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05-20-2007, 12:07 AM
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#1
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Rivet Master
2005 25' Safari
Salem
, Oregon
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 8,369
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Batteries Killed at Casini
Hi, my trailer is two and one half years old; Will be three on September 7th 2007. On my last trip out [Casini Ranch] my batteries vertually died. While being plugged in to shore power my battery meter, on the monitor board, shows battery good. As soon as I disconnected from shore power, my battery meter shows two red lights on the bottom of the scale. Today I brought my batteries to work to test them on the new Ford battery charger/tester. Tests show both batterries are bad. Both batteries show 12 + volts, but vertually no amps.
Costco has the best price for group 24 RV/Marine batteries. Wal-Mart was higher and Camping world even higher. Costco has Kirkland, Wal-Mart has Everstart, or something like that, and Camping World has Interstate. I'm tempted on just buying the cheapest for a few reasons. (1) Short life. (2) Short warranty. (3) Very little boon docking. (4) Kirkland $53.00 / Lifeline $150.00 24 to 30 month warranty. (5) No generator or solar cells.
Do you agree with me, for the short life span and the short warranty, I should just go for the cheap batteries or do you see something from a different angle that I should think about before buying new batteries?
[according to the Interstate Battery web site, my original batteries were warranteed for 18 months]
__________________
Bob 2005 Safari 25-B
"Le Petit Chateau Argent" Small Silver Castle
2000 Navigator / 2014 F-150 Eco-Boost / Equal-i-zer / P-3
YAMAHA 2400 / AIR #12144
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05-20-2007, 12:30 AM
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#2
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Rivet Master
1977 27' Overlander
1954 25' Cruiser
1990 34.5' Airstream 345
VC Highlands
, Nevada
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,151
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Well I do for one. When I got batteries for Buttercup I bought the cheapest things I could find at batteries plus (about $56 each) and they are still plugging along. I add distilled water every year if they need it and make sure they are maintained. I even load test them by putting 500 amps draw for 15 seconds to check for volts at full load (an indication of sulfation buildup on the plates). I use a load tester that I got from Harbor Freight Tools. It is a great tool to see how your batteries are doing. If the plates do build up sulfation they can show good voltage but they will have such high internal resistance that they will not be able to deliver load. Any load put on them will just cause the voltage to drop out the bottom.
Your batteries probably went bad because they went for a long enough time, perhaps on the dealers lot, without a proper charge which will build up the sulfation. It doesn't take much to make a battery go bad. But it also takes so little to keep them happy.
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05-20-2007, 04:32 AM
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#3
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Retired.
Currently Looking...
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, At Large
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 21,276
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A little known secret is the cheaper, lower cranking amp batteries will generally last longer because they have fewer plates, and more electrolyte capacity. This holds true for deep cycle batteries as well, even if we don't use the cranking amps.
The fewer plates, the less chance of two plates touching under a sudden load, and shorting. Also, the more electrolyte, the better the heat dissipation qualities while charging.
While I wouldn't recommend getting a Jim & Bob's Generic Battery Co. battery, any "well known" economy deep cycle battery would do the trick.
__________________
Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy, and taste good with ketchup.
Terry
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05-20-2007, 04:50 AM
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#4
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Rivet Master
2004 22' International CCD
Spotsylvania
, Virginia
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 663
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Buttercup is right on. It doesn't make any difference whether you have cheap (inexpensive) or or expensive batteries. If you don't take care of them, they won't last. Besides adding distilled water, removing sulfation from the plates is important to a properly functioning battery. I'm starting my 6th season with my battery and it's still going strong. I use a PulseTech Power Pulse desulfator module to keep the sulfation from building up. It only costs $67.95 (not much more than an inexpensive battery).
