Yamaha 3000

[Bluto]

I hope to get a generator soon and have been reading threads on the subject till my eyes crossed, but still have a few lingering questions. Anyone using a Yamaha 3000 gen to run the Dometic 15,000 btu/ac in very hot weather? How well did the gen preform?
Do you think it will run for 5 hours powering an ac in 100+ without running out of gas using only it's 3.4 gal onboard tank? Or, should I just figure on it lasting 4 hours. I know it's all subjective, but I'd like to hear what you have experienced with your Yamaha 3000.

[tpi]

I have the 11000 BTU Penguin and the Yamaha 3000 boost. According to this, it should run at full load for 8 hours.
Yamaha Inverter Generator EF3000iSEB-w/free charging cables -

I haven't had any reason to disagree after about 6 years of use. It has handled the 100 degree temperatures with no problem and the unit has been completely trouble free.

The Penguins do have a big draw at startup and my my Yamaha goes into boost mode on every compressor start. Once started there is plenty of capacity.

I haven't checked the specs recently but I vaguely recall all the Dometic Penguin models have the same locked rotor draw.

Edit: the 15K btu models have 64 amp locked rotor vs. 53 amp for my 11K. PDF:
http://www.dometic.com/b154c316-93cf...c7604cad.fodoc

[Bluto]

Thanks for the comments, and links. That info made me search further.
From what I gather from the Dometic booklet supplied from Airstream on my a/c compared to your Dometic link, my unit is a model #651516.331 and has a 66 amp locked rotor. It goes on to say that I need to use a minium generator size of 3.5 KW.
I don't understand the verbage enough to compare it to a generator size. On the Yamaha site it says the 3000 has a rated output of 2800 watts with a max current draw of 23.2/25amps @ 120v.
I guess I'm confused, it seems like the a/c company gives one set of numbers and the Yamaha gives a different set. It's difficult for me to compare. I don't have an electrical or a/c backround. So based on this info will the 3000 do the job or do you think it's borderline?

[JFScheck]

TPI and I both have the Yamaha EF3000iSEB - the B means boost, let me explain....

The EF3000iSE model produces max 3000 watt - sustained 2800 watts.
The EF3000iSEB looks identical - produces max 3000 watt - sustained 2800 but has additional circuitry so that it can draw from it's internal battery for up to 10 seconds to provide 3500 watts!!!

Plenty of power to get your A/C running and then maintain the load...

I just got mine two weeks ago after doing tons of research - only used it once so far for four hours, whisper quiet and ran my 25FB Airstream Classic with A/C in heat pump mode, TV, stereo and even tried the microwave, all with zero hiccups, granted my A/C is only 13,500 watts but still....

[Castaway]

Is the weight of the generator (149 lbs) an issue? We would haul ours in the back of our pickup.

Gary

[JFScheck]

Weights are with no fuel in the gas tank...

EF3000iSE = 149.9 lbs.

EF3000iSEB = 154.3 lbs.

Fuel tank equals 3.4 gallons
Gas = approximate 6 lbs. a gallon
So you could have up to an additional 20.4 lbs.


I throw mine around no problem - but then again, I'm only 43 and a pretty big guy - let's see if I'm not using a ramp or lift to get my generator into/out of the back of the truck in the next 20+ years...

[Happycampers]

Get a 4000 watt it will run it for sure and only weighs about 40 lbs. more.

[tpi]

I ramp my 3000 in and out of pickup at 58 years old. I leave it in pickup bed most of the time and run it from there.

Yamaha makes a 4500 inverter generator. Advantage: it would run microwave and AC at the same time (my 3000 doesn't). Disadvantage, size, weight, and noisier under low loads. I find one very nice thing about the 3000 is how quiet it idles down for basic tasks like battery charging and running a few lights.

I'm sure the 3000 w/ boost would have plenty of power to run your 15K AC. Starting with the boost feature should be OK. I have heard no reports of 15K AC units not starting with this generator, and I have started my 11K with quite a bit of additional load running in trailer with the generator.

In hot weather I shed as much load as possible except AC. I switch fridge to gas, and postpone battery charging if possible (low batteries can draw 500-1000 watts of power initially). This to try to keep generator as cool as possible.

But I have to add a disclaimer, those Penguins really draw a kick of power to start them.

[Bluto]

I called several generator sale offices and also Dometic a/c company.
Looks like the 3000 + boost should run the a/c but nothing else and I may be pushing it. The suggestions I received was to move up to the Yamaha 4500w unit or get a 4000w unit, or a couple of 2000's.
The 4500w Yamaha sounds perfect but the weight of 194# dry concerns me even though it's on wheels. I would operate it on my tailgate and keep it in the truck when not in use but every so often I may need to put it on the ground for cleaning and oil changes. Plus the 4500 costs around $3,000+.
At this point, I'm thinking 2 small 2000 Honda's again. Didn't want to do that as it seems alot of trouble with extra wires and an ext.fuel tank, etc. I like the all in one pkg. with elect start of the Yamaha.
Thanks for all your comments and for trying to help me make the right decision about a generator set up. At least I have it narrowed down a little more.
I'd like to get something ordered in the next few weeks. So if anyone has any additional ideas or things I need to consider please feel free. I'm all ears!

