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04-12-2014, 08:45 AM
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#21
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Rivet Master
1978 25' Tradewind
Metro Phoenix
, Arizona
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,524
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Thanks, scamp!! I'm using 6 gauge stranded THHN from the panels to the combiner box, and then 4 gauge from the box down to the batteries. Clearly, this isn't UV resistant wire, so I'm using split wire loom over it, which will maybe make it through the first Arizona summer.
The wire loom will look good for about the first week, so I'm very open to other ideas about UV protection for the wire. I thought about CPVC conduit with a coat of Krylon fusion - or even exterior house paint.
Ideas? Anybody? At this point, I'd have to either re-terminate the end connections :'( or use some kind of split loom. Maybe I'll slap a coat of Krylon fusion over the plastic wire loom to see if that helps out a bit.... New info: Krylon Fusion clear gloss supposedly offers UV protection
I did pick up my 4 gauge wire last night at Homey D ($.90 /ft) plus some 16 ga by 10 conductor sprinkler wire for the voltage sensing leads and the relay +12V control wire.
The relay de-energized state will be the parallel panel connection. Seemed to me like "bullet-proof" (as in shade not affecting it) and "de-energized" went together well.
__________________
"Between what matters and what seems to matter, how should the world we know judge wisely?" - E.C. Bentley, Trent's Last Case
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04-13-2014, 06:59 AM
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#22
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Rivet Master
2005 31' Classic
Garner,
, North Carolina
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,031
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drboyd
Good idea, Carl! The ring connectors I'm using at the relay with the 6 gauge are standard size yellow with the insulation removed, then opened, crimped and soldered with heat shrink to re-insulate. If I can't get that to work with the size 4 wires going down to the batteries, I'll try your copper tubing plan!!
Thanks!!
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thanks for the shoutout.. it was not my idea.. actually happened to see this on youtube when looking for something else.. the guy was showing how you smash then end of a tube of copper about 1/2" or so down, hold tube down on wooden board to drill hole in flat end, sorta drag the square flat end around on a bit of cement to get to rounded off or use raspy file, use a tubing cutter to get correct length for wire to slide into and cut off.
I though it was genuis for sure and a good cheap way to get copper connectors..
have fun and don't smack the thumb..
__________________
Carl, Raleigh NC
2-24-16 got a 2005 Classic 31D 460 watts solar, lithium 230 AH, 16" LT's, pulled by:
2003 F-250 SD, CC, 7.3L PowerStroke
WBCCI#1691, Piedmont Airstream Club, Unit #161, Region #3
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04-13-2014, 04:43 PM
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#23
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Rivet Master
1978 25' Tradewind
Metro Phoenix
, Arizona
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,524
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I got a bunch more done this weekend... We'll be busy for three or four hours, but then I'll get some photos and narrative up.
Hopefully, next weekend should get most of it working...
__________________
"Between what matters and what seems to matter, how should the world we know judge wisely?" - E.C. Bentley, Trent's Last Case
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04-13-2014, 06:40 PM
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#24
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Rivet Master
1973 27' Overlander
Portsmouth
, Virginia
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 776
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drboyd
First of all, a big public THANKS! to aquinob! I did have a bad solder connection. I owe you a beer, amigo!
Second,
In other news, my favorite new toy is a butane soldering iron from Home Depot. Trust me - if you're trying to solder 6 gauge copper, it's between that and a Big Soldering Gun - and this is a bunch cheaper. By the way, forget the reviews. Mine lit off the very first time and worked perfectly.
Seriously, thanks for busting my chops on the bad soldering. I can (and will) do better than that.
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You're welcome. If I'm ever out in AZ or you're in VA, I'll collect on that. Glad to hear the butane iron worked out. That's one tool I don't have in my arsenal yet.
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04-13-2014, 10:38 PM
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#25
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Rivet Master
1978 25' Tradewind
Metro Phoenix
, Arizona
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,524
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More progress this weekend!
So, the panels are on and so is the combiner/ circuit breaker/ relay box.
The first picture is bending the feet on the mounting legs out a few degrees to match the angle of the roof curve. This setup actually worked decently, much to my surprise.
I know that the 3M tape really will hold the panels on just fine. However, I decided against expert advice and went with the rivnuts.
