Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 04-14-2009, 07:01 PM   #15
4 Rivet Member
 
Pacerized's Avatar
 
1981 25' Excella II
Dillon , Colorado
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 397
Images: 11
It looks like you pay approx. 5 times as much per amp hour with the lifeline or the optima then you do for a wet cell deep cycle battery. I don't think they last 5 times as long, so since you bring up value for the $, I'd look into a good wet cell battery as an option.
__________________

__________________
Pacerized is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-14-2009, 09:07 PM   #16
CLOUDSPLITTER "Tahawas"
 
ROBERT CROSS's Avatar

 
2003 25' Classic
Zanadude Nebula , WNY
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 11,153
Images: 1
Wink


Value is in the eye of the Streamer.

BTW... Lifelines are a "wet" cell battery.
__________________

__________________
PFC.....

“After all these years the reason I continue to love Thanksgiving.....I still sit at the kids table.”
RLC

Sandra wanted to go to Cleveland on vacation,
but I’m the Husband, so we went to Cleveland.
RLC
ROBERT CROSS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2013, 10:46 AM   #17
2 Rivet Member
 
1973 29' Ambassador
Seattle , Washington
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 90
I know this is an old thread, but wanted to share. since my univolt killed my interstate g27, I upgraded to a PD9245.

At the same time, I was looking for ways to increase power capacity, so instead of another single G27 in the outside compartment, I raised the "floor" of the closet curbside between the bunk and the bathtub to make room for (I think) up to three AGM batteries. I recently scored two G27 100AH batteries from amazon for a crazy price! ($168 each/delivered) This was the cheapest price I've found anywhere, per AH, for AGMs.

Two disclosures
1. yes, I know you technically should vent AGMs. I'm a chemist and will evaluate once they're in operation to determine if I need to build and vent a box for them
2. Yes, I know the universals are not seen as great as the lifelines, but these are a fraction of the price.

AGMs were selected for the (hopeful) ability to be used inside the cabin, and their ability to not self discharge rapidly, since coach is stored an hour away from me most of the time.

Universal Power Group 45978 Sealed Lead Acid Battery - Amazon.com
__________________
dcheshire is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2013, 02:31 PM   #18
CLOUDSPLITTER "Tahawas"
 
ROBERT CROSS's Avatar

 
2003 25' Classic
Zanadude Nebula , WNY
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 11,153
Images: 1
Question To good to be true...

Quote:
Originally Posted by dcheshire View Post
I know this is an old thread, but wanted to share. since my univolt killed my interstate g27, I upgraded to a PD9245.

At the same time, I was looking for ways to increase power capacity, so instead of another single G27 in the outside compartment, I raised the "floor" of the closet curbside between the bunk and the bathtub to make room for (I think) up to three AGM batteries. I recently scored two G27 100AH batteries from amazon for a crazy price! ($168 each/delivered) This was the cheapest price I've found anywhere, per AH, for AGMs.

Two disclosures
1. yes, I know you technically should vent AGMs. I'm a chemist and will evaluate once they're in operation to determine if I need to build and vent a box for them
2. Yes, I know the universals are not seen as great as the lifelines, but these are a fraction of the price.

AGMs were selected for the (hopeful) ability to be used inside the cabin, and their ability to not self discharge rapidly, since coach is stored an hour away from me most of the time.

Universal Power Group 45978 Sealed Lead Acid Battery - Amazon.com
I don't see anywhere in the description that they are AGM batteries.
100ah sealed grp27.

The AGM's we purchased were described as such, same with the Optima's.

Bob
__________________
PFC.....

“After all these years the reason I continue to love Thanksgiving.....I still sit at the kids table.”
RLC

Sandra wanted to go to Cleveland on vacation,
but I’m the Husband, so we went to Cleveland.
RLC
ROBERT CROSS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2013, 03:10 PM   #19
CLOUDSPLITTER "Tahawas"
 
ROBERT CROSS's Avatar

 
2003 25' Classic
Zanadude Nebula , WNY
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 11,153
Images: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS View Post
I don't see anywhere in the description that they are AGM batteries.
100ah sealed grp27.

The AGM's we purchased were described as such, same with the Optima's.