__________________
Bob
---------------
"THE BAUXITE BUNGALOW"
2004 22' CCD
1997 F-150
TAC VA-12
AIR# 4749
ex WBCCI# 1430
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05-20-2007, 06:13 AM
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#5
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Rivet Master
Commercial Member
Vintage Kin Owner
Naples
, Florida
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 7,508
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Don't forget your converter. ANY battery loves a 3-stage charger that the newer converters use. If you're still using a Univolt, use it as an anchor on your boat and invest in a quality switch-mode electronic converter.
You and your batteries will be MUCH happier!!
__________________
lewster
Solar Tech Energy Systems, Inc.
Victron Solar Components and Inverters, Zamp Solar Panels, LiFeBlue and Battle Born Lithium Batteries, Lifeline AGM Batteries
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05-20-2007, 06:43 AM
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#6
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Rivet Master
1977 27' Overlander
1954 25' Cruiser
1990 34.5' Airstream 345
VC Highlands
, Nevada
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,151
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lewster
Don't forget your converter. ANY battery loves a 3-stage charger that the newer converters use. If you're still using a Univolt, use it as an anchor on your boat and invest in a quality switch-mode electronic converter.
You and your batteries will be MUCH happier!!
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A desulfator is a good way to go but the modern 3 stage chargers will go a long way towards preventing sulfation buildup on the plates. BTW, there is no proven chemical that I know of that will "rejuvinate" a battery. Once the plates are sulfated, it's over - even if you use a desulfator. At this point a desulfator will improve a battery's condition but not much more. If you do decide to use a desulfator, start using it early. It could pay for itself. I say that assuming that you have a univolt and not a modern 3 stage charger OR that you do not keep your trailer plugged in and charging all the time. I keep mine plugged in to allow my intellipower to do it's daily maintenance cycle.
For trailers with the 3 stage charging the desulfator is probably not needed - again provided you are plugged in all the time.
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05-20-2007, 07:51 AM
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#7
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2 Rivet Member
2007 25' Safari FB SE
Burien
, Washington
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by overlander63
A little known secret is the cheaper, lower cranking amp batteries will generally last longer because they have fewer plates, and more electrolyte capacity. This holds true for deep cycle batteries as well, even if we don't use the cranking amps.
The fewer plates, the less chance of two plates touching under a sudden load, and shorting. Also, the more electrolyte, the better the heat dissipation qualities while charging.
While I wouldn't recommend getting a Jim & Bob's Generic Battery Co. battery, any "well known" economy deep cycle battery would do the trick.
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That is an interesting observation.I would have figured you get what you pay for, but, when I think about it, I have had better success with inexpensive automotive batteries that the premium priced ones. In fact, every time I had a premium battery go out on me, they died without much warning.
The inexpensive ones, gave warning.
Sam
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05-20-2007, 07:55 AM
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#8
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Aluminut
2004 25' Safari
.
, Illinois
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,477
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Lew is right on.
As for cheap batts, that's what was in our Airstreams to start with. Of course, because my converter is not 3 stage, my batts would be on constant charge and if not careful, they'd dry out. So, I'd unplug from shore power, only to get there late 2x and they were totally dead....now, they have very little capacity. First step in any batt replacement is to replace the converter. Even the el cheapo batts will last longer as will the more expensive ones with that step out of the way. You then can leave the RV plugged in and let the converter worry about it the right way from what I understand.
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05-20-2007, 07:56 AM
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#9
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Moderator
2004 30' Classic Slideout
Fenton
, Missouri
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 10,403
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buttercup
For trailers with the 3 stage charging the desulfator is probably not needed - again provided you are plugged in all the time.
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So has Airstream produced any trailer years with this style charger, or are you addressing this line to folks who have done upgrades?
Jack
__________________
Jack Canavera
STL Mo.
AIR #56 S/OS#15
'04 Classic 30' S.O.,'03 GMC Savana 2500
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05-20-2007, 09:12 AM
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#10
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Rivet Master
1995 25' Excella
1961 26' Overlander
1982 34' Limited
Albuquerque
, New Mexico
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 740
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Univolt?
