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12-28-2015, 10:25 AM
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#1
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2 Rivet Member
1989 25' Excella
Albemarle
, North Carolina
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 33
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Battery charging system for AGM size 27 sealed batterys.
I am going to replace my old interstate batteries (deep cycle)with two size 27 deep cycle AGM sealed units. I believe my present charging system is original equipment. Will it handle my new batteries when it comes to charging?
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12-28-2015, 11:39 AM
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#2
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Rivet Master
1974 Argosy 20
2014 20' Flying Cloud
Kooskia
, Idaho
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 4,591
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Yes, it will handle it, but most here, me included would recommend you replace your original Univolt with a new three stage converter/charger which will not only charge your batteries better, but will prolong their life a lot.
Common recommendation is a Progressive Dynamics PD 9245 (45 amp) which will do you just fine. Around $200. best converters.com is a good source.
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12-28-2015, 12:09 PM
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#3
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3 Rivet Member
2004 25' Safari
Crestview
, Florida
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 162
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I also have a PD unit mine is a 55 amp that I charge two 6 volt golf cart batts. It works very well. The next step up would be a Magnum unit that can be programed for just about any battery. The but here is the cost at $1700.00 to 2000.00 they are heavy and more difficult to install.
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12-28-2015, 12:20 PM
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#4
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3 Rivet Member
2004 25' Safari
Crestview
, Florida
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 162
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Before I upgraded to PD I used a portable 3 stage charger just be sure to have the battery disconnect set to store before hooking it up. The stock charger/converter can ruin the battery if you don't keep a close eye on the state of charge on the battery.
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12-29-2015, 11:10 AM
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#5
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3 Rivet Member
2005 31' Classic
Gretna
, Nebraska
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 152
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I am atill operating on the stock converter on my '05 Classic. I replaced the original wet cells in 2008 with a pair of group 31 AGM batteries which will probably be replaced next year.
I assume that is good battery life even for AGM's. Would I benefit by replacing my converter?
Dwight
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12-29-2015, 11:52 AM
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#6
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Rivet Master
2012 23' FB International
Woodstock
, Ontario
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,423
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Maybe some one with more knowledge could weigh in here, but I believe the charging voltage is different for AGMs....a bit lower!??? My solar panel is still set up for the AGMs it was originally installed for; and I only get about 12.8 volts on float, for my Lead Acid deep cycle battery
JCW
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12-29-2015, 12:13 PM
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#7
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3 Rivet Member
2015 19' Flying Cloud
2017 25' Flying Cloud
Rosemount
, Minnesota
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 242
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AGM Battery Charging
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12-29-2015, 12:21 PM
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#8
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4 Rivet Member
2005 25' Classic
Austin
, Texas
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 393
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Converter Replacement
Quote:
Originally Posted by 16595
I am atill operating on the stock converter on my '05 Classic. I replaced the original wet cells in 2008 with a pair of group 31 AGM batteries which will probably be replaced next year.
I assume that is good battery life even for AGM's. Would I benefit by replacing my converter?
Dwight
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I replaced the converter on my 2005 Classic with a Progressive Dynamics PD9260 60 Amp Converter that I purchased from Vintage Trailer Supply for $172.99 plus shipping last March. Previously I was getting about three years life out of my wet sell batteries and now hope for longer life. I keep my AS plugged in at home all of the time when it is at home.
Dennis
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12-29-2015, 03:21 PM
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#9
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Rivet Master
2013 30' Classic
Greenwood
, Mississippi
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 12,111
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So group 27 is the size? Didn't know that.
Wondering which batteries are best to buy- thought about Optima, but someone said Lifeline are better-
Someone else said current inverter won't charge AGM batteries-
What do I do?
New converter and new AGM batteries?
How much is a converter? Which converter?
__________________
2013 Classic 30 Limited
2007 Silver Toyota Tundra Crew Max Limited 5.7 iForce
2006 Vivid Black Harley-Davidson Road King Classic
1999 Black Nissan Pathfinder LE
TAC #MS-10
WBCCI #1811, Region 6, Unit 56
Airforums #70955
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12-29-2015, 03:29 PM
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#10
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4 Rivet Member
2016 30' Flying Cloud
Oviedo
, Florida
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 264
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Nt sure what the consequences are (if any), but both Lifeline and Trojan recommend approx 14.5 VDC for bulk/absorption charging with a float level of 13.2. The common 4 stage chargers are set for wet cells with bulk of 14.6, absorption of 13.8 and float of 13.2.
__________________
Keith & Barb
2016 30' Flying Cloud
2016 Ram 2500 diesel
Southeastern Camping Unit, WBCCI #1675
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12-29-2015, 04:28 PM
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#11
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3 Rivet Member
2015 19' Flying Cloud
2017 25' Flying Cloud
Rosemount
, Minnesota
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 242
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AGM Battery Charging
It sometimes is hard to do an apples to apples comparison (or a battery to charger compare). Here is how I believe the Progressive Dynamics PD9000 series compares to what the Trojan AGM battery requires as an example:
Bulk Absorption Finish Float
AGM Battery 14.4 14.1 - 14.7 14.7 13.5
Charger 14.4 13.6 14.4 13.2
With 12.84 V being 100% charge for the Trojan AGM battery, it looks to me like the Progressive charger would not harm the batteries, would take a little bit longer to charge them (not as aggressive a charge as the batteries would take in Absorption mode). The Finish or Equalization Mode is a little low so you may not be keeping battery stratification under control. This could be handled by using a conditioning charger at home every 2 months. I don't know if the 0.3 V float difference is an issue or not.
Best bet is to call Progressive and the battery manufacturer and compare their answers as to whether or not the two products specifications are compatible or what issues any limitations may be causing you to have to live with.
PD9200 Series RV Power Converters
Charge Wizard RV Battery Charging
http://www.trojanbattery.com/pdf/Trojan_QSG_AGM.pdf
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12-29-2015, 04:40 PM
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#12
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LABTOPIA
1958 22' Caravanner
Atlanta
, Georgia
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 74
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i just got a aimes 2000w converter/inverter with built in xfer switch recently from amazon and it seems to be working pretty well- it has selections for both agm types and other types so the charge cycle is correct.
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12-29-2015, 05:03 PM
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#13
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Rivet Master
Commercial Member
Vintage Kin Owner
Naples
, Florida
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 7,508
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I can't address other battery types as I do not install them, but Lifeline AGM batteries require a bulk/absorb charger of 14.2-14.4 VDC and a float charge of 13.2-13.4VDC. Many 'smart' converter/chargers approach these values, but never attain them with most being too high.
The only way to reach the required voltage levels for Lifeline AGMs is to use a programmable charging system like a Magnum or other fully programmable inverter/charger. There are several marine chargers that have selectable charging profiles for differing types of battery systems, but they still 'approximate' the batteries' voltage requirements.
__________________
lewster
Solar Tech Energy Systems, Inc.
Victron Solar Components and Inverters, Zamp Solar Panels, LiFeBlue and Battle Born Lithium Batteries, Lifeline AGM Batteries
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12-29-2015, 05:22 PM
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#14
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Rivet Master
1974 Argosy 20
2014 20' Flying Cloud
Kooskia
, Idaho
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 4,591
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Quote:
Originally Posted by idroba
Yes, it will handle it, but most here, me included would recommend you replace your original Univolt with a new three stage converter/charger which will not only charge your batteries better, but will prolong their life a lot.
Common recommendation is a Progressive Dynamics PD 9245 (45 amp) which will do you just fine. Around $200. best converters.com is a good source.
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My post #2 is in error when I said it would handle it. On re reading your OP I see you are putting AGM batteries in, and they definitely should have a different converter/charger than supplied originally.
Sorry for my error.
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12-30-2015, 04:32 AM
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#15
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Rivet Master
2013 30' Classic
Greenwood
, Mississippi
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 12,111
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How much money is the correct converter?
__________________
2013 Classic 30 Limited
2007 Silver Toyota Tundra Crew Max Limited 5.7 iForce
2006 Vivid Black Harley-Davidson Road King Classic
1999 Black Nissan Pathfinder LE
TAC #MS-10
WBCCI #1811, Region 6, Unit 56
Airforums #70955
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12-30-2015, 09:09 AM
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#16
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Rivet Master
1974 Argosy 20
2014 20' Flying Cloud
Kooskia
, Idaho
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 4,591
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m.hony
How much money is the correct converter?
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The PD converters are generally under $200, you install. A "fully programable" as Lew recommends is much more expensive. Only you can decide if you want to get the very most life out of the batteries, or make some compromise on battery life vs. converter cost. But with AGM's anything is better than the original Airstream supplied converter/charger.
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12-30-2015, 04:37 PM
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#17
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Rivet Master
2013 30' Classic
Greenwood
, Mississippi
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 12,111
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I guess I should call/email Lee directly-
I basically got 3 years out of the original batteries-
Is that "normal" or acceptable?
Should I just get another 2 just like the originals?
Sent from my iPhone using Airstream Forums
__________________
2013 Classic 30 Limited
2007 Silver Toyota Tundra Crew Max Limited 5.7 iForce
2006 Vivid Black Harley-Davidson Road King Classic
1999 Black Nissan Pathfinder LE
TAC #MS-10
WBCCI #1811, Region 6, Unit 56
Airforums #70955
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12-30-2015, 05:09 PM
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#18
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Rivet Master
1974 Argosy 20
2014 20' Flying Cloud
Kooskia
, Idaho
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 4,591
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Well, I have gotten up to 10 seasons from a pair of golf cart type Trojan T105 batteries in series. Due to cost increases in the Trojans, I am using Costco's now. I have about 5 seasons on one set in the Argosy and 2 on the other set in the FC 20'. It will take me more time to find out how well they hold up. I have PD converter/chargers in both rigs, and these are not AGM batteries, they are normal flooded cell variety. I have solar on both rigs, and do take care of my batteries, but do not sit freezing in the dark to do it. I have and use occasionally both a regular household toaster an small microwave on my 1000 watt inverter when I want to, out boondocking. I seldom am in a campground with any hookups.
I charge them thoroughly in October, disconnect them totally but leave them in place in the trailers, and re connect them in April, with no charge in-between those dates.
So, what is normal? I would say, reading this forum, most people only get 3 or 4 seasons from a set of batteries, but what is possible... see above.
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12-30-2015, 05:14 PM
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#19
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Rivet Master
2013 30' Classic
Greenwood
, Mississippi
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 12,111
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Maybe get 2 more flooded cell batteries and a kill switch so the propane detector doesn't drain the batteries between trips?
Sent from my iPhone using Airstream Forums
__________________
2013 Classic 30 Limited
2007 Silver Toyota Tundra Crew Max Limited 5.7 iForce
2006 Vivid Black Harley-Davidson Road King Classic
1999 Black Nissan Pathfinder LE
TAC #MS-10
WBCCI #1811, Region 6, Unit 56
Airforums #70955
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12-30-2015, 10:12 PM
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#20
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Rivet Master
1974 Argosy 20
2014 20' Flying Cloud
Kooskia
, Idaho
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 4,591
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A true kill switch (not the abomination called the USE/STORE switch) would be a welcome addition to the current Airstream lines. Somewhere in the 80's I think it was Airstream had just such a standard piece of equipment. The ones I saw were a big red recessed handle switch, usually located on the shelf behind the front couch, which was a pretty standard item in most Airstreams at that time.
But then it would shut off the propane detector and there might be some RVIA regulation against that. So, we have to add our own.
m.honey, flooded cell batteries probably are the least expensive of all, overall, if cared for even reasonably well. AGM batteries are still lead acid but with a semi solid paste type liquid. They probably can be more deeply discharged than flooded cell batteries and still recover, but the longer life statements may be more based on them usually having a better converter/charger used with them, which will extend the life of any flooded cell battery too, but is not done as often as it should be done. Of course they also can be installed "ventless" and on their sides etc, but if that is not necessary, they are not worth the extra cost (in my opinion). AGM batteries can be ruined just as fast and just as well as any flooded cell battery, if properly abused.
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