Factory Installed Solar Charging System

[Glen Carter]

Originally Posted by gator.bigfoot

Do you have a link to the panels you're using? I'm interested in looking at these, as this is quite an unusual approach. Thanks.

Which panels? I don't have the new roof panels yet, possibly the Renogy 100W.

My portable are Lion
https://lionenergy.com/products/lion...4v-solar-panel

[mancillaj]

While our AS is parked in our driveway, I am having an issue with my solar, or the batteries, not sure which maintaining full charge.
2019 FC 23' FB
Not plugged into shore power.
Full sun for the last several days.
Main disconnect switch is turned off.
Everything is turned off and unplugged.
The battery reading is fluctuating between 80 to 95.
I checked to ensure the closet, compartment, stairs, and tank hookup lights are all off.
Should be no drain on the batteries, except for the gas detector.
I tested and I have 21.13 volts coming off the solar panel.
Any suggestions why the batteries are not reading 100%, which it does when we are plugged into shore power.

[JonDNC]

How many panels? What size?

[gator.bigfoot]

If you're using the sunexplorer as a means to determine your charge status you'll be disappointed as this is one of the least accurate ways of measuring that. It works as a volt meter and that's about it. I replaced my charger and am using a battery monitor to monitor the status of the batteries. The sun explorer was left in place only as a volt meter and so I don't have a dead piece of equipment in my panel. Other than that it's kinda useless.

[uncle_bob]

Hi

According to the readout, you have 1.1A coming out of the solar panels and going into the batteries. Unless you have something powered up in the trailer (fridge, lights ....) that should be more than enough to handle any loads.

As mentioned above, battery voltage is not a great way to work out how fully charged any battery is (lead acid or lithium). The 85 to 90 stuff is not telling you anything different than the 12.5 to 12.6V number. In reality they could be anywhere from 50% to 100% and be reading that way.

Simple check: plug into shore power and see if the batteries go above 13V. If not have them tested ...

Bob

[tjdonahoe]

I am installing 2 90 watt zamp obsidian panels..14” wide…some 50” long…using 3 m double sided tape and silk a flex…caulk..using preinstalled 10 gauge wires..along with an am solar combiner box..

[tjdonahoe]

Originally Posted by doglickfarms

I am remodeling a '72 Overlander. Are the solar panels something you can install yourself or does it need to be done at a dealer?

Am installing mine

[Ted299]

Originally Posted by AirstreamJim

Following up on this...I saw on a certain Facebook Airstream group that Atkinson has released a new solar controller that is a drop-in replacement for the controller in our Airstreams. Apparently it has appropriate charging regimens for the various different battery technologies (including Lithium). The web page for the device is at http://atkinsonelectronics.com/pvcm4...oint-tracking/.

Does anyone know anything about this? Given my desire to upgrade my solar configuration without having to rewire everything, if Atkinson’s claims are true, it seems this would be a very economical and easy upgrade for someone who isn’t hell-bent to have the best solar generation system in the RV world; I just want my batteries to recharge on those rare occasions when we’re not at a full hookup campground.

Thoughts?

Jim

I’m looking into this issue for myself right now. I can’t see any reason to go to the newer Atkinson controller unless you are also going to lithium batteries. Be aware that you can’t mix and match the controllers of different amperage with the displays. If you now have the 25 amp controller and display, you must get the new 25 amp controller. If you want to go to the 40 amp controller, you will also need the 40 amp display. The big drawback with Atkinson I can see is that they are PWM, which from what I have read here is inefficient compared to the MPPT controllers. Like 20% less. But I have not heard/read anyone say that the Atkinson is bad for the AGM Lifelines. If you still have the original Parallax ‘dumb’ converter, that is likely what cooked your batteries and you should definitely get the PD4655 in there to make the most of your new batteries. If you are going lithium, the drop-in converter is PD4655LIV (aka PD-4655VL at bestconverter).
This is where I am stuck, though. I picked up a pair of Lion group 24 lithium batteries at Costco for $690 each, which seems to be a good value. Now that I am into the weeds on charging solutions for these LiFePo batteries, though, the value proposition is diminishing with every little btw. Definitely need a new solar charge controller. Need to upgrade the converter, but wait, maybe it’s a good time to get away from the converter and install a dedicated ‘smart’ battery charger. And how do I protect my new tow rig from the potentially higher amp draw of lithium batteries when connected to the trailer? Need a charge relay or a DC-DC solution. How about a shunt to monitor SOC? You get the idea. So to install the lithium I need to throw in another $1000+ and a couple weekends for a proper charging system. That doesn’t even consider an upgrade to the measly 2x 52 watt AS factory solar panels (no shade on AS here, as that was probably respectable when my TT was built). Or I can drop in a new pair of Lifelines for $700 in an hour and go RVing for the next 250 weekends. Decisions, decisions.

