amp for 1 hour = 1 amp hour.
The Fantastic vent fans on low take about 1 amp each, medium about 1.3 amps and high about 1.6 amps.
Assuming you are running two on low for 24 hours you will use 2 amps x 24 hours = 48 amp hours.
The mini fridge, although small is an inefficient device. People think that small = low energy use but only if well made and designed efficient. The little dorm refrigerators are not built that way. I have made some studies and find that most of the little refrigerators take about 50 watts per hour on a 24 hour basis. Then there is an inverter loss to power them from 12 volts, which probably adds another 10 watts per hour. So, lets say 60 watts per hour average. 60watts / 12 volts = 5 amps on average each hour. (watts = volts x amps).
So the refrigerator takes 5 amps per hour x 24 hours = 120 amp hours.
It is hard to estimate your laptop and cell phone charging needs, but I am going to toss in another 15 amp hours for them.
Total is now up to 48 + 120 + 15 = 183 amp hours per day. As you can see the refrigerator is your killer. Even if I am off by 50% high, it is still a killer.
On average your 200 watt portable solar panels will probably deliver 70% of that rated number, or 140 watts. 140watts/12 volts = 11.6 amps per hour. Say 5 hours of sunshine gives you a production of 11.6 amps x 5 hours = 57 amp hours a day.
You can see that 57 amp hours per day will barely run your two fans on low for 24 hours. (48 amp hours).
Solar is great, inverters are great, batteries are only storage devices. Your loads and wants are too high for your production capacity. You must reduce your load, or increase your production capacity, or both to even come close. The inverter is not your issue as much as your other problems to deal with first.
Sorry to be a wet blanket here, but I hope the numbers help with your understanding.
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07-27-2015, 12:29 PM
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#20
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Rivet Master
1972 29' Ambassador
Boynton Beach
, Florida
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 568
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I tossed out my old converter, and wired in a XANTREX FREEDOM XMIC 1000 INVERTER CHARGER. It's about $336 at Amazon (just checked), so it's in your price range. I've liked it so far, but I have had to diddle with the install to get it to work right. I agree with the other posters in that you need to keep all of the heavy usage items away from the inverter, so I had to split my AC panel; one part for incoming shore power, and another part for inverted AC. I've installed a utility plug circuit on the shore power side that doesn't touch the inverter. This is for high power stuff like my espresso maker, ceramic heater, and toaster oven. My Xantrex doesn't like high loads, even when running shore power through it! I've color-coded the plugs to make it easier to distinguish them.
Had I it do over, I'd go with the 1800w model. You should also look into a good RV surge/dip protector. Some of these funky campgrounds deliver up some sketchy power!
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