Bob
OOOp's

On edit.... found it noted in the fine print...

Bob
__________________
PFC.....

“After all these years the reason I continue to love Thanksgiving.....I still sit at the kids table.”
RLC

Sandra wanted to go to Cleveland on vacation,
but I’m the Husband, so we went to Cleveland.
RLC
ROBERT CROSS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2013, 03:21 PM   #20
2 Rivet Member
 
1973 29' Ambassador
Seattle , Washington
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 90
Hi Bob,

Great question. You caused me to double check the specs on the MFG site and it is AGM http://upgi.com/Themes/leanandgreen/...oads/45978.pdf

It's no lifeline, but.

PS, love your posts, thanks for being such an active member of this community!
__________________
dcheshire is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2013, 03:48 PM   #21
Rivet Master
 
vswingfield's Avatar
 
1983 34' Excella
1967 24' Tradewind
Little Rock , Arkansas
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 3,773
Images: 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBERT CROSS View Post
OOOp's

On edit.... found it noted in the fine print...

Bob
I had to use the "Find" feature on FireFox to locate it. It wasn't featured prominently at all.
__________________
Vaughan
vswingfield is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2013, 05:18 PM   #22
Rivet Master
Commercial Member
 
lewster's Avatar
 
Vintage Kin Owner
Naples, FL , Hood River, OR
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 7,281
You'll pardon my cynicism, but NO amount of dollar savings will replace a superior product made in the USA with a 5 year warranty for a Chinese knock-off that will probably be dead in 3 years.

You simply can not duplicate the superior construction of a Lifeline with a cheap imitation and expect the same service! I hope you prove me wrong, but my experience tells me otherwise............

You may think that I am showing bias as I sell the Lifeline brand, but that decision came after 4 months of research and many conversations with many of the major battery manufacturers....a decision that was not reached lightly.
__________________
Lew Farber...ABYC Certified Master Marine Electrician...RVIA Certified Master Tech ...AM Solar Authorized Installation Center...AIRSTREAM Solar & Electrical Specialist...Micro Air 'Easy Start' Sales and Installations
lewster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2013, 08:09 PM   #23
CLOUDSPLITTER "Tahawas"
 
ROBERT CROSS's Avatar

 
2003 25' Classic
Zanadude Nebula , WNY
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 11,153
Images: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by lewster View Post
You'll pardon my cynicism, but NO amount of dollar savings will replace a superior product made in the USA with a 5 year warranty for a Chinese knock-off that will probably be dead in 3 years.

You simply can not duplicate the superior construction of a Lifeline with a cheap imitation and expect the same service! I hope you prove me wrong, but my experience tells me otherwise............

You may think that I am showing bias as I sell the Lifeline brand, but that decision came after 4 months of research and many conversations with many of the major battery manufacturers....a decision that was not reached lightly.
^
X2!

4th Season...going strong.

Bob
__________________
PFC.....

“After all these years the reason I continue to love Thanksgiving.....I still sit at the kids table.”
RLC

Sandra wanted to go to Cleveland on vacation,
but I’m the Husband, so we went to Cleveland.
RLC
ROBERT CROSS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-14-2013, 02:40 PM   #24
3 Rivet Member
 
2004 25' Safari
Laramie , Wyoming
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 192
I know this may seem like a very silly question but what does AGM stand for?
__________________
mgap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-14-2013, 02:54 PM   #25
Rivet Master
 
2005 19' Safari
GLENDALE , AZ
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,441
See explanation at this link: VRLA battery - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
__________________
Phoenix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-14-2013, 05:17 PM   #26
Rivet Master
Commercial Member
 
lewster's Avatar
 
Vintage Kin Owner
Naples, FL , Hood River, OR
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 7,281
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phoenix View Post
I don't know what idiot wrote that entry to Wiki, but most of what he wrote is exactly 180º out of phase with actual facts regarding AGM batteries.