[Ted299]

Originally Posted by Ted299

I’m looking into this issue for myself right now. I can’t see any reason to go to the newer Atkinson controller unless you are also going to lithium batteries. Be aware that you can’t mix and match the controllers of different amperage with the displays. If you now have the 25 amp controller and display, you must get the new 25 amp controller. If you want to go to the 40 amp controller, you will also need the 40 amp display. The big drawback with Atkinson I can see is that they are PWM, which from what I have read here is inefficient compared to the MPPT controllers. Like 20% less. But I have not heard/read anyone say that the Atkinson is bad for the AGM Lifelines. If you still have the original Parallax ‘dumb’ converter, that is likely what cooked your batteries and you should definitely get the PD4655 in there to make the most of your new batteries. If you are going lithium, the drop-in converter is PD4655LIV (aka PD-4655VL at bestconverter).
This is where I am stuck, though. I picked up a pair of Lion group 24 lithium batteries at Costco for $690 each, which seems to be a good value. Now that I am into the weeds on charging solutions for these LiFePo batteries, though, the value proposition is diminishing with every little btw. Definitely need a new solar charge controller. Need to upgrade the converter, but wait, maybe it’s a good time to get away from the converter and install a dedicated ‘smart’ battery charger. And how do I protect my new tow rig from the potentially higher amp draw of lithium batteries when connected to the trailer? Need a charge relay or a DC-DC solution. How about a shunt to monitor SOC? You get the idea. So to install the lithium I need to throw in another $1000+ and a couple weekends for a proper charging system. That doesn’t even consider an upgrade to the measly 2x 52 watt AS factory solar panels (no shade on AS here, as that was probably respectable when my TT was built). Or I can drop in a new pair of Lifelines for $700 in an hour and go RVing for the next 250 weekends. Decisions, decisions.

Let me add that if you are upgrading the converter, future proof your install by getting the lithium capable version. It’s not much more money and can still handle all the other standard chemistries.

[jeffmc306]

Originally Posted by mancillaj

While our AS is parked in our driveway, I am having an issue with my solar, or the batteries, not sure which maintaining full charge.
2019 FC 23' FB
Not plugged into shore power.
Full sun for the last several days.
Main disconnect switch is turned off.
Everything is turned off and unplugged.
The battery reading is fluctuating between 80 to 95.
I checked to ensure the closet, compartment, stairs, and tank hookup lights are all off.
Should be no drain on the batteries, except for the gas detector.
I tested and I have 21.13 volts coming off the solar panel.
Any suggestions why the batteries are not reading 100%, which it does when we are plugged into shore power.

mancillaj, our 2019 Globetrotter came with the same Atkinson solar controller. I too was disappointed with the performance and lack of useful information.

After talking with other forum members I replaced it with a Victron 100|30 SmartSolar controller and now get details like how much time the controller supplied bulk, absorption and float by each day via the Victron App. I also have the Victron battery monitor.

The Victron SmartSolar is a more efficient MPPT than the Atkinson too. It wasn’t a difficult installation either.

Hope that helps!

[Silvr_Bullet]

I have the older Explorer, when I upgraded to Lithiums, converter and solar charger the Victron Shunt was installed, the Explorer wasn’t removing, I didn’t want to have an empty spot on the wall, I could always install the Explorer II but I would only be duplicating some of the information on the Victron app that displays on my iPhone which gives more useful information.

[jeffmc306]

Silvr_Bullet, I found a way to cover the space where the old Sun Explorer display was mounted. I made a trim piece to hold the Victron BVM-712 display. I used the existing CAT5 cable and a short section of the RJ12 Victron cable.

Today, I’d buy the SmartShunt instead. It’s functional but I use the App instead.

[gator.bigfoot]

I just left the old Atkinson controller in place and just removed the solar input. By leaving the output connected it still shows the state of charge and you have a functioning volt meter. And no hole to fill. The state of charge was based on voltage so it was always a guess anyway so take it with a grain of salt.