When did Airstream stop using Univolt?
How do I tell what I have in my 1995 Excella?
Quote:
Originally Posted by lewster
Don't forget your converter. ANY battery loves a 3-stage charger that the newer converters use. If you're still using a Univolt, use it as an anchor on your boat and invest in a quality switch-mode electronic converter.
You and your batteries will be MUCH happier!!
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__________________
Airstream25
KE5CKG on 2 meters
AIR #10274
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05-20-2007, 09:43 AM
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#11
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Rivet Master
1984 31' Airstream310
Dunsmuir
, California
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 1,336
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I have Costco deep cycle batteries in my MH and they have provided good service. They are over two years old and still going strong. Costco is very good about returns although the warranty on the deep cycles is not the same as with the starting batteries. I was told by a fellow at the repair shop where I take my MH that Costco batteries are made by Interstate.
__________________
If you want others to be happy, practice compassion.
If you want to be happy, practice compassion - The Dalai Lama
1984 310 Limited Motorhome
Courtesy Parking (W/S/E/Wi-Fi) on I-5 in Northern California, 70 miles from Oregon border
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05-20-2007, 11:40 AM
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#12
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Rivet Master
1984 31' Airstream310
Central
, Ohio
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,094
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Just an FYI--as a former employee of Interstate Batteries, I can tell you that Interstate is an automotive battery distributor, not a manufacturer. Their batteries are mostly made by Johnson Controls. (They actually do manufacture some of their small batteries but not automotive batteries.)
Just FYI!
Susan
__________________
"Despite the cost of living, have you noticed how popular it remains?"
1984 310 Limited Motor Home "The Rockin' A"
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05-20-2007, 01:49 PM
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#13
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LEV ZEPPELIN
2004 19' International CCD
Chicago
, Illinois
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,047
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I am still on our original two Interstates, and this will be our third year.
I've made every attempt to be kind to them: In the fall attached to BatteryMinder until spring. Checked water levels, though I have never had to add water.
I was just at the storage place today and after sitting for a few weeks with out any shore power, they read 12.2 volts.
I think this means they are still OK. If we boondock, I make sure that every day for an hour or so, I zap the batteries with the Honda generator.
Is 12.2 volts still OK?
Jonathan
__________________
Sometimes I wish I were living in the stone age. Then I would know I'm the smartest person in the world.
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05-20-2007, 02:09 PM
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#14
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Rivet Master
1975 31' Sovereign
Oxford
, Mississippi
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 874
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Battery Died
Seems like a few of us are having battery problems, must be in the air.
My husband just left to re-place our battery it was an Interstate Aug 2002 yes you read right a 5 year old battery and it just bit the dust. I can't complain it has been a good one.
__________________
Becky
75 Sovereign (Peppy)
03 Chevy HD (lil Peppy)
Air# 9552
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05-20-2007, 03:08 PM
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#15
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Rivet Master
1984 31' Airstream310
Dunsmuir
, California
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 1,336
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alumatube
Just an FYI--as a former employee of Interstate Batteries, I can tell you that Interstate is an automotive battery distributor, not a manufacturer. Their batteries are mostly made by Johnson Controls. (They actually do manufacture some of their small batteries but not automotive batteries.)
Just FYI!
Susan
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Thanks for the information. This is why I quoted my source, to make it clear that I could not confirm the information. Perhaps he meant, but didn't say, that Costco gets their batteries from Johnson Controls, as does Interstate.
__________________
If you want others to be happy, practice compassion.
If you want to be happy, practice compassion - The Dalai Lama
1984 310 Limited Motorhome
Courtesy Parking (W/S/E/Wi-Fi) on I-5 in Northern California, 70 miles from Oregon border
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05-20-2007, 05:09 PM
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#16
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Moderator
2004 30' Classic Slideout
Fenton
, Missouri
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 10,403
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I've fallen into the bad habit of checking mine annually (I have to do better) and found that for the last two years the upper plates have been exposed. In my case I need to do this more often and the condition of mine are purely my fault.
On my Safari I was much more dilligant due to the battery box being easy to access. With the difficulty of getting to these in my Classic, I've been neglectful and will pay the price by having to replace either this year or for sure next. My saving grace is that I don't boondock and the only use that my batteries get is running the jack when I pick it up or drop it off at my storage location.
Jack
__________________
Jack Canavera
STL Mo.
AIR #56 S/OS#15
'04 Classic 30' S.O.,'03 GMC Savana 2500
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05-20-2007, 08:47 PM
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#17
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Rivet Master
Commercial Member
Vintage Kin Owner
Naples
, Florida
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 7,508
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcanavera
I've fallen into the bad habit of checking mine annually (I have to do better) and found that for the last two years the upper plates have been exposed. In my case I need to do this more often and the condition of mine are purely my fault.
On my Safari I was much more dilligant due to the battery box being easy to access. With the difficulty of getting to these in my Classic, I've been neglectful and will pay the price by having to replace either this year or for sure next. My saving grace is that I don't boondock and the only use that my batteries get is running the jack when I pick it up or drop it off at my storage location.
Jack
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Hey Jack,
You NEVER have to water an AGM, and Lifelines have a 5 YEAR WARRANTY!!!
__________________
lewster
Solar Tech Energy Systems, Inc.
Victron Solar Components and Inverters, Zamp Solar Panels, LiFeBlue and Battle Born Lithium Batteries, Lifeline AGM Batteries
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05-20-2007, 09:25 PM
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#18
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Retired.
Currently Looking...
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, At Large
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 21,276
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crazylev
I was just at the storage place today and after sitting for a few weeks with out any shore power, they read 12.2 volts.
Is 12.2 volts still OK?
Jonathan
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Jonathan, 12.2 volts is about 25% charge remaining. When fully charged, they should be 12.65 volts or more, and a specific gravity of 1.275.
We learned when Ford specified the group 65 battery, there was not enough room in the battery for the plates and electrolyte. There were interwall separations (no cranking amps/ internal opens), and distorted plates causing shorted cells (dead cells). The solution for a time was to produce a battery with the same physical dimensions, but fewer plates, and less cranking amps. These batteries, while having less cranking amps, had more reserve capacity than the standard group 65 battery.
__________________
Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy, and taste good with ketchup.
Terry
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05-20-2007, 09:38 PM
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#19
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Moderator
2004 30' Classic Slideout
Fenton
, Missouri
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 10,403
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lewster
Hey Jack,
You NEVER have to water an AGM, and Lifelines have a 5 YEAR WARRANTY!!!
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Yes, I'll give that due consideration. The other option is maybe a Delco Voyager which while being a flooded battery, under normal operation doesn't need periodic water additions. Since I don't boondock that may be the better price performance choice.
Jack
__________________
Jack Canavera
STL Mo.
AIR #56 S/OS#15
'04 Classic 30' S.O.,'03 GMC Savana 2500
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08-27-2012, 07:14 PM
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#20
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4 Rivet Member
1999 34' Excella
NE Central
, Kansas
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 321
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Ok, everyone! Time to revive this 5 year old thread. To all of you who replaced batteries in 2007, how are they holding out? Don't be shy, tell us which you bought and why, and if you regret it, or were they perfect?
BTW, my batteries are stickered 6/2006, and they are Everstart (by Johnson Controls) Deep Cycle Marine (and fine print says trolling). I just checked out the water levels them. One was fine, I just added a bit of distilled water. The other battery was way overdue for feeding...it took almost a gallon of water. I'll take it soon and have it tested. I have no clue about voltages/amps or outputs. I have the parallax 7400 series charger/converter with 65 amp output which I believe is original equipment.
Is the parallax a good unit, or should I save some scratch to upgrade?
Thanks for your input!
Philip
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