The next shot is one of the 1/4-20 Stainless Steel rivnuts set in the roof sheet metal. Anyone familiar with those wonderful Harbor Freight tools will be shocked - I tell you, shocked!! - to hear that my HF rivnut setter struggled with these rivets. Struggled, in fact, to the point where I had to squeeze the rivet setter tool handle with a big pair of water pump pliers to get the rivets to seat properly. It did not, however, break in the process, amazingly enough.
The awning gave me the warm fuzzies about not letting the panel on that side slide off the roof. There is nothing on the street side, however, to prevent that panel from sliding off, and my paranoia took over and resulted in the strap to help out. Turns out it didn't even try to escape, but the strap did make me feel better.
The panels and the combiner box are mounted, and the interconnecting wires are run in the next shot. The wires will be covered with wire loom, which itself with be painted with clear Krylon Fusion for UV resistance. The combiner box is big, and it stands out too much painted all white like this. At least the sides will be repainted silver, in a probably vain attempt to get it to be less sore thumb conspicuous.
The absolute most frustrating part was the next step - running the two 4 ga wires down the refrigerator vent. I have no idea what's going on in there, but I'm surprised that any heat gets out. Seriously, this took me like an hour per wire. Just ridiculous, and I'm sure there's an easier way to do it. If you're trying this, just keep on trying, and about the time that you're seriously considering breaking out the sawzall to see what the heck is going on inside that vent, you'll finally get it.
Those wires are run, but they're just tied off up on the roof and coiled inside the fridge access.
My work schedule gives me Friday, Saturday and Sunday off next weekend, so I'm hoping to get it finished, except for maybe the additional battery box and battery.
__________________
"Between what matters and what seems to matter, how should the world we know judge wisely?" - E.C. Bentley, Trent's Last Case
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04-19-2014, 11:27 PM
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#26
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Rivet Master
1978 25' Tradewind
Metro Phoenix
, Arizona
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,524
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The denouement:
So, I got it about 98% done over Friday and Saturday.
I sprayed the wire looms with the Krylon Fusion Clear for the UV protection. (We'll see how well that worked a year from now!)
I ran the cables out through the bottom of the fridge and double-cable-tied them to the gas line. Then up into the Univolt box and finally connected to the charge controller.
Note that the cables are inside fuel hose to protect them from the sharp edges on the way up through the bottom of the coach. (That photo is upside down)
And now it's working!
PS: It does work better if you don't accidentally switch the panel leads. There's probably no need to discuss how I would know that.
__________________
"Between what matters and what seems to matter, how should the world we know judge wisely?" - E.C. Bentley, Trent's Last Case
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04-20-2014, 05:21 AM
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#27
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Rivet Master
1973 27' Overlander
Portsmouth
, Virginia
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 776
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Very cool. One thought, since it looks like the cables are running from the antenna back down to the rest, what about making a small removable aluminum panel to cover them from the direct UV? You might even be able to rivet some aluminum angle on the sides and then make a flat cover out of sheet aluminum held in with some stainless screws for access to the wiring.
BTW, how much do the panels output in direct sun?
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04-20-2014, 10:17 AM
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#28
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Rivet Master
1978 25' Tradewind
Metro Phoenix
, Arizona
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,524
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Of course, the first thing that happened to the panels was that we had one of our Arizona "rains" which means blowing dust followed by scattered drops half an inch apart, which coated the panels, and then we had some overcast yesterday (for which I was very thankful at the time), but I was like 150 Watts out of them both in parallel.
The series-parallel controller and the voltage tap readings aren't hooked up yet to see what difference the series configuration would make.
I like that I idea about aluminum channel to run the wires!!
__________________
"Between what matters and what seems to matter, how should the world we know judge wisely?" - E.C. Bentley, Trent's Last Case
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04-21-2014, 03:00 PM
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#29
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Rivet Master
1978 25' Tradewind
Metro Phoenix
, Arizona
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,524
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More pictures from my other phone - sorry!
The refrigerator vent has a sharp edged hole; clearly, running electrical wire over a sharp edge is a bad plan.
The first picture shows the raw materials: Some automobile fuel line, one 1/2" EMT elbow, and some silicone spray. I cut the elbow in half, which gave me about the right angle to start down the fridge vent.
The second picture shows the ends of the wire/hose/tubing assemblies as they head down the vent.
The final picture is the completed combiner box - except for the final exterior coat of silver paint.
__________________
"Between what matters and what seems to matter, how should the world we know judge wisely?" - E.C. Bentley, Trent's Last Case
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