[ck21084]

I have a 5kw and a 200kw genny and both run everything you could think of in your stream. With the 200kw during the last big storm in FL I tied in some neighbors and we all had AC. I charged them $30 per day to pay for the fuel.

[Jammer]

FWIW you can't really tell from the specifications whether a particular air conditioner and generator will work together in all conditions.

The locked rotor draw is the amp draw if the rotor is mechanically locked and the nameplate voltage is applied. It is a reference figure only since in the real world the rotor isn't actually locked and the applied voltage drops below nameplate during starting. The actual peak draw during starting is lower than the locked rotor draw and will vary depending on the applied voltage. If the voltage drops too low the motor won't start and the thermal limit will trip.

After starting the next test of generator output comes as the sealed system comes up to pressure. Current can exceed the nameplate during nonstandard conditions particularly when the weather is hot or the condenser coils are obstructed by leaves or debris.

Matters are made more complicated by the fact that many small generators are limited by engine output rather than by the electric side. When this is the case the maximum shaft HP will tend to decline at altitude, in hot weather, and as the engine gets older due to loss of compression from wear to the rings and valves.

I don't try to run my air conditioner from a generator but if I did I'd probably get a pair of 2000 watt units. The size, weight, ease of use, and noise level are all better and the cost comes out about the same, even allowing that the noise will go up around 3 dB from rated just because there are two of them.

The larger units most people who are not linebackers either get wheels and a ramp or never take them out of the pickup bed.

[JFScheck]

Two Honda 2000's will give you 3600 watts max with 3200 watts continuos load - same if you went with dual Yamaha's.

I would rather have one Yamaha 3000iSEB - quieter, 3500 max with boost, better for me...

[tpi]

The Yamaha 3000 boost works for me. After 6 years wouldn't do anything else. Fill it with fuel, start it up, plug it in, and it runs for at least 8 hours.

[mistermcfrug]

Bluto- I'll just jump in with a couple of comments. Are you planning on using your generator at elevations higher than Texas? This is important because as gas engines gain altitude, they lose compression. I think you lose about 6% engine compression for every thousand feet above sea level. For the kind of work you talk about, I use an Onan 4000 mounted in my truck, plus I also carry a 1,000 Yamaha for watching movies or light stuff.

So while I can't claim to be some kind of gas engine or generator expert, I think you should investigate this altitude consideration if it applies to you. The bottom line I think is to avoid getting too cute in trying to buy minimum capability. Plus, in my experience, I tend to believe that you gotta anticipate the day when the engine doesn't run perfectly. So if you think a 3000 kwh generator will leave you with about 2,800 usable KWH, what will it do when it's three years old and isn't in perfect condition?

[Bluto]

Well, I have it narrowed down to the Yamaha 4500iSE based on my usage, your comments, and a few PM's from Forum friends about generators.

I've been looking at prices and all seem pretty close online.
Do you know of any company that blows away their competitors on pricing of Yamaha units?
I'm ready to order, just need the name of a company with good pricing.

[JFScheck]

Yamaha 4500iSE - Great Choice!!!

[Bluto]

Scheck,
Ya, it seems like it would be great choice, but actually not practical for me. I'd like to have all the power of the 4500, it could run everything. But, I did some measuring and constructed a box out of cardboard the size of the 4500.
Way too big of a package for me to have in the back of the pick up and operate on my tailgate. Just to bulky for me, it takes up too much valuable room in my truck.

So now I'm rethinking this again and taking a hard look at the 2 small portables or the EF3000iSEB like the one you bought recently.

I'll muddle my way thru this eventually.

[tpi]

Is there any way you can try starting the Penguin AC on borrowed or demonstrator 3000 unit? I think if there is a problem, starting the air conditioner will be it (unless you're concerned about running the microwave and AC at the same time). You could always put a bit of extra load on it like electric fridge, or other load, to simulate hot days.

At least for me, the 3000 has been ideal. I've had it since '04, it has been completely reliable, it has started the air conditioner and run it at altitudes up to 7K feet (not tried higher) and operated in very hot weather, it has a long runtime on tank of gas, it idles down very quietly when under low load, and it rolls around easily on wheels.

[JFScheck]

I do love my EF3000iSEB - perfect solution for me

[Bluto]

Originally Posted by tpi

Is there any way you can try starting the Penguin AC on borrowed or demonstrator 3000 unit? I think if there is a problem, starting the air conditioner will be it (unless you're concerned about running the microwave and AC at the same time). You could always put a bit of extra load on it like electric fridge, or other load, to simulate hot days.

At least for me, the 3000 has been ideal. I've had it since '04, it has been completely reliable, it has started the air conditioner and run it at altitudes up to 7K feet (not tried higher) and operated in very hot weather, it has a long runtime on tank of gas, it idles down very quietly when under low load, and it rolls around easily on wheels.

tpi, that's a great idea. I'll check around locally to see about borrowing a demo unit to try out.