Comparison with flooded lead–acid cells[edit]

VRLA batteries offer several advantages compared with flooded lead–acid cells. The battery can be mounted in any position, since the valves only operate on overpressure faults. Since the battery system is designed to be recombinant and eliminate the emission of gases on overcharge, room ventilation requirements are reduced and no acid fume is emitted during normal operation. The volume of free electrolyte that could be released on damage to the case or venting is very small. There is no need (nor possibility) to check the level of electrolyte or to top up water lost due to electrolysis, reducing inspection and maintenance.[5]
Because of calcium added to its plates to reduce water loss, a sealed battery recharges much more slowly than a flooded lead acid battery.[6][7] Compared to flooded batteries, VRLA batteries are more sensitive to high temperature,[citation needed] and are more vulnerable to thermal run-away during abusive charging.[1] The electrolyte cannot be tested by hydrometer to diagnose improper charging, which can reduce battery life.[8][7]
AGM automobile batteries are typically about twice the price of flooded-cell batteries in a given BCI size group; gel batteries as much as five times greater. VRLA batteries:
Are less reliable[vague] than flooded lead acid [2]
Have longer recharge time than flooded lead-acid.
Cannot tolerate overcharging: overcharging leads to premature failure.[citation needed]
Have shorter useful life.[citation needed]
Discharge significantly less hydrogen gas.

"Because of calcium added to its plates to reduce water loss, a sealed battery recharges much more slowly than a flooded lead acid battery."
FALSE! An AGM battery, due to it's much lower internal resistance, charges in a much shorter amount of time than a comparable liquid lead acid battery

"Compared to flooded batteries, VRLA batteries are more sensitive to high temperature,[citation needed] and are more vulnerable to thermal run-away during abusive charging."
PARTIALLY FALSE! AGM batteries are far less sensitive to higher operating temperatures than a comparable liquid lead acid battery. Yes, they are more sensitive to extreme overcharging (above 15.5VDC at 77ºFº) and they will outgas thru the one-way valve at this condition over extended periods of time, but you will boil a liquid lead acid battery dry in a similar situation.

"Are less reliable[vague] than flooded lead acid"
FALSE! Without data to back up this sprurious claim, it is meaningless. I have several large banks of Lifeline AGM batteries currently on their 9th year of service in RVs and still show 95% of the original capacity. How is that less reliable?

This entry was obviously written either by a moron or a troll working for the liquid lead acid battery industry. SHOW ME THE FACTS!!!!!
__________________
Lew Farber...ABYC Certified Master Marine Electrician...RVIA Certified Master Tech ...AM Solar Authorized Installation Center...AIRSTREAM Solar & Electrical Specialist...Micro Air 'Easy Start' Sales and Installations
lewster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-14-2013, 07:01 PM   #27
Rivet Master
 
2005 19' Safari
GLENDALE , AZ
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,441
This link was posted merely for the description of "AGM batteries". At the top of this Wikipedia article, a notation seems to imply that the text needs additional fact checking. Perhaps, it would have been clearer and more accurate to just post the two short paragraphs related to "Absorbed Gas Mat", which appear to be sufficient for this discussion. (See below.)

==========

Extract from Wikipedia article previously referenced:

AGM batteries differ from flooded lead acid batteries in that the electrolyte is held in the glass mats, as opposed to freely flooding the plates. Very thin glass fibers are woven into a mat to increase surface area enough to hold sufficient electrolyte on the cells for their lifetime. The fibers that compose the fine glass mat do not absorb nor are affected by the acidic electrolyte. These mats are wrung out 2–5% after being soaked in acids, prior to manufacture completion and sealing.

The plates in an AGM battery may be any shape. Some are flat, others are bent or rolled. AGM batteries, both deep cycle and starting, are built in a rectangular case to BCI battery code specifications.
__________________

__________________
Phoenix is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Battery vent - or AGM pauly g Batteries, Univolts, Converters & Inverters 15 01-23-2008 09:32 AM
Deka Sea Mate AGM Battery Stream 1529 Batteries, Univolts, Converters & Inverters 4 07-27-2007 01:08 AM
AGM Batteries? Boondocker Batteries, Univolts, Converters & Inverters 33 06-03-2007 07:23 AM
New Progressive Dynamics convertor, AGM battery, and Pendant questions wacnstac Batteries, Univolts, Converters & Inverters 16 05-09-2007 10:12 PM
AGM battery question LuminumTraila Batteries, Univolts, Converters & Inverters 3 03-01-2005 05:56 AM


Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:19 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.