[foobar]

Originally Posted by Ted299

I’m looking into this issue for myself right now. I can’t see any reason to go to the newer Atkinson controller unless you are also going to lithium batteries. Be aware that you can’t mix and match the controllers of different amperage with the displays. If you now have the 25 amp controller and display, you must get the new 25 amp controller. If you want to go to the 40 amp controller, you will also need the 40 amp display. The big drawback with Atkinson I can see is that they are PWM, which from what I have read here is inefficient compared to the MPPT controllers. Like 20% less. But I have not heard/read anyone say that the Atkinson is bad for the AGM Lifelines. If you still have the original Parallax ‘dumb’ converter, that is likely what cooked your batteries and you should definitely get the PD4655 in there to make the most of your new batteries. If you are going lithium, the drop-in converter is PD4655LIV (aka PD-4655VL at bestconverter).
This is where I am stuck, though. I picked up a pair of Lion group 24 lithium batteries at Costco for $690 each, which seems to be a good value. Now that I am into the weeds on charging solutions for these LiFePo batteries, though, the value proposition is diminishing with every little btw. Definitely need a new solar charge controller. Need to upgrade the converter, but wait, maybe it’s a good time to get away from the converter and install a dedicated ‘smart’ battery charger. And how do I protect my new tow rig from the potentially higher amp draw of lithium batteries when connected to the trailer? Need a charge relay or a DC-DC solution. How about a shunt to monitor SOC? You get the idea. So to install the lithium I need to throw in another $1000+ and a couple weekends for a proper charging system. That doesn’t even consider an upgrade to the measly 2x 52 watt AS factory solar panels (no shade on AS here, as that was probably respectable when my TT was built). Or I can drop in a new pair of Lifelines for $700 in an hour and go RVing for the next 250 weekends. Decisions, decisions.

Ted299, take a look at the Victron Orion Tr product line. These are DC-DC converters with built-in isolation that can allow the tow vehicle to charge the travel trailer lithium battery bank at higher voltage while preventing current from flowing in the reverse direction.

[Dave67]

Hi my name is David and I am helping my brother with his 2018 Flying Cloud 23 ft rear bed Airstream. I'm trying to replace the stock solar charge controller with a lithium aware Factory drop in. Both are made manufactured by Atkinson. The problem is I don't know where the solar charge controller is in his model. All of the videos online are for front bed models. Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance.

[olderyetwise]

I have a 2020 Bambi 19CB with a 90 roof panel, SunExplorer II controller and two AGM batteries. The Bambi came with a Zamp port on the tow hitch. I bought a Renogy 100W suitcase panel with Voyager 20A PWM Controller. I hooked the Renogy panel into the Zamp port (reversed polatiry per the forums).

I bought the portable panel for when we dry camp in the shade. I tried to mimic this scenario in my driveway, by covering the roof panel with a rug. I turned on the fridge, TV, lights and roof fans. Then I would plug and unplug the Renogy panel on the Sunexplorer to see if there were any changes. I fear that it can't detect any changes due to the add/remove of the Renogy, because they are not connect.

If this is the case, how can I detect whether the Renogy is helping (e.g., by extending battery life, or increasing charge) when I have two separate controllers?

[10Smiles]

I suspect that you do not notice a change because the batteries are pretty much charged up. Even if the batteries are not fully charged, there is only a few volts difference from the charge controller output and the batteries. The charge controller should tell you if it is charging the batteries.

[BogeyPro]

Hello, newbie here, but quickly learning.

I have two 90 watt solar panels, with the Victron MPPT 100/30 controller, all factory installed. I later installed the Bluetooth dongle so I can monitor from my phone.

I would like to know what is the expectation of wattage output this system should be producing, at high noon, on a cloudless sunny day, with no other electrical systems running, the master battery switch is off.

My assumption is that because I have two 90 watt panels, I should be getting 180 watts. Is that a valid assumption?

Thank you.

[Acheron2010]

Originally Posted by BogeyPro

Hello, newbie here, but quickly learning.

My assumption is that because I have two 90 watt panels, I should be getting 180 watts. Is that a valid assumption?

Thank you.

My best engineering estimate is, unless your trailer is tilted the exact number of degrees to allow the panels to receive the max sunlight for the exact time, day and location, you will get something less than 180 watts.

[SSquared]

Like Acheron said, you should get close to the rated wattage out of the panel under optimal conditions. You'll have some losses in the wires feeding the solar controller, and in the controller, so the usable wattage will be less than the output from the panels.

Keep in mind, you will only get as much power out as your trailer can use. If you have your battery charger turned off, and no other loads active, the solar controller will be putting out very little. To get max output, you need to turn on loads that exceed the output of your solar system.

There can actually be a case when your panels exceed their rated output. You want a cool, cloudy day (so the panels are cool--that increases their efficiency). Then you want the sun to peek through a hole, surrounded by white puffy clouds. The light reflected off the clouds adds to the direct sunlight, increasing the output by